4 ms·

I got ketamine for a wisdom tooth removal. I definitely had a psychedelic experience, with the nurses around me seemingly moving back and forth in time, but to

by mjfl 5y ago

I got ketamine for a wisdom tooth removal. I definitely had a psychedelic experience, with the nurses around me seemingly moving back and forth in time, but to be honest I'm not sure how something like that is supposed to effect my longterm mental health. It's just not that big a deal. I'm personally skeptical of this.

smt88 5y ago
This is an anecdote from someone who is not depressed (as far as you've stated). It means nothing about ketamine's effectiveness.
tartoran 5y ago
Your experience is completely different. You were not depressed, were you? What did you expect it’d for you then?
pmoriarty 5y ago
"I'm not sure how something like that is supposed to effect my longterm mental health." No one knows. It's one of the biggest and most interesting open questions regarding psychedelics: how and why do they work? What there is a lot of evidence for is that they seem to help a lot of people with very severe depression. The people involved in such studies tend to be ones that have had severe depression for a very long time and have tried many different treatments without success, some including trying electro-convulsive therapy (ECT.. or what used to be known as electroshock therapy), and some of which had had multiple suicide attempts... and psychedelics have helped a significant number of such people -- not everyone, but many. Another big open question is why it helps some people but not others.
- mjfl 5y ago
  The placebo effect has similar outcomes https://www.newscientist.com/article/2269908-benefits-of-microdosing-psychedelic-drugs-may-be-due-to-placebo-effect/ https://www.newscientist.com/article/2269908-benefits-of-mic...
  - pmoriarty 5y ago
    The article you link to is about microdosing, which is completely different than psychedelic therapy. It is psychedelic therapy, not microdosing, which has had many studies showing a profound positive effect on depression.
- astrange 5y ago
  Ketamine mostly likely doesn't help depression because of being a psychadelic, but rather it's a coincidence that it's a psychadelic. This is much like SSRIs, which also seem to only work as antidepressants as a side effect, not because of messing with serotonin.
  - WarOnPrivacy 5y ago
    > Ketamine mostly likely doesn't help depression because of being a psychadelic You may have this backward. Ketamine might not be a psychedelic drug but can yield similar positive outcomes. ref: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-lucid-mind/202105/how-does-ketamine-work-differently-other-psychedelics https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-lucid-mind/20210...
spaetzleesser 5y ago
When I take mushrooms I don't have deep experiences. But I usually feel better for weeks after. I think it highly depends on the person but there are enough people describing the benefits they are getting. So it should be taken seriously.
- lovemenot 5y ago
  It might be just a matter of terminology, but this comment has me confused. Could you please give a counter-example of what has actually triggered a deep experience for you. Was it an even more potent psychedelic? Or do you just not consider this kind of experience deep? Or perhaps your dosage was very low? For anybody who is reading naively, don't assume that you won't have a deep experience. Of course ymmv, but the consensus seems to be very different from my parent. Be advised not to take it lightly.
seattle_spring 5y ago
I suffer from chronic pain, and marijuana makes my pain significantly worse. That means that cannabis does not work for my pain, but it means nothing with regard to its effectiveness for others. The same is true of your experience with Ketamine.

by mjfl 5y ago

smt88 5y ago

This is an anecdote from someone who is not depressed (as far as you've stated). It means nothing about ketamine's effectiveness.

tartoran 5y ago

Your experience is completely different. You were not depressed, were you? What did you expect it’d for you then?

pmoriarty 5y ago

"I'm not sure how something like that is supposed to effect my longterm mental health." No one knows. It's one of the biggest and most interesting open questions regarding psychedelics: how and why do they work? What there is a lot of evidence for is that they seem to help a lot of people with very severe depression. The people involved in such studies tend to be ones that have had severe depression for a very long time and have tried many different treatments without success, some including trying electro-convulsive therapy (ECT.. or what used to be known as electroshock therapy), and some of which had had multiple suicide attempts... and psychedelics have helped a significant number of such people -- not everyone, but many. Another big open question is why it helps some people but not others.

mjfl 5y ago
The placebo effect has similar outcomes https://www.newscientist.com/article/2269908-benefits-of-microdosing-psychedelic-drugs-may-be-due-to-placebo-effect/ https://www.newscientist.com/article/2269908-benefits-of-mic...
- pmoriarty 5y ago
  The article you link to is about microdosing, which is completely different than psychedelic therapy. It is psychedelic therapy, not microdosing, which has had many studies showing a profound positive effect on depression.
astrange 5y ago
Ketamine mostly likely doesn't help depression because of being a psychadelic, but rather it's a coincidence that it's a psychadelic. This is much like SSRIs, which also seem to only work as antidepressants as a side effect, not because of messing with serotonin.
- WarOnPrivacy 5y ago
  > Ketamine mostly likely doesn't help depression because of being a psychadelic You may have this backward. Ketamine might not be a psychedelic drug but can yield similar positive outcomes. ref: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-lucid-mind/202105/how-does-ketamine-work-differently-other-psychedelics https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-lucid-mind/20210...

spaetzleesser 5y ago

When I take mushrooms I don't have deep experiences. But I usually feel better for weeks after. I think it highly depends on the person but there are enough people describing the benefits they are getting. So it should be taken seriously.

lovemenot 5y ago
It might be just a matter of terminology, but this comment has me confused. Could you please give a counter-example of what has actually triggered a deep experience for you. Was it an even more potent psychedelic? Or do you just not consider this kind of experience deep? Or perhaps your dosage was very low? For anybody who is reading naively, don't assume that you won't have a deep experience. Of course ymmv, but the consensus seems to be very different from my parent. Be advised not to take it lightly.

seattle_spring 5y ago

I suffer from chronic pain, and marijuana makes my pain significantly worse. That means that cannabis does not work for my pain, but it means nothing with regard to its effectiveness for others. The same is true of your experience with Ketamine.