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Full disclosure: I work in healthcare pricing, so I have some first hand insight into all of this > Fact is Americans have high personal cost and risk exposure
by bhupy 5y ago
Full disclosure: I work in healthcare pricing, so I have some first hand insight into all of this
> Fact is Americans have high personal cost and risk exposure relative to nearly all of the rest of the world.
This is only true for some Americans, and increasingly very few. I actually found this tweet by a health policy expert to perfectly capture the status quo: https://twitter.com/CPopeHC/status/1234510323425652737 https://twitter.com/CPopeHC/status/1234510323425652737
"American healthcare in short:
~60% (in good employer plans, generous state Medicaid, or M.Adv/Medigap) have the best healthcare in the world.
~30% have insurance with gaps/risk of big bills.
~10% uninsured must rely on uncompensated care, go without treatment, or risk bankruptcy
The strength of M4A proposals is that they begin with an understanding that the 40% exist and need things fixed.
Their weakness is that they pretend that the 60% don't, and threaten to take away what they have."
The fact of the matter is that the majority of Americans have excellent, world class health coverage. The problem is that there exists a small percentage of Americans that are totally screwed, and this is a higher percentage than most other comparable countries. There are a couple reasons why, which brings me to...
> Second, our system has making money as the priority, again in contrast to much of the world.
First of all, this is false insofar as not all health insurance in America is for-profit. Blue Cross Blue Shield, for example, are predominately 501 non-profits (with a few notable exceptions).
Second of all, while you're right that much of the world has public insurance companies that don't seek to "make money", there are a number of countries with world class healthcare that do have profit seeking insurance, many of them with purely private profit driven insurance companies: including Switzerland and the Netherlands. Some have a hybrid of public/private, including Germany (public/private mix), Singapore (public/private mix), etc. In fact, while many countries have a public insurance system, it is extraordinarily rare for countries to outright ban private insurance options.
Third of all, in America, health insurance is one of the most regulated industries in the country. After ACA was passed, there's a strict cap on profit margins that health insurers can enjoy. It's not too dissimilar from how private health insurance is regulated in Switzerland and the Netherlands, both of which have some of the best healthcare on the planet.
> Finally, most of the world recognizes the inherent conflict of interest between for profit and sick/hurt people and both regulate that conflict to marginalize it, and make it so people have options that make sense.
Again, as I mentioned above, this is not only not true, it's debatable if such an "inherent" conflict of interest even exists. By this logic, there should be an inherent conflict of interest between for profit food providers and "hungry/starving" people. The profit motive alone can't explain America's health outcomes, because there exists countries with fantastic healthcare systems (Switzerland, Netherlands) which are driven purely by private health insurance.
America actually has a pretty good apples-to-apples experiment of "profit seeking" vs "not profit seeking" insurance, ironically in Medicare Advantage. When you turn 65, you have the option to enroll either in "Original Medicare", which is what we usually think of when we talk about "single payer healthcare in America", or you can enroll in Medicare Advantage (aka Medicare "Part C"), where the premiums that would go to the CMS instead go to private insurers like Humana, United, Oscar Health, Aetna, Clover, etc. These plans replace Original Medicare, also cover Part D prescription drug benefits, and often include supplemental benefits that Original Medicare doesn't already cover. There are some interesting findings so far:
- 39% of Medicare beneficiaries are on private Medicare Advantage plans instead of the public "Original Medicare". Because everyone is entitled to "Original Medicare", this is purely voluntary. This number has been growing so rapidly, that we expect by 2025, more seniors to be on a private plan than the public one. There's also great variance by State. In Florida, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Michigan, Minnesota, Oregon, Alabama, Hawaii, and Connecticut — nearly 50% of beneficiaries are on Medicare Advantage. By 2022, we expect more seniors in those States to be on a private plan than a public one. https://www.kff.org/medicare/issue-brief/a-dozen-facts-about https://www.kff.org/medicare/issue-brief/a-dozen-facts-about...
- For most beneficiaries, Medicare Advantage costs about 39% less than Original Medicare. https://www.kff.org/medicare/issue-brief/a-dozen-facts-about-medicare-advantage-in-2020/ https://www.kff.org/medicare/issue-brief/a-dozen-facts-about...
- Medicare Advantage plans are, on average, of higher quality than the public Original Medicare. https://healthpayerintelligence.com/news/medicare-advantage-costs-40-less-than-fee-for-service-medicare https://healthpayerintelligence.com/news/medicare-advantage-...
- In Urban areas, Medicare Advantage costs less per capita to administer than Medicare — and that's not including the extra Medicare Part D insurance that you would have to buy if you're on the Original Medicare plan. https://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2016/jan/does-medicare-advantage-cost-less-traditional-medicare https://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2...
So the reality is really more complicated than you're making it out to be.
From where I sit, the one thing that sets apart America from the rest of the world is not that health insurance can be profit driven (so do the Swiss and the Dutch, for example), it's that health insurance is coupled with employment. There's really no other peer nation for which this is the case, and a lot of the economics of health insurance look the way that they do because big employers buy most of the health insurance in today's market, and that has resulted in market distortions that hurt those that are unemployed. What we're seeing in healthcare costs is analogous to what you might see happen to airline ticket costs if we all got our air tickets through our employers: the vast majority of us would fly business class, while the unemployed would be simply unable to pay for business class fares out of pocket. Employers (especially medium-to-large businesses) have a much higher purchasing power (and hence, willingness to pay) than individuals.
- disabled 5y ago> The fact of the matter is that the majority of Americans have excellent, world class health coverage. The problem is that there exists a small percentage of Americans that are totally screwed, and this is a higher percentage than most other comparable countries. There are a couple reasons why, which brings me to... Really? That is news to me, as a dual US|EU (Croatian) citizen, who is culturally American--but currently living in Croatia. Even Croatia has a higher life expectancy than the United States. Yep, even those "eastern European countries" (that are within the European Union) that Americans refer to with derision, often have higher life expectancy than the United States. See: https://www.reddit.com/r/croatia/comments/nuiyk1/hrvatska_spada_u_blok_visokorazvijenih_zemalja/ https://www.reddit.com/r/croatia/comments/nuiyk1/hrvatska_sp... Also, just in case you want to blame this on "lifestyle factors" (which means that this is a public health matter, which the United States has severely underfunded--locally, state, and nationally for more than a few decades now), the third leading cause of death is believed to be preventable medical errors. (The source I provide has been verified by several follow-up studies.) See: https://www.bmj.com/content/353/bmj.i2139/rapid-responses https://www.bmj.com/content/353/bmj.i2139/rapid-responses Also, you don't know what you are talking about here. I have studied healthcare systems worldwide for hundreds of hours. Ironically the IMHE group that does the coronavirus projections is world renowned at producing this data. All of this data is open-access. For starters (easy reading) this article is relevant: http://www.healthdata.org/news-release/how-healthy-will-we-be-2040 http://www.healthdata.org/news-release/how-healthy-will-we-b... But, seriously, we have far from the best healthcare system in the world. That is not even remotely true. There are several countries where a woman can give birth and is less likely to die, compared to the US. I wish you were joking.
- bhupy 5y ago> Really? That is news to me, as a dual US|EU (Croatian) citizen, who is culturally American--but currently living in Croatia. Yes, and just like that health policy analyst, I can attest to it. I've read more than enough plan documents, and work with health actuaries every day. > Also, just in case you want to blame this on "lifestyle factors" (which means that this is a public health matter, which the United States has severely underfunded--locally, state, and nationally for more than a few decades now), the third leading cause of death is believed to be preventable medical errors. (The source I provide has been verified by several follow-up studies.) Actually, there's a fantastic analysis that addresses this point head on, even analyzing the IHME data: https://randomcriticalanalysis.com/2017/05/16/the-explanatory-power-of-drugs-car-accidents-and-homicides-on-us-life-expectancy-gaps/ https://randomcriticalanalysis.com/2017/05/16/the-explanator... The vast majority of the variance in average life expectancy is attributable to lifestyle factors. As long as you stay away from drugs, you don't participate in a gang, or you take the bus (or any public transit), you're on roughly equal footing with the rest of the OECD. "The data suggests motor vehicle accidents, homicides, and drug overdose deaths can explain a large fraction of the US life expectancy gap as compared to several highly developed countries. Obviously this does not account for obesity, diabetes, (historical) smoking, and related lifestyle differences that are likely to have a pronounced negative affects on US life expectancy as compared to most other developed countries and which statistically explains the vast majority of the very large spatial differences in the United States." > Also, you don't know what you are talking about here. I have studied healthcare systems worldwide for hundreds of hours. Um, so have I. I literally work on health pricing systems, and have studied health policy. "For hundreds of hours" even, for whatever that's worth (not a lot, I assure you). > But, seriously, we have far from the best healthcare system in the world. That is not even remotely true. There are several countries where a woman can give birth and is less likely to die, compared to the US. I don't think I ever said that we have the best healthcare in the world. I agree that US healthcare is broken. All I'm pointing out to you is that the "profit motive" has nothing to do with that, as evidenced by counterfactuals in Switerland, Singapore, and the Netherlands; the former two of which actually have the best healthcare in the world. https://www.rd.com/article/switzerland-worlds-best-healthcare-system/ https://www.rd.com/article/switzerland-worlds-best-healthcar... https://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2011/04/29/why-switzerland-has-the-worlds-best-health-care-system/?sh=455921447d74 https://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2011/04/29/why-sw... https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/infographics/most-efficient-health-care-around-the-world.html https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/infographics/most-efficie... In my opinion, the profit motive has nothing to do with America's healthcare ills (no pun intended). It's the fact that it's tied to employment and purchased by employers. No other country is set up that way.