4 ms·

I mean, this type of thinking was applied to the early internet as well. “No one will ever buy anything over the internet, people want stores!” The same lack

I mean, this type of thinking was applied to the early internet as well. “No one will ever buy anything over the internet, people want stores!” The same lack of imagination is leading to most of these takes.

paulryanrogers 5y ago
Except the fundamentals of the Internet were sound and scalable: near instant global communication and commerce. Cyroptocoin fundamentals don't offer much (any?) value over digitized fiat systems once externalities are considered.
- practice9 5y ago
  > Cyroptocoin fundamentals don't offer much (any?) value over digitized fiat systems once externalities are considered. If I'm not mistaken, Bitcoin whitepaper was originally about easy P2P payments. Bitcoin has not full-filled this vision yet, but the cryptosphere as a whole is working on this (if you ignore the hype and speculation). Visa/Mastercard, PayPal, banks can block or prohibit any kind of transactions if they wish so. Look up stories of sex workers, OnlyFans creators etc about being banned from using these traditional payments systems. Also look up fees that some banks charge for remittances - those range from 1.5 to 12% of the amount [1], depending where you're sending it. This does not include the cost of getting a bank account and a debit/credit card in those countries. Receiving a SWIFT transfer may be an issue if you don't have the necessary documents that explain why you have received the money. PayPal actually does not even support most of the worlds countries. If you're writing a book you want to sell online, but Paypal doesn't support your country - you will NOT be able to get the money out of the publishing platform (gumroad [2], if you need an example). People are excluded from the creator economy. Banks in developing countries use legal workarounds to get more fees from merchants using their systems or pay terminals. Merchants often have no choice but to raise prices, accept cash only or use some other kinds of P2P solutions. And don't get me started on the absolutely insane inheritance taxes in some countries - the state is effectively robbing people (and their descendants) after their death. [1] https://remittanceprices.worldbank.org/en https://remittanceprices.worldbank.org/en [2] https://help.gumroad.com/article/223-payoneer-and-gumroad https://help.gumroad.com/article/223-payoneer-and-gumroad
  - paulryanrogers 5y ago
    That's a good point about banks fleecing people for remittances. Still, that's a political problem which doesn't outweigh the downsides of DeFi today, IMO. Maybe you're correct that other coins will find a sweet spot. But I suspect the politics cannot be bypassed forever, no matter what the medium of exchange. > And don't get me started on the absolutely insane inheritance taxes in some countries - the state is effectively robbing people (and their descendants) after their death. There is a balance here too. When the wealthy can shop for tax and wealth havens until (almost) nothing is ever returned, they essentially rob the communities that supported and made them rich in the first place.

paulryanrogers 5y ago

Except the fundamentals of the Internet were sound and scalable: near instant global communication and commerce. Cyroptocoin fundamentals don't offer much (any?) value over digitized fiat systems once externalities are considered.

practice9 5y ago
> Cyroptocoin fundamentals don't offer much (any?) value over digitized fiat systems once externalities are considered. If I'm not mistaken, Bitcoin whitepaper was originally about easy P2P payments. Bitcoin has not full-filled this vision yet, but the cryptosphere as a whole is working on this (if you ignore the hype and speculation). Visa/Mastercard, PayPal, banks can block or prohibit any kind of transactions if they wish so. Look up stories of sex workers, OnlyFans creators etc about being banned from using these traditional payments systems. Also look up fees that some banks charge for remittances - those range from 1.5 to 12% of the amount [1], depending where you're sending it. This does not include the cost of getting a bank account and a debit/credit card in those countries. Receiving a SWIFT transfer may be an issue if you don't have the necessary documents that explain why you have received the money. PayPal actually does not even support most of the worlds countries. If you're writing a book you want to sell online, but Paypal doesn't support your country - you will NOT be able to get the money out of the publishing platform (gumroad [2], if you need an example). People are excluded from the creator economy. Banks in developing countries use legal workarounds to get more fees from merchants using their systems or pay terminals. Merchants often have no choice but to raise prices, accept cash only or use some other kinds of P2P solutions. And don't get me started on the absolutely insane inheritance taxes in some countries - the state is effectively robbing people (and their descendants) after their death. [1] https://remittanceprices.worldbank.org/en https://remittanceprices.worldbank.org/en [2] https://help.gumroad.com/article/223-payoneer-and-gumroad https://help.gumroad.com/article/223-payoneer-and-gumroad
- paulryanrogers 5y ago
  That's a good point about banks fleecing people for remittances. Still, that's a political problem which doesn't outweigh the downsides of DeFi today, IMO. Maybe you're correct that other coins will find a sweet spot. But I suspect the politics cannot be bypassed forever, no matter what the medium of exchange. > And don't get me started on the absolutely insane inheritance taxes in some countries - the state is effectively robbing people (and their descendants) after their death. There is a balance here too. When the wealthy can shop for tax and wealth havens until (almost) nothing is ever returned, they essentially rob the communities that supported and made them rich in the first place.