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The Wuhan Lab Leak Hypothesis Is a Conspiracy Theory, Not Science

13 points by johncena33 5y ago

mam3 5y ago
Im dont even get the debate. Theres a lab studying and experimenting on sars viruses so OF COURSE there COULD be a leak. Still its a GOOD thing to have labs studying it. Accidents happen its a fact of life so a leak (or even a ramdom mutation) was always a matter of when not if. Playing the blaming game is not going to change anything. And actually if anything to blame, we should blame politicians who didnt listen to people like Bill Gates when he said this exact kind of viruses coul make milions of death and that we should prepare for it three years ago. But still.. humans always react, not proact, its another fact of life that no amount of internet outrage will change. In the end the virus will make our society stronger to thkd kind of threat.. But then when will be the turning point for the climate ?
- phenkdo 5y ago
  > Im dont even get the debate. There's trillions of dollars of potential damages at stake. Even if this was a Chernobyl type disaster due to mismanagement and negligence, the CCP will be on the hook, and they are all too aware of it. IMHO this debate is healthy & necessary.
  - dazsnow 5y ago
    What outcomes are you expecting? The CCP are going to accept blame on behalf of some lab technicians and pay the world trillions in compensation?
  - mam3 5y ago
    Yeah you think the CCP is going to pay anything even if its their fault ? Thats a whole other level of delusion
    - smaryjerry 5y ago
      On the international scale almost all things happen by force. They wouldn’t pay anything voluntarily but getting the world united against you means tariffs, limits on exports, etc. it doesn't help that they are already known to lie even to their own people on things like pollution or imprison dissidents.
  - jacknews 5y ago
    But the actual origin is not necessarily the most important point. I think there's already some evidence that China acted, at best, negligently, and at worst, nefariously, in the early days of covid, wrt disclosure, alerting the world, etc. For example, why did they still allow international fligths out of Wuhan even after they'd locked the city down?
agd 5y ago
I’m not sure why we should rely on a ‘phd astrophysicist’ to evaluate the evidence for this. This article doesn’t seem to add anything to the debate, and certainly doesn’t persuade me that this hypothesis is a ‘conspiracy’.
- gher-shyu3i 5y ago
  We're in a time where everyone feels the need to provide their input, whether it is correct or not.
smitty1e 5y ago
This would be the preferred understanding. This understanding would be abetted by a more thorough, trusted analysis than has been on offer. That trusted analysis may be unattainable.
jacknews 5y ago
"Forbes Media, which encompasses the magazine Forbes and other related business ventures, is majority-owned by Integrated Whale Media Investments. The Hong Kong investment group purchased a controlling stake in the company in 2014 for an undisclosed amount." https://marketrealist.com/p/who-owns-forbes-magazine/ https://marketrealist.com/p/who-owns-forbes-magazine/
- Qw3r7 5y ago
  Ah, thank you, I was wondering why Forbes was taking this stance.
  - basch 5y ago
    They aren’t. Forbes is a semi open social network, people and groups are paid to write their own opinions, with minimal editing. It says after their names that it’s the opinion of the authors not Forbes.
dazsnow 5y ago
China Critical Scholars' statement on the lab leak investigation https://criticalchinascholars.org/interventions/ https://criticalchinascholars.org/interventions/
- jacknews 5y ago
  Sounds more like a threat or warning than a reasoned argument.
bryanlarsen 5y ago
We still don't know where Ebola came from, we're never going to definitively answer this question. So even if it's not a conspiracy theory yet, it's going to spawn some doozies over the next decade. Both the natural origin and lab leak are plausible theories. It matters less what happened in the past and more what we'll do in the future to prevent and/or mitigate both in the future.
- stOneskull 5y ago
  generally, we tell ourselves to do as we're told; and generally, we do.
Qw3r7 5y ago
" In summary, if SARS-CoV-2 was created in a lab — which the evidence does not favor — this virus somehow won the generic lottery on multiple, complex fronts, each one of which is an active research area in virology to this day " I'm not entirely sure why this article is being pushed up. There is reason to believe that it could be still born from a lab, as reality is stranger than fiction. And i also think that labeling it as a conspiracy label is very sensational too. Another odd thing is that this was written by an astrophysicist.
blindpixel 5y ago
I don't think the writer is being fair here because he is putting the lab-leak theory in the same category as the moon landing hoax. I don't think the situation is that simple. Both zoonotic and lab-leak are hypotheses and the evidence will slowly start pointing towards one of them. Why try to take a stand when one doesn't know enough?

13 points by johncena33 5y ago

mam3 5y ago

Im dont even get the debate. Theres a lab studying and experimenting on sars viruses so OF COURSE there COULD be a leak. Still its a GOOD thing to have labs studying it. Accidents happen its a fact of life so a leak (or even a ramdom mutation) was always a matter of when not if. Playing the blaming game is not going to change anything. And actually if anything to blame, we should blame politicians who didnt listen to people like Bill Gates when he said this exact kind of viruses coul make milions of death and that we should prepare for it three years ago. But still.. humans always react, not proact, its another fact of life that no amount of internet outrage will change. In the end the virus will make our society stronger to thkd kind of threat.. But then when will be the turning point for the climate ?

phenkdo 5y ago
> Im dont even get the debate. There's trillions of dollars of potential damages at stake. Even if this was a Chernobyl type disaster due to mismanagement and negligence, the CCP will be on the hook, and they are all too aware of it. IMHO this debate is healthy & necessary.
- dazsnow 5y ago
  What outcomes are you expecting? The CCP are going to accept blame on behalf of some lab technicians and pay the world trillions in compensation?
- mam3 5y ago
  Yeah you think the CCP is going to pay anything even if its their fault ? Thats a whole other level of delusion
  - smaryjerry 5y ago
    On the international scale almost all things happen by force. They wouldn’t pay anything voluntarily but getting the world united against you means tariffs, limits on exports, etc. it doesn't help that they are already known to lie even to their own people on things like pollution or imprison dissidents.
- jacknews 5y ago
  But the actual origin is not necessarily the most important point. I think there's already some evidence that China acted, at best, negligently, and at worst, nefariously, in the early days of covid, wrt disclosure, alerting the world, etc. For example, why did they still allow international fligths out of Wuhan even after they'd locked the city down?

agd 5y ago

I’m not sure why we should rely on a ‘phd astrophysicist’ to evaluate the evidence for this. This article doesn’t seem to add anything to the debate, and certainly doesn’t persuade me that this hypothesis is a ‘conspiracy’.

gher-shyu3i 5y ago
We're in a time where everyone feels the need to provide their input, whether it is correct or not.

smitty1e 5y ago

This would be the preferred understanding. This understanding would be abetted by a more thorough, trusted analysis than has been on offer. That trusted analysis may be unattainable.

jacknews 5y ago

"Forbes Media, which encompasses the magazine Forbes and other related business ventures, is majority-owned by Integrated Whale Media Investments. The Hong Kong investment group purchased a controlling stake in the company in 2014 for an undisclosed amount." https://marketrealist.com/p/who-owns-forbes-magazine/ https://marketrealist.com/p/who-owns-forbes-magazine/

Qw3r7 5y ago
Ah, thank you, I was wondering why Forbes was taking this stance.
- basch 5y ago
  They aren’t. Forbes is a semi open social network, people and groups are paid to write their own opinions, with minimal editing. It says after their names that it’s the opinion of the authors not Forbes.

dazsnow 5y ago

China Critical Scholars' statement on the lab leak investigation https://criticalchinascholars.org/interventions/ https://criticalchinascholars.org/interventions/

jacknews 5y ago
Sounds more like a threat or warning than a reasoned argument.

bryanlarsen 5y ago

We still don't know where Ebola came from, we're never going to definitively answer this question. So even if it's not a conspiracy theory yet, it's going to spawn some doozies over the next decade. Both the natural origin and lab leak are plausible theories. It matters less what happened in the past and more what we'll do in the future to prevent and/or mitigate both in the future.

stOneskull 5y ago
generally, we tell ourselves to do as we're told; and generally, we do.

Qw3r7 5y ago

" In summary, if SARS-CoV-2 was created in a lab — which the evidence does not favor — this virus somehow won the generic lottery on multiple, complex fronts, each one of which is an active research area in virology to this day " I'm not entirely sure why this article is being pushed up. There is reason to believe that it could be still born from a lab, as reality is stranger than fiction. And i also think that labeling it as a conspiracy label is very sensational too. Another odd thing is that this was written by an astrophysicist.

blindpixel 5y ago

I don't think the writer is being fair here because he is putting the lab-leak theory in the same category as the moon landing hoax. I don't think the situation is that simple. Both zoonotic and lab-leak are hypotheses and the evidence will slowly start pointing towards one of them. Why try to take a stand when one doesn't know enough?