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Electron is Flash for the Desktop. https://josephg.com/blog/electron-is-flash-for-the-desktop/ https://josephg.com/blog/electron-is-flash-for-the-desktop/ Whi

Electron is Flash for the Desktop. https://josephg.com/blog/electron-is-flash-for-the-desktop/ https://josephg.com/blog/electron-is-flash-for-the-desktop/ While I don't appreciate most of Apples business strategies, I have to admit that Steve Jobs was right about banning Flash. It was eating the battery runtime of MacBooks. And Steve Jobs would have banned[1] Electron probably already years ago, because it is consuming so much memory. But especially so many big tech companies use Electron? The UI is non native, the JavaScript doesn't offer best performance, the binaries are big and the memory consumption is high. First, because some companies we're in need for a replacement of Flash[2]. Second, web developers are cheap. Third, it reduces time to market. Especially the big tech companies are "monopoly mode" - gather quicker more users than others and dominate. Who pays? You, at least three times: * Bad usability, slow execution and awkward UI * Hardware requirements. You have to buy more RAM. In case of most laptops with soldered RAM you have to buy new laptops. * Either they take or data or your license fees I don't claim that platform native developers will code more efficient but developers who can code in C, C++, Rust or even Python can provide you with fast, small and slick applications where you don't have to wait until some JS loads the textblock for some placeholder while your scrolling - their applications aren't even faster necessarily. Likely these developers keep their data locally, update this data when appropriate (keyboard, file or network) and don't launch an entire web-browser. I recommend providing a base foundation and using a native toolkit of the platform, either Gtk or Qt[3]. This is not a new recommendation, the issue is that the industry prefers to ignores well known, recommend practices. Now. Microsoft Teams? + Available on Linux + Quick and easy installation via Flatpak o You can spend a lot of money for integrations - Quoting is not possible on desktop - Slow startup - Fullscreen hidden instead of using "l" or "F11" keys - Notifications Management is a maze of options [1] Not fully correct. Electron is forbidden on iOS because it is a full blown webbrowser. Maybe also for less well meant reasons. [2] History repeats. They refuse to learn? [3] Actually Google did that. Chrome used on Linux Gtk, on MacOS it used Quartz and on Windows some layer to Win32. It was a fast and lean and the UI was native.

LandR 5y ago
Tried teams on Linux. Its terrible, my machine runs solidly, hardly ever restart it. I open teams, 80% of the time it will start up then the machine starts running slow, teams ui goes unresponsive and then whole machine locks up and i need to power off at the powee button. Only ever happens if I open teams.
nix23 5y ago
It's really like Groundhog Day, for those who are to young, we had Java-Apps (terrible slow in the early days), then massive web-apps and now electron, in the mean time every professional application stayed at TUI's (banks/insurance/booking-systems), it's the same with os-installers...do i really need a flutter based installer? No it's bullshit, just give me a well structured text installer, no gui needed for that job. Why is the Terminal still a thing when browsers are so much better at everything ;)
- ho_schi 5y ago
  TUIs are wonderful. They are easy to grasp, fast and restrict requirements, everyone involved must think about the workflow and efficient usage. Input is focused entirely on the keyboard. Linux overs some modern TUIs e.g. installer, apt-stuff or the kernel config aside from that: https://invisible-island.net/ncurses/ https://invisible-island.net/ncurses/ // classic https://github.com/willmcgugan/rich https://github.com/willmcgugan/rich // blingbling https://github.com/dankamongmen/notcurses https://github.com/dankamongmen/notcurses // hacker For the old stuff I recommend looking close at airports, savings-banks or part-dealers. When it is influenced by mainframes you will notice likely forwards/backwards is done by F7/F8. How do you depict an plane with seats in TUI? I assume an array, 80 rows and 10 columns ;) I'm impressed how flawless elderly co-workers work with TUIs. They read the screen, think and type and the work is done. I guess the straight workflow, clean user-interface and similarities to paper forms improve usability. I guess modal dialogs, popup warnings, status icons, right click and the modern long press are not an improvement in usability. And the many tiny icons and bars in modern text processors aren't a help either. I think we can learn a lot more from old programmers.
  - nix23 5y ago
    >I assume an array, 80 rows and 10 columns No you just need front, middle, back, window, handicap? and how many seats next to each other for your travel buddy's. That's the cool thing, no need to use your mouse, no need to show more information than needed for the job.
Telemakhos 5y ago
I would much rather have a native (and M1 ready) client for Teams and Discord than the Electron apps. Electron is good for end users via Nativefier, though. I can pop together a sandboxed app, invokable like any other program on my computer, for work-related sites that I want absolutely segregated from my daily browsing habits (and thus political, religious, and personal opinions).

LandR 5y ago

Tried teams on Linux. Its terrible, my machine runs solidly, hardly ever restart it. I open teams, 80% of the time it will start up then the machine starts running slow, teams ui goes unresponsive and then whole machine locks up and i need to power off at the powee button. Only ever happens if I open teams.

nix23 5y ago

It's really like Groundhog Day, for those who are to young, we had Java-Apps (terrible slow in the early days), then massive web-apps and now electron, in the mean time every professional application stayed at TUI's (banks/insurance/booking-systems), it's the same with os-installers...do i really need a flutter based installer? No it's bullshit, just give me a well structured text installer, no gui needed for that job. Why is the Terminal still a thing when browsers are so much better at everything ;)

ho_schi 5y ago
TUIs are wonderful. They are easy to grasp, fast and restrict requirements, everyone involved must think about the workflow and efficient usage. Input is focused entirely on the keyboard. Linux overs some modern TUIs e.g. installer, apt-stuff or the kernel config aside from that: https://invisible-island.net/ncurses/ https://invisible-island.net/ncurses/ // classic https://github.com/willmcgugan/rich https://github.com/willmcgugan/rich // blingbling https://github.com/dankamongmen/notcurses https://github.com/dankamongmen/notcurses // hacker For the old stuff I recommend looking close at airports, savings-banks or part-dealers. When it is influenced by mainframes you will notice likely forwards/backwards is done by F7/F8. How do you depict an plane with seats in TUI? I assume an array, 80 rows and 10 columns ;) I'm impressed how flawless elderly co-workers work with TUIs. They read the screen, think and type and the work is done. I guess the straight workflow, clean user-interface and similarities to paper forms improve usability. I guess modal dialogs, popup warnings, status icons, right click and the modern long press are not an improvement in usability. And the many tiny icons and bars in modern text processors aren't a help either. I think we can learn a lot more from old programmers.
- nix23 5y ago
  >I assume an array, 80 rows and 10 columns No you just need front, middle, back, window, handicap? and how many seats next to each other for your travel buddy's. That's the cool thing, no need to use your mouse, no need to show more information than needed for the job.

Telemakhos 5y ago

I would much rather have a native (and M1 ready) client for Teams and Discord than the Electron apps. Electron is good for end users via Nativefier, though. I can pop together a sandboxed app, invokable like any other program on my computer, for work-related sites that I want absolutely segregated from my daily browsing habits (and thus political, religious, and personal opinions).