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> I’m also wondering why the hackers didn’t request payment in a currency that’s more difficult to trace. Because they need to cash out somehow? Being crypto-c

by lottin 5y ago

> I’m also wondering why the hackers didn’t request payment in a currency that’s more difficult to trace. Because they need to cash out somehow? Being crypto-currency rich doesn't mean much if you're unable to exchange the crypto-currency for real money.

vmception 5y ago
No not really People are content with crypto They can invest, buy computer games, hardware and acquire general goods and services There is no “I want to buy this flashy house/yacht how do I get crypto out” Its easy to launder and easy to use without doing so, but also easy to launder whenever they get around to it These guys didnt
- lottin 5y ago
  In the real world? No, you can't buy a house or a yacht with crypto. You can't even buy groceries or pay at a restaurant or at a petrol station.
  - vmception 5y ago
    I’m saying two things: 1) These arent problems for ransomware hackers because they arent goals for ransomware hackers 2) even if these were goals for ransomware hackers these aren't problems either It requires a special hubris to really think people that earn crypto want fiat. Just like people assume people that use Monero want clean bitcoin, its an absurdity that doesnt even consider that many just want and keep Monero. Its the same for fiat. You would be more interested in discussing number 2 because I still say converting illicit funds to fiat isnt an unsolved or even difficult problem. But its so low on the list of priorities for this user story that its not really worth splitting hairs over. Ransomware hackers dont have an issue exchanging time for food and shelter, they are able to just accumulate and play in the crypto ecosystem which is what they really want to do already, with more. To many, its like someone stealing gold bars. Sure you go melt down an ingot or two eventually, but you’re really just hoarding the gold the sake of hoarding the gold. Crypto has the additional benefit of being internationally liquid for other digital assets and digital services instantly.
    - lottin 5y ago
      Right, this makes a lot sense.
    - captn3m0 5y ago
      But this won’t be a 100% closed ecosystem still right? You pay rent to your landlord in crypto, and they pay their employee in crypto, but somewhere there will be someone exchanging it for Fiat down the chain. And that’s invisible risk (unlike say, transacting in cash with your landlord knowing it can’t be traced).
      - vmception 5y ago
        Then launder all your crypto because you dont know if someone thinks you are a hacker from 20 transactions ago trying to cash out This of course makes your legal actions indistinguishable from hackers laundering their own crypto, shifting the methods away from probable cause to completely benign

by lottin 5y ago

vmception 5y ago

No not really People are content with crypto They can invest, buy computer games, hardware and acquire general goods and services There is no “I want to buy this flashy house/yacht how do I get crypto out” Its easy to launder and easy to use without doing so, but also easy to launder whenever they get around to it These guys didnt

lottin 5y ago
In the real world? No, you can't buy a house or a yacht with crypto. You can't even buy groceries or pay at a restaurant or at a petrol station.
- vmception 5y ago
  I’m saying two things: 1) These arent problems for ransomware hackers because they arent goals for ransomware hackers 2) even if these were goals for ransomware hackers these aren't problems either It requires a special hubris to really think people that earn crypto want fiat. Just like people assume people that use Monero want clean bitcoin, its an absurdity that doesnt even consider that many just want and keep Monero. Its the same for fiat. You would be more interested in discussing number 2 because I still say converting illicit funds to fiat isnt an unsolved or even difficult problem. But its so low on the list of priorities for this user story that its not really worth splitting hairs over. Ransomware hackers dont have an issue exchanging time for food and shelter, they are able to just accumulate and play in the crypto ecosystem which is what they really want to do already, with more. To many, its like someone stealing gold bars. Sure you go melt down an ingot or two eventually, but you’re really just hoarding the gold the sake of hoarding the gold. Crypto has the additional benefit of being internationally liquid for other digital assets and digital services instantly.
  - lottin 5y ago
    Right, this makes a lot sense.
  - captn3m0 5y ago
    But this won’t be a 100% closed ecosystem still right? You pay rent to your landlord in crypto, and they pay their employee in crypto, but somewhere there will be someone exchanging it for Fiat down the chain. And that’s invisible risk (unlike say, transacting in cash with your landlord knowing it can’t be traced).
    - vmception 5y ago
      Then launder all your crypto because you dont know if someone thinks you are a hacker from 20 transactions ago trying to cash out This of course makes your legal actions indistinguishable from hackers laundering their own crypto, shifting the methods away from probable cause to completely benign