3 ms·

I don't know any of the context here, but it seems to me that what the quote actually says is that the author admits that he is unable to function effectively w

I don't know any of the context here, but it seems to me that what the quote actually says is that the author admits that he is unable to function effectively with female colleagues, that there are other men like him, and that it's a problem that mustn't be allowed to hold women back from doing science.

skystarman 5y ago
It's interesting that everyone defending this old coot is just memory-holing the clearly misogynistic comment "if you a criticize a woman in the lab, they cry" and are choosing to only mention the comments that are more easily defensible as a "joke"
- NovemberWhiskey 5y ago
  Please give some credit to other posters. The way I read this; when he says "you", it's the generic you: he's talking about the "chauvinist monsters" like himself, and it's in the context of three particular ways in which his own failings prevent him working with women. He forms and encourages inappropriate emotional relationships with his female colleagues and it affects his ability to give criticism of their work effectively. Now you have the right to read that a different way; but please respect that others are not just "memory-holing" misogynistic comments for some reason or another. I'm not defending him: he definitely has a problem with his attitude to women, it sounds like it might absolutely create a hostile workplace, and it's almost certainly inappropriate to be talking about the subject in such a light-hearted manner - but this is fundamentally a mea culpa rather than a criticism of women in science.
  - unishark 5y ago
    Yes I imagined his idea of "criticizing" amounted to abusively yelling at people. From what I've seen, the way people win Nobel prizes is by working their lab 24/7 like a slavedriver. I actually have seen psychopathic professors yell at female lab members until they cry. I knew one guy who complained about it. He apparently got much more productivity out of yelling at the guys. Pretty dark humor if it's a joke.
  - skystarman 5y ago
    "Now you have the right to read that a different way; but please respect that others are not just "memory-holing" misogynistic comments for some reason or another." Almost every single one of the posters defending this misogynistic behavior are just deliberately leaving out his most incendiary and misogynistic remark and instead focusing on comments he made that are less objectionable. Why do these people deserve "credit"? Am I suppose to believe only focusing on the least objectionable comments to paint him as some unfairly maligned martyr is just an accident?
- zozbot234 5y ago
  I mean, who could prove him wrong? Maybe his idea of "criticizing" his fellow professionals involves a lot of yelling and throwing chairs around. There's certainly some people like that in the workplace.

skystarman 5y ago

It's interesting that everyone defending this old coot is just memory-holing the clearly misogynistic comment "if you a criticize a woman in the lab, they cry" and are choosing to only mention the comments that are more easily defensible as a "joke"

NovemberWhiskey 5y ago
Please give some credit to other posters. The way I read this; when he says "you", it's the generic you: he's talking about the "chauvinist monsters" like himself, and it's in the context of three particular ways in which his own failings prevent him working with women. He forms and encourages inappropriate emotional relationships with his female colleagues and it affects his ability to give criticism of their work effectively. Now you have the right to read that a different way; but please respect that others are not just "memory-holing" misogynistic comments for some reason or another. I'm not defending him: he definitely has a problem with his attitude to women, it sounds like it might absolutely create a hostile workplace, and it's almost certainly inappropriate to be talking about the subject in such a light-hearted manner - but this is fundamentally a mea culpa rather than a criticism of women in science.
- unishark 5y ago
  Yes I imagined his idea of "criticizing" amounted to abusively yelling at people. From what I've seen, the way people win Nobel prizes is by working their lab 24/7 like a slavedriver. I actually have seen psychopathic professors yell at female lab members until they cry. I knew one guy who complained about it. He apparently got much more productivity out of yelling at the guys. Pretty dark humor if it's a joke.
- skystarman 5y ago
  "Now you have the right to read that a different way; but please respect that others are not just "memory-holing" misogynistic comments for some reason or another." Almost every single one of the posters defending this misogynistic behavior are just deliberately leaving out his most incendiary and misogynistic remark and instead focusing on comments he made that are less objectionable. Why do these people deserve "credit"? Am I suppose to believe only focusing on the least objectionable comments to paint him as some unfairly maligned martyr is just an accident?
zozbot234 5y ago
I mean, who could prove him wrong? Maybe his idea of "criticizing" his fellow professionals involves a lot of yelling and throwing chairs around. There's certainly some people like that in the workplace.