5 ms·

They literally forbade the landlord from collecting the rent for over a year! But the big mortgage companies were allowed to continue to collect mortgages! An

They literally forbade the landlord from collecting the rent for over a year! But the big mortgage companies were allowed to continue to collect mortgages! And the governments are still allowed to collect property taxes! I don't make any money from my rental unit it just helps cover property tax insurance and my mortgage. But I've been shouldering all of that and my tenant has been living for free for over eight months. How is that remotely fair?

maxehmookau 5y ago
> I don't make any money from my rental unit it just helps cover property tax insurance and my mortgage. It may not be fair, but it's the definition of a bad investment. Unless you're housing someone at cost out of the kindness of your own heart, in which case, that's awesome.
- nickthemagicman 5y ago
  I don't think you know what the heck you're talking about. It's not a bad investment to cover the thousands of dollars that are required annually to maintain a house including property tax and insurance for the house simply existing. And now the government is telling me I can't collect the income they require me to give them.
  - maxehmookau 5y ago
    Then I don't understand. You said you don't make any money from your investment. So it's a bad investment, regardless of COVID, right? What am I missing? The government is telling you that as a provider of homes to people, you cannot make them homeless during a global pandemic. This seems entirely reasonable and recalibrates the idea that properties are primarily homes, where people live, and not investments.
    - nickthemagicman 5y ago
      >>The government is telling you that as a provider of homes to people, you cannot make them homeless during a global pandemic The government didn't tell the mortgage companies that. And the govt didn't stop collecting taxes. Call me crazy but expecting the landlord to care while the govt and mortgage companies don't have to care... thats not fair.
- kristjansson 5y ago
  It would be a really bad business if their rent could only cover interest, taxes, insurance, and maintenance i.e. expected change in equity is 0. If it covers principal as well, then it's merely a risky business as expected change in equity is positive (since the mortgage amortizes), but downside (foreclosure) is huge and likely. In either case, it might still be a good _investment_ if the value of their equity appreciates - but as the other commenter notes, that's a very risky and inefficient way to get exposure to real estate prices!
omgwtfbbq 5y ago
It's called risk. You want the outsized returns of being a landlord? Then you take the risk that your tenants won't pay and you will be on the hook. You don't get a free lunch sorry.
- PragmaticPulp 5y ago
  The issue is the eviction moratorium has forced landlords to house people for free for over a year. The government changed the rules of the game and left landlords with the bill. That’s the problem.
- a-posteriori 5y ago
  The issue with your argument is the government chanced the eviction rules ex post facto. Yes, the poster is taking the risk that they tenants cannot pay, but they also took that risk with the assumption they could evict them and replace them with a paying tenant.
  - omgwtfbbq 5y ago
    Then you failed to properly understand the risk associated with being a landlord. State and Federal laws can always change and can affect your landlording accordingly, your failure to account for that doesn't absolve you. I will never shed a tear for landlords and the bootlickers in this thread are really pathetic.
  - rcpt 5y ago
    So, if I owned stock in Denny's and the government banned indoor dining I should get my losses refunded?
    - nickthemagicman 5y ago
      If the government bans indoor dining, losses are the least of your worries. If the government has the power to ban dining there is no longer a free market or a free country. It's why so many people are moving to Texas. They understand the wisdom of small government.
matsemann 5y ago
How was it fair before that someone else paid your mortgage? Of course, investing in real estate can be considered thrifty, but the gap between those owning and those not is growing bigger every year. It's not sustainable.
chrisseaton 5y ago
> They literally forbade the landlord from collecting the rent for over a year! They forbade evictions - not collecting rent. I don't think most people stopped paying their rent if they were able to.
- nickthemagicman 5y ago
  Come on...
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - chrisseaton 5y ago
    Come on... what? It isn't true that they forbade collecting rent. Many landlords kept collecting rent.
    - sfasfasdf2 5y ago
      "They didn't kill the victim, they just stabbed them with a knife."
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
recursivedoubts 5y ago
You getting down voted for this comment is a perfect encapsulation of what happened: the elites used the pandemic it concentrate wealth and destroy the small and independent business and capital owners, and then turned the lower and non-owner middle classes against these same people. Gotta give it to the elites: they know how to manipulate things.
- ppf 5y ago
  It blows my mind how people cannot see this is what has happened. No conspiracy theory needed - the rich and powerful just got a whole lot more rich and powerful by continuing to act like they do while everyone else was placed under effective house arrest.
- nickthemagicman 5y ago
  You forgot to mention the inflation that is skyrocketing. That doesn't hurt the rich who have all their funds parked in assets and investments. That hurts people who deal in cash which is....the non-rich. The inequality will continue to grow and the ignorant will continue to believe the news media like religion.
satya71 5y ago
Your mortgage includes a principal component that is your money. So you’re making money, just not liquid cash. House prices have gone up in the meanwhile. So you might even be ahead, no rents not withstanding.
- aww_dang 5y ago
  All prices went up. Imagine a hypothetical where the op sells his property for an increased price, but the purchasing power is the same. Did he really gain? Also consider capital gains taxes in this scenario.
- nickthemagicman 5y ago
  False, there's a certain cost just for a house existing. Property taxes and insurance. It's literally thousands of dollars yearly yet adds zero dollars to a properties worth and increases as fast as property values go up as they're indexed to property values.

maxehmookau 5y ago

> I don't make any money from my rental unit it just helps cover property tax insurance and my mortgage. It may not be fair, but it's the definition of a bad investment. Unless you're housing someone at cost out of the kindness of your own heart, in which case, that's awesome.

nickthemagicman 5y ago
I don't think you know what the heck you're talking about. It's not a bad investment to cover the thousands of dollars that are required annually to maintain a house including property tax and insurance for the house simply existing. And now the government is telling me I can't collect the income they require me to give them.
- maxehmookau 5y ago
  Then I don't understand. You said you don't make any money from your investment. So it's a bad investment, regardless of COVID, right? What am I missing? The government is telling you that as a provider of homes to people, you cannot make them homeless during a global pandemic. This seems entirely reasonable and recalibrates the idea that properties are primarily homes, where people live, and not investments.
  - nickthemagicman 5y ago
    >>The government is telling you that as a provider of homes to people, you cannot make them homeless during a global pandemic The government didn't tell the mortgage companies that. And the govt didn't stop collecting taxes. Call me crazy but expecting the landlord to care while the govt and mortgage companies don't have to care... thats not fair.
kristjansson 5y ago
It would be a really bad business if their rent could only cover interest, taxes, insurance, and maintenance i.e. expected change in equity is 0. If it covers principal as well, then it's merely a risky business as expected change in equity is positive (since the mortgage amortizes), but downside (foreclosure) is huge and likely. In either case, it might still be a good _investment_ if the value of their equity appreciates - but as the other commenter notes, that's a very risky and inefficient way to get exposure to real estate prices!

omgwtfbbq 5y ago

It's called risk. You want the outsized returns of being a landlord? Then you take the risk that your tenants won't pay and you will be on the hook. You don't get a free lunch sorry.

PragmaticPulp 5y ago
The issue is the eviction moratorium has forced landlords to house people for free for over a year. The government changed the rules of the game and left landlords with the bill. That’s the problem.
a-posteriori 5y ago
The issue with your argument is the government chanced the eviction rules ex post facto. Yes, the poster is taking the risk that they tenants cannot pay, but they also took that risk with the assumption they could evict them and replace them with a paying tenant.
- omgwtfbbq 5y ago
  Then you failed to properly understand the risk associated with being a landlord. State and Federal laws can always change and can affect your landlording accordingly, your failure to account for that doesn't absolve you. I will never shed a tear for landlords and the bootlickers in this thread are really pathetic.
- rcpt 5y ago
  So, if I owned stock in Denny's and the government banned indoor dining I should get my losses refunded?
  - nickthemagicman 5y ago
    If the government bans indoor dining, losses are the least of your worries. If the government has the power to ban dining there is no longer a free market or a free country. It's why so many people are moving to Texas. They understand the wisdom of small government.

matsemann 5y ago

How was it fair before that someone else paid your mortgage? Of course, investing in real estate can be considered thrifty, but the gap between those owning and those not is growing bigger every year. It's not sustainable.

chrisseaton 5y ago

> They literally forbade the landlord from collecting the rent for over a year! They forbade evictions - not collecting rent. I don't think most people stopped paying their rent if they were able to.

nickthemagicman 5y ago
Come on...
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- chrisseaton 5y ago
  Come on... what? It isn't true that they forbade collecting rent. Many landlords kept collecting rent.
  - sfasfasdf2 5y ago
    "They didn't kill the victim, they just stabbed them with a knife."
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]

recursivedoubts 5y ago

You getting down voted for this comment is a perfect encapsulation of what happened: the elites used the pandemic it concentrate wealth and destroy the small and independent business and capital owners, and then turned the lower and non-owner middle classes against these same people. Gotta give it to the elites: they know how to manipulate things.

ppf 5y ago
It blows my mind how people cannot see this is what has happened. No conspiracy theory needed - the rich and powerful just got a whole lot more rich and powerful by continuing to act like they do while everyone else was placed under effective house arrest.
nickthemagicman 5y ago
You forgot to mention the inflation that is skyrocketing. That doesn't hurt the rich who have all their funds parked in assets and investments. That hurts people who deal in cash which is....the non-rich. The inequality will continue to grow and the ignorant will continue to believe the news media like religion.

satya71 5y ago

Your mortgage includes a principal component that is your money. So you’re making money, just not liquid cash. House prices have gone up in the meanwhile. So you might even be ahead, no rents not withstanding.

aww_dang 5y ago
All prices went up. Imagine a hypothetical where the op sells his property for an increased price, but the purchasing power is the same. Did he really gain? Also consider capital gains taxes in this scenario.
nickthemagicman 5y ago
False, there's a certain cost just for a house existing. Property taxes and insurance. It's literally thousands of dollars yearly yet adds zero dollars to a properties worth and increases as fast as property values go up as they're indexed to property values.