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I very strongly disagree. No one is asking their companies to stand up for trade policy or any wonky stuff outside their business. It's almost entirely about re

by tootie 5y ago

I very strongly disagree. No one is asking their companies to stand up for trade policy or any wonky stuff outside their business. It's almost entirely about representation and discrimination. Things are part of everyone's everyday lives and things very much in every company's power to resolve. I think the notion that companies should only care about their bottom line is the thing that needs to end. Returning profits for shareholders isn't enough. Employees have started to think that who they work for should reflect their values. And why not?

insert_coin 5y ago
> Employees have started to think that who they work for should reflect their values. And why not? Then this is perfect, they can leave and find a job that does reflect their values. They should've quitted right when they realized their values weren't aligned but I guess they valued a severance package more. Still, win-win.
joegahona 5y ago
> Employees have started to think that who they work for should reflect their values. And why not? Because employees don’t all have the same values.
- tootie 5y ago
  Maybe because it's not allowed to be discussed openly. My company has absolutely let rip on political discussions and it's been pretty healthy. Nobody doesn't want diversity. It's purely a question of what we do about it.
  - nathanaldensr 5y ago
    > Nobody doesn't want diversity. How do you know? Do you think everyone is being honest with you when they appear to state their opinions, knowing that saying the wrong thing could get them canceled? Are you naive enough to believe all humans are truthful?
    - tootie 5y ago
      Doesn't really matter does it? You can liken it to a Turing Test. If you can convince a naïve observer your not racist or even that you are anti-racist, then you are. Maybe you're faking. Maybe you're a lifelike android. The world still ends up a better place.
dannyw 5y ago
It's false equivalence to say that just because someone wants identity politics out of work, they also are against representation and discrimination. Someone may support active efforts to address inequality in the workplace (eg better interviewing procedures, bias training, inclusive language in products), but be against anything that's political, such as supporting black lives matter or taking a position on middle east conflicts at work. It doesn't mean they disagree with the latter. They just want it out of work, they might even support it.
- tootie 5y ago
  I don't think identity politics is really the problem. That's not synonymous with wanting representation. And BLM isn't political. It's just acknowledging that black lives matter. It becomes political when a political party makes a point of not refusing to say it.
  - LegitShady 5y ago
    I've read their platform and I disagree.
    - tootie 5y ago
      They don't have a platform besides what's in the name. Any website with a formal agenda isn't "official" in any sense nor have 99% of people marching for justice read whatever you read. It's just black lives matter. And people engineering reasons to avoid saying it without explicitly saying black lives don't matter.
      - LegitShady 5y ago
        You have it exactly backwards - I believe black live matter, but I don't believe in the organization BLM and they do have an an organization and an agenda. It's a kafka trap to name your organization with political goals some obviously positive name, and then declare anyone who does not support your organizations methods or particulars of its agenda as a hater of that positive name. It's so transparent we're just in an age where being honest is rare, and people will convince themselves obviously untrue things - 'they don't have a platform' but they removed their 'what we believe page' including being against the nuclear family https://nypost.com/2020/09/24/blm-removes-website-language-blasting-nuclear-family-structure/ https://nypost.com/2020/09/24/blm-removes-website-language-b... . It's a weird sort of denial of reality to just insist things don't exist, like an organization (which BLM is) with a formal agenda (which BLM has, even if they tried to obfuscate after being criticized for it's more radical and harmful ideas).

by tootie 5y ago

insert_coin 5y ago

> Employees have started to think that who they work for should reflect their values. And why not? Then this is perfect, they can leave and find a job that does reflect their values. They should've quitted right when they realized their values weren't aligned but I guess they valued a severance package more. Still, win-win.

joegahona 5y ago

> Employees have started to think that who they work for should reflect their values. And why not? Because employees don’t all have the same values.

tootie 5y ago
Maybe because it's not allowed to be discussed openly. My company has absolutely let rip on political discussions and it's been pretty healthy. Nobody doesn't want diversity. It's purely a question of what we do about it.
- nathanaldensr 5y ago
  > Nobody doesn't want diversity. How do you know? Do you think everyone is being honest with you when they appear to state their opinions, knowing that saying the wrong thing could get them canceled? Are you naive enough to believe all humans are truthful?
  - tootie 5y ago
    Doesn't really matter does it? You can liken it to a Turing Test. If you can convince a naïve observer your not racist or even that you are anti-racist, then you are. Maybe you're faking. Maybe you're a lifelike android. The world still ends up a better place.

dannyw 5y ago

It's false equivalence to say that just because someone wants identity politics out of work, they also are against representation and discrimination. Someone may support active efforts to address inequality in the workplace (eg better interviewing procedures, bias training, inclusive language in products), but be against anything that's political, such as supporting black lives matter or taking a position on middle east conflicts at work. It doesn't mean they disagree with the latter. They just want it out of work, they might even support it.

tootie 5y ago
I don't think identity politics is really the problem. That's not synonymous with wanting representation. And BLM isn't political. It's just acknowledging that black lives matter. It becomes political when a political party makes a point of not refusing to say it.
- LegitShady 5y ago
  I've read their platform and I disagree.
  - tootie 5y ago
    They don't have a platform besides what's in the name. Any website with a formal agenda isn't "official" in any sense nor have 99% of people marching for justice read whatever you read. It's just black lives matter. And people engineering reasons to avoid saying it without explicitly saying black lives don't matter.
    - LegitShady 5y ago
      You have it exactly backwards - I believe black live matter, but I don't believe in the organization BLM and they do have an an organization and an agenda. It's a kafka trap to name your organization with political goals some obviously positive name, and then declare anyone who does not support your organizations methods or particulars of its agenda as a hater of that positive name. It's so transparent we're just in an age where being honest is rare, and people will convince themselves obviously untrue things - 'they don't have a platform' but they removed their 'what we believe page' including being against the nuclear family https://nypost.com/2020/09/24/blm-removes-website-language-blasting-nuclear-family-structure/ https://nypost.com/2020/09/24/blm-removes-website-language-b... . It's a weird sort of denial of reality to just insist things don't exist, like an organization (which BLM is) with a formal agenda (which BLM has, even if they tried to obfuscate after being criticized for it's more radical and harmful ideas).