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Every time this Sidewalk concern style story crops up (which it has several times over the last 6-12 months), I have rechecked that Sidewalk is disabled. So far

Every time this Sidewalk concern style story crops up (which it has several times over the last 6-12 months), I have rechecked that Sidewalk is disabled. So far I have not found it set to anything except for disabled. I hope Amazon isn’t doing a gradual roll out to enable, as if I find it enabled at any point in the future, I am done with Amazon devices in my home. As far as I’m concerned based on Amazon Logistics performance in my area and the impact to the quality of other delivery carriers in my area, Amazon is not afraid to engage in a race to the bottom in the name of market share and profits. Opting me in to Sidewalk will be the straw that breaks the camel’s back and sends me to anyone else except for Amazon when shopping.

remarkEon 5y ago
I bought my mom an Echo for Christmas last year for the kitchen, since she likes making lists and setting timers for baking and her hands are starting to show their age (she’s 63, ‘bout that time I guess). Really grating that what was at one time a helpful device for older folks is now retroactively being turned into yet another internet surveillance device.
- ryanianian 5y ago
  > retroactively being turned into yet another internet surveillance device. Oh, and an ad-delivery mechanism. Ask Alexa to set a timer, and sometimes she'll rebut with "while you wait why not try Amazon Music!" It's absolutely infuriating. I emailed jeff@amazon.com (VIP support team) and they confirmed it could not be disabled by normal means. They disabled it on their end but then had to do it again when somehow it got unset. The "start with the customer and work backward" mantra that used to be strong in the company is now completely ignored for Alexa it seems. The first domino has fallen. I suspect we'll see many more fall as a result.
  - prawn 5y ago
    I have never heard anything like an ad on my Echo. If I ask it to set a timer, it does, and then sounds the alarm x minutes later. Nothing else. If the kids ask it to play a song, it plays that song. If they ask it for an animal fact, they get one. Nothing else. Did I toggle something at setup?
    - LorenPechtel 5y ago
      She will sometimes tell you about features related to whatever you asked of her--and sometimes those are paid things she's talking about. For example, playing songs at the tier that comes with Prime and she might talk about Amazon Music.
      - prawn 5y ago
        I can't recall mine ever doing that. We use it mostly with Spotify. No Prime and not in the US, so that might mean that we miss those things. If one of the kids botches a request, it might suggest something they could ask, but it's always basic stuff.
- philwelch 5y ago
  With all due respect, it’s a microphone connected to the internet that you are meant to install in your home. How are you surprised to see it used as a surveillance device?
  - teknopaul 5y ago
    no no no, you should not expect people to behave badly. I agree with the sentiment that it is a crying shame this technology could be used to help people for whom keyboards become complicated but instead it's used to trick them.
    - philwelch 5y ago
      > no no no, you should not expect people to behave badly Should you not? There’s a bit of a spectrum of that. On one end of the spectrum, we all leave our front doors unlocked and our car keys in our parked cars in case someone is stranded and needs to borrow our car. Most of us don’t do that, but that’s what a truly high trust society looks like. I think it’s prudent to expect any large tech company to violate our privacy to exactly the degree they are physically capable of. It doesn’t mean we should morally approve of them living down to our low expectations of them, any more than we should morally approve of burglars and car thieves exploiting the naivety of people who think they don’t need to lock up their homes and vehicles. And yes, it is a crying shame that we live in a low-trust world.
    - sidlls 5y ago
      > you should not expect people to behave badly I've never been disappointed expecting people to behave quite badly.
    - bryanrasmussen 5y ago
      >no no no, you should not expect people to behave badly you should not excuse people behaving badly because it is to be expected. if you want to be able to protect against people behaving badly you should learn to expect it of them, expectation of bad behavior enables preparation.
  - userbinator 5y ago
- detaro 5y ago
  How is it now more of a surveillance device than it was before? What exactly is it now surveilling in addition?
jb775 5y ago
> and sends me to anyone else except for Amazon when shopping I cancelled Prime last year so have been shopping around more...I've consistently been able to find cheaper prices elsewhere with free 2 day shipping.
bigfudge 5y ago
So the tax evasion, worker abuses and militant anti-unionisation weren't enough! I often see comments like this, and I truly wonder if anything would prevent people from using Amazon. I don't want to criticise you specifically — it's so easy to say you would switch but becoming increasingly difficult to do. And motivated cognition is really a thing.
- nanidin 5y ago
  Tax evasion, worker abuses, and anti-unionization all happen far away from me and require some kind of SJW attitude to motivate change. I don’t see these things, they don’t impact me directly, so it’s no wonder they don’t factor into my decision making as much as things things that are actually happening in my home. Alexa advertising to me, becoming a nuisance, and coopting my internet connection all happen close to me. I ordered two HomePod Minis to replace the Echo Dots in my home yesterday. Amazon will no longer have a foothold in my home, and won’t have visibility into my shopping list or other usage.

remarkEon 5y ago

I bought my mom an Echo for Christmas last year for the kitchen, since she likes making lists and setting timers for baking and her hands are starting to show their age (she’s 63, ‘bout that time I guess). Really grating that what was at one time a helpful device for older folks is now retroactively being turned into yet another internet surveillance device.

ryanianian 5y ago
> retroactively being turned into yet another internet surveillance device. Oh, and an ad-delivery mechanism. Ask Alexa to set a timer, and sometimes she'll rebut with "while you wait why not try Amazon Music!" It's absolutely infuriating. I emailed jeff@amazon.com (VIP support team) and they confirmed it could not be disabled by normal means. They disabled it on their end but then had to do it again when somehow it got unset. The "start with the customer and work backward" mantra that used to be strong in the company is now completely ignored for Alexa it seems. The first domino has fallen. I suspect we'll see many more fall as a result.
- prawn 5y ago
  I have never heard anything like an ad on my Echo. If I ask it to set a timer, it does, and then sounds the alarm x minutes later. Nothing else. If the kids ask it to play a song, it plays that song. If they ask it for an animal fact, they get one. Nothing else. Did I toggle something at setup?
  - LorenPechtel 5y ago
    She will sometimes tell you about features related to whatever you asked of her--and sometimes those are paid things she's talking about. For example, playing songs at the tier that comes with Prime and she might talk about Amazon Music.
    - prawn 5y ago
      I can't recall mine ever doing that. We use it mostly with Spotify. No Prime and not in the US, so that might mean that we miss those things. If one of the kids botches a request, it might suggest something they could ask, but it's always basic stuff.
philwelch 5y ago
With all due respect, it’s a microphone connected to the internet that you are meant to install in your home. How are you surprised to see it used as a surveillance device?
- teknopaul 5y ago
  no no no, you should not expect people to behave badly. I agree with the sentiment that it is a crying shame this technology could be used to help people for whom keyboards become complicated but instead it's used to trick them.
  - philwelch 5y ago
    > no no no, you should not expect people to behave badly Should you not? There’s a bit of a spectrum of that. On one end of the spectrum, we all leave our front doors unlocked and our car keys in our parked cars in case someone is stranded and needs to borrow our car. Most of us don’t do that, but that’s what a truly high trust society looks like. I think it’s prudent to expect any large tech company to violate our privacy to exactly the degree they are physically capable of. It doesn’t mean we should morally approve of them living down to our low expectations of them, any more than we should morally approve of burglars and car thieves exploiting the naivety of people who think they don’t need to lock up their homes and vehicles. And yes, it is a crying shame that we live in a low-trust world.
  - sidlls 5y ago
    > you should not expect people to behave badly I've never been disappointed expecting people to behave quite badly.
  - bryanrasmussen 5y ago
    >no no no, you should not expect people to behave badly you should not excuse people behaving badly because it is to be expected. if you want to be able to protect against people behaving badly you should learn to expect it of them, expectation of bad behavior enables preparation.
- userbinator 5y ago
detaro 5y ago
How is it now more of a surveillance device than it was before? What exactly is it now surveilling in addition?

jb775 5y ago

> and sends me to anyone else except for Amazon when shopping I cancelled Prime last year so have been shopping around more...I've consistently been able to find cheaper prices elsewhere with free 2 day shipping.

bigfudge 5y ago

So the tax evasion, worker abuses and militant anti-unionisation weren't enough! I often see comments like this, and I truly wonder if anything would prevent people from using Amazon. I don't want to criticise you specifically — it's so easy to say you would switch but becoming increasingly difficult to do. And motivated cognition is really a thing.

nanidin 5y ago
Tax evasion, worker abuses, and anti-unionization all happen far away from me and require some kind of SJW attitude to motivate change. I don’t see these things, they don’t impact me directly, so it’s no wonder they don’t factor into my decision making as much as things things that are actually happening in my home. Alexa advertising to me, becoming a nuisance, and coopting my internet connection all happen close to me. I ordered two HomePod Minis to replace the Echo Dots in my home yesterday. Amazon will no longer have a foothold in my home, and won’t have visibility into my shopping list or other usage.