5 ms·

It just gets better and better. - ES makes BTC fiat - ES taps volcanoes to mine BTC What next? - ES uses natural wormholes to plot the future timeline and w

It just gets better and better. - ES makes BTC fiat - ES taps volcanoes to mine BTC What next? - ES uses natural wormholes to plot the future timeline and win Earth?

vidarh 5y ago
ES has not "made BTC fiat". It is making it legal tender. All that means is debts can be settled with BTC. As for "tapping volcanoes" it's a PR exercise - El Salvador is one of the countries in the world with largest geothermal generation capacity. "Tapping volcanoes" here in effect simply means mining bitcoin with part of their geothermal generating capacity. But "tapping volcanoes" got this a whole lot more attention than it otherwise would.
personlurking 5y ago
An attempt to answer your "what's next?" question: "What about you guys floating $1 billion in “Volcano Bonds” (backed by future #BTC mining output) for El Salvador to pay off the IMF loan - so they can tell the IMF to beat it." https://twitter.com/maxkeiser/status/1403023717429559299 https://twitter.com/maxkeiser/status/1403023717429559299
- gjulianm 5y ago
  It's a $1B loan to a country with a low debt rating. It's a risky investment already, and now you add Bitcoin with its price volatility? I don't know how that's a good idea from the investors point of view.
  - oogabooga123 5y ago
    I would buy some bonds just because of the idea that a nation could be free from international banking debt. Like a charitable donation, almost
    - gjulianm 5y ago
      Good luck getting $1B to El Salvador as "almost charitable donations". Not to mention the effect that trying to sell $1B-worth of Bitcoin could have on the market (even just a portion, Bitcoin is accepted nowhere for so they'd need real currency).
      - oogabooga123 5y ago
        I think the idea is that they would take funding in whatever currency they want, pay off the IMF with whatever currency they want, and then investors would get BTC, which is what they want. No need to sell $1bn worth of BTC.
        gjulianm 5y ago
        That'd solve the "selling Bitcoin" problem but not the one of managing the risk of a US$ loan that is paid back with Bitcoin. I mean, ES could pay you back in time without defaulting and you could find yourself losing quite a bit of money. I think people would be asking for far higher rates in that case.
  - PretzelPirate 5y ago
    The loan could be specified in BTC and not pegged to an exchange rate. Then as long as long as El Salvador kept mining they’d be able to pay it back with interest. I suspect many BTC holders would be happy to participate in that type of loan.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
jMyles 5y ago
> makes BTC fiat Did I miss a memo? Or is this a sort of Freduian slip wherein you said 'fiat' when you meant to say 'official'? It seems to me that we've been conditioned to conflate the two.
- oogabooga123 5y ago
  That’s what “fiat” means. Did you have a Freudian slip wherein you said “fiat” when you meant to say “debt based central bank monetary system”?
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - jMyles 5y ago
    From MW for 'fiat'[0]: > a command or act of will that creates something without or as if without further effort A fiat currency is one whose supply can be inflated by a command or act of will. The supply of Bitcoin cannot be inflated in this manner, so it's not a fiat currency. As properties, official and fiat are orthogonal. A currency can be one, or both, or neither. 0: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fiat https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fiat
    - dragonwriter 5y ago
      “Fiat money is government-issued currency that is not backed by a physical commodity, such as gold or silver, but rather by the government that issued it”. [0] (Commodity-representative/redeemable currencies cam be created at will, but are also not fiat money.) Bitcoin is not fiat money, but not for the reason you present, which tries to use a definition of fiat from outside of the specific context to create a new definition for it in this context, where it has a well-established definition. [0] https://www.investopedia.com/terms/f/fiatmoney.asp#:~:text=Fiat%20money%20is%20a%20government,U.S.%20dollar%2C%20are%20fiat%20currencies https://www.investopedia.com/terms/f/fiatmoney.asp#:~:text=F....
      - 5y ago
NovemberWhiskey 5y ago
A more historically supportable outcome would be a coup by a military junta and/or a civil war.

It just gets better and better. - ES makes BTC fiat - ES taps volcanoes to mine BTC What next? - ES uses natural wormholes to plot the future timeline and win Earth?

vidarh 5y ago

ES has not "made BTC fiat". It is making it legal tender. All that means is debts can be settled with BTC. As for "tapping volcanoes" it's a PR exercise - El Salvador is one of the countries in the world with largest geothermal generation capacity. "Tapping volcanoes" here in effect simply means mining bitcoin with part of their geothermal generating capacity. But "tapping volcanoes" got this a whole lot more attention than it otherwise would.

personlurking 5y ago

An attempt to answer your "what's next?" question: "What about you guys floating $1 billion in “Volcano Bonds” (backed by future #BTC mining output) for El Salvador to pay off the IMF loan - so they can tell the IMF to beat it." https://twitter.com/maxkeiser/status/1403023717429559299 https://twitter.com/maxkeiser/status/1403023717429559299

gjulianm 5y ago
It's a $1B loan to a country with a low debt rating. It's a risky investment already, and now you add Bitcoin with its price volatility? I don't know how that's a good idea from the investors point of view.
- oogabooga123 5y ago
  I would buy some bonds just because of the idea that a nation could be free from international banking debt. Like a charitable donation, almost
  - gjulianm 5y ago
    Good luck getting $1B to El Salvador as "almost charitable donations". Not to mention the effect that trying to sell $1B-worth of Bitcoin could have on the market (even just a portion, Bitcoin is accepted nowhere for so they'd need real currency).
    - oogabooga123 5y ago
      I think the idea is that they would take funding in whatever currency they want, pay off the IMF with whatever currency they want, and then investors would get BTC, which is what they want. No need to sell $1bn worth of BTC.
      - gjulianm 5y ago
        That'd solve the "selling Bitcoin" problem but not the one of managing the risk of a US$ loan that is paid back with Bitcoin. I mean, ES could pay you back in time without defaulting and you could find yourself losing quite a bit of money. I think people would be asking for far higher rates in that case.
- PretzelPirate 5y ago
  The loan could be specified in BTC and not pegged to an exchange rate. Then as long as long as El Salvador kept mining they’d be able to pay it back with interest. I suspect many BTC holders would be happy to participate in that type of loan.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

jMyles 5y ago

> makes BTC fiat Did I miss a memo? Or is this a sort of Freduian slip wherein you said 'fiat' when you meant to say 'official'? It seems to me that we've been conditioned to conflate the two.

oogabooga123 5y ago
That’s what “fiat” means. Did you have a Freudian slip wherein you said “fiat” when you meant to say “debt based central bank monetary system”?
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- jMyles 5y ago
  From MW for 'fiat'[0]: > a command or act of will that creates something without or as if without further effort A fiat currency is one whose supply can be inflated by a command or act of will. The supply of Bitcoin cannot be inflated in this manner, so it's not a fiat currency. As properties, official and fiat are orthogonal. A currency can be one, or both, or neither. 0: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fiat https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fiat
  - dragonwriter 5y ago
    “Fiat money is government-issued currency that is not backed by a physical commodity, such as gold or silver, but rather by the government that issued it”. [0] (Commodity-representative/redeemable currencies cam be created at will, but are also not fiat money.) Bitcoin is not fiat money, but not for the reason you present, which tries to use a definition of fiat from outside of the specific context to create a new definition for it in this context, where it has a well-established definition. [0] https://www.investopedia.com/terms/f/fiatmoney.asp#:~:text=Fiat%20money%20is%20a%20government,U.S.%20dollar%2C%20are%20fiat%20currencies https://www.investopedia.com/terms/f/fiatmoney.asp#:~:text=F....
    - 5y ago

NovemberWhiskey 5y ago

A more historically supportable outcome would be a coup by a military junta and/or a civil war.