4 ms·

> The mathematical universe sidesteps this problem. If there is a concise and complete model of the universe, that is sufficient for it to exist. This then lea

> The mathematical universe sidesteps this problem. If there is a concise and complete model of the universe, that is sufficient for it to exist. This then leads to how does math exist instead of nothing? Math is a concept, and if concepts exist then that is not "nothing". Many people confuse "nothing" with the vacuum of space and particles appearing out of nowhere. In this case, we have something (space, vacuums, and particles), not nothing.

TchoBeer 5y ago
What would it look like for math to not exist?
- lorepieri 5y ago
  Does science fiction exists? Or Pokemon? In case your view is that they don't, you may argue similarly that math is a human made construct (which happen to work well to describe our universe, but it may be just survivorship bias as we use in physics only the math that works. For instance we discard imaginary solutions to classical motion equations). I do believe it is the right view, math is a man made "language" inspired by physics which is more fundamental.
  - TchoBeer 5y ago
    If that's your view that's fine, but it's not the view of GP.
    - lorepieri 5y ago
      I see good arguments for both views. A way to get insights could be discovering an alien civilization math.
vokep 5y ago
Because nothing is precisely what does exist. But nothing implies something, so my working theory is that nothing's implied opposite something is itself the first thing, then some cellular automata like progression results from similar logical self-reference and down the line our physics (and the entirety of every logical permutation of information n-dimensionally) results from that. A similar conception I've heard is that its like something and nothing, at the beginning of time, made a bet whether there'd be something or nothing, but the act of making the bet was already something, rigging it in something's favor. Nothing thought that was bullshit and tried to call it so, and they've been battling it out ever since.
- lewispollard 5y ago
  > But nothing implies something Put another way, nothing has absolutely no properties - including the property of being nothing, or empty. If an empty nothing lacks the property of being empty, or nothing, then something must arise.
- lorepieri 5y ago
  I'm working on writing a paper along those lines. I do believe that the answer to "why there is something rather than nothing?" may be: actually nothing is the only thing that exist, but its instability creates our apparent reality trough a self-referential observer-observed reality loop. I would love to chat, use my research email.
- EMM_386 5y ago
  > A similar conception I've heard is that its like something and nothing, at the beginning of time, made a bet whether there'd be something or nothing The problem is that nothing can't make bets.

TchoBeer 5y ago

What would it look like for math to not exist?

lorepieri 5y ago
Does science fiction exists? Or Pokemon? In case your view is that they don't, you may argue similarly that math is a human made construct (which happen to work well to describe our universe, but it may be just survivorship bias as we use in physics only the math that works. For instance we discard imaginary solutions to classical motion equations). I do believe it is the right view, math is a man made "language" inspired by physics which is more fundamental.
- TchoBeer 5y ago
  If that's your view that's fine, but it's not the view of GP.
  - lorepieri 5y ago
    I see good arguments for both views. A way to get insights could be discovering an alien civilization math.

vokep 5y ago

Because nothing is precisely what does exist. But nothing implies something, so my working theory is that nothing's implied opposite something is itself the first thing, then some cellular automata like progression results from similar logical self-reference and down the line our physics (and the entirety of every logical permutation of information n-dimensionally) results from that. A similar conception I've heard is that its like something and nothing, at the beginning of time, made a bet whether there'd be something or nothing, but the act of making the bet was already something, rigging it in something's favor. Nothing thought that was bullshit and tried to call it so, and they've been battling it out ever since.

lewispollard 5y ago
> But nothing implies something Put another way, nothing has absolutely no properties - including the property of being nothing, or empty. If an empty nothing lacks the property of being empty, or nothing, then something must arise.
lorepieri 5y ago
I'm working on writing a paper along those lines. I do believe that the answer to "why there is something rather than nothing?" may be: actually nothing is the only thing that exist, but its instability creates our apparent reality trough a self-referential observer-observed reality loop. I would love to chat, use my research email.
EMM_386 5y ago
> A similar conception I've heard is that its like something and nothing, at the beginning of time, made a bet whether there'd be something or nothing The problem is that nothing can't make bets.