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This is all almost totally incorrect. French press "muddiness" is not invariant but rather a function of filter size and type. It's the equivalent of steak don

This is all almost totally incorrect. French press "muddiness" is not invariant but rather a function of filter size and type. It's the equivalent of steak doneness, use the appropriate equipment for the result you want. Espresso is fundamentally different than pour-over. Pour-over is only using atmospheric pressure and espresso is about only not using atmospheric pressure. Pour-over is closer to drip than espresso. Drip coffee is actually just pour-over coffee made with a machine, and using a warming burner is not required. How good your coffee is depends not at all on the method used, and anyone telling you it does is just encoding their preference. Goodness of coffee is a combination of acidity, sweetness, bitterness, ratio of water to non-water compounds, time spent, and enjoyment of the experimentation. This combination is achieved by varying grind size, water temperature, bean roast, contact time, and experimenter time.

eyelidlessness 5y ago
> French press "muddiness" is not invariant but rather a function of filter size and type. It's the equivalent of steak doneness, use the appropriate equipment for the result you want. I don’t think this contradicts anything I said. > Espresso is fundamentally different than pour-over. Pour-over is only using atmospheric pressure and espresso is about only not using atmospheric pressure. To clarify, I meant that the distinction is that the water flows through the coffee in drip/pour over by gravity (as you said, atmospheric pressure) but with espresso it flows through with applied pressure. > Pour-over is closer to drip than espresso. > Drip coffee is actually just pour-over coffee made with a machine, and using a warming burner is not required. This is pretty much what I was saying, with the distinction being that most people making drip do have a burner and that’s what makes their coffee taste worse. > How good your coffee is depends not at all on the method used, and anyone telling you it does is just encoding their preference. This is my first major point of disagreement besides how you chose to interpret things. For most people, the method their coffee is made makes a difference because people have shit to do, even baristas making it for them. A half assed French press will taste dramatically different than a half assed Mr Coffee will taste dramatically different than a push button espresso machine. > Goodness of coffee is a combination of acidity, sweetness, bitterness, ratio of water to non-water compounds, time spent, and enjoyment of the experimentation. This combination is achieved by varying grind size, water temperature, bean roast, contact time, and experimenter time. And even then, it’s a matter of preference, and might vary on occasion. And even then, you might encounter someone telling you your particular taste is wrong even if it delights you. Such as when I had the displeasure of ordering my absolute favorite latte I’ve ever had—I ordered a delicious natural process, the barista insisted I change my order twice and complained the whole time he was making it because the milk would ruin it, but I loved it. I’m not trying to be a jerk, but there’s a reason people find coffee snobs insufferable.
- eyelidlessness 5y ago
  Oh also, I’ve had people insist I’m wrong to prefer homogenized milk, or whole milk over cream, or milk at all, depending on the particular varietal, origin, roast, grind, temperature.
  - OJFord 5y ago
    I would argue the opposite, that non-homogenised milk makes no sense in this application - it's a toss up whether you'd get skimmed milk, cream (of an unpredictable fat %), or where in between. (It has it's uses though, it's not that common in the UK, but I find it vastly better for making paneer for example - homogenised milk splits to a billion tiny wispy solids that don't set together well, leaving a crumbly texture; non-homogenised gives a much better mix and far bigger bits that hold together well.)
- sizzle 5y ago
  Thoughts on aeropress vs espresso machine quality?
  - eyelidlessness 5y ago
    I don’t actually have any thoughts on aeropress! I’ve never tried it. Despite the differences I notice, my preference of brew process is mostly about convenience (other than not cooking it on a burner), I’m happy with a French press at home and either drip or espresso at a cafe, whichever gets me out the door quickest. So it’s rare I try a new one unless there’s a social reason. I know lots of people love aeropress and if you’re curious I’d say give it a try and see if you like it :)

eyelidlessness 5y ago

> French press "muddiness" is not invariant but rather a function of filter size and type. It's the equivalent of steak doneness, use the appropriate equipment for the result you want. I don’t think this contradicts anything I said. > Espresso is fundamentally different than pour-over. Pour-over is only using atmospheric pressure and espresso is about only not using atmospheric pressure. To clarify, I meant that the distinction is that the water flows through the coffee in drip/pour over by gravity (as you said, atmospheric pressure) but with espresso it flows through with applied pressure. > Pour-over is closer to drip than espresso. > Drip coffee is actually just pour-over coffee made with a machine, and using a warming burner is not required. This is pretty much what I was saying, with the distinction being that most people making drip do have a burner and that’s what makes their coffee taste worse. > How good your coffee is depends not at all on the method used, and anyone telling you it does is just encoding their preference. This is my first major point of disagreement besides how you chose to interpret things. For most people, the method their coffee is made makes a difference because people have shit to do, even baristas making it for them. A half assed French press will taste dramatically different than a half assed Mr Coffee will taste dramatically different than a push button espresso machine. > Goodness of coffee is a combination of acidity, sweetness, bitterness, ratio of water to non-water compounds, time spent, and enjoyment of the experimentation. This combination is achieved by varying grind size, water temperature, bean roast, contact time, and experimenter time. And even then, it’s a matter of preference, and might vary on occasion. And even then, you might encounter someone telling you your particular taste is wrong even if it delights you. Such as when I had the displeasure of ordering my absolute favorite latte I’ve ever had—I ordered a delicious natural process, the barista insisted I change my order twice and complained the whole time he was making it because the milk would ruin it, but I loved it. I’m not trying to be a jerk, but there’s a reason people find coffee snobs insufferable.

eyelidlessness 5y ago
Oh also, I’ve had people insist I’m wrong to prefer homogenized milk, or whole milk over cream, or milk at all, depending on the particular varietal, origin, roast, grind, temperature.
- OJFord 5y ago
  I would argue the opposite, that non-homogenised milk makes no sense in this application - it's a toss up whether you'd get skimmed milk, cream (of an unpredictable fat %), or where in between. (It has it's uses though, it's not that common in the UK, but I find it vastly better for making paneer for example - homogenised milk splits to a billion tiny wispy solids that don't set together well, leaving a crumbly texture; non-homogenised gives a much better mix and far bigger bits that hold together well.)
sizzle 5y ago
Thoughts on aeropress vs espresso machine quality?
- eyelidlessness 5y ago
  I don’t actually have any thoughts on aeropress! I’ve never tried it. Despite the differences I notice, my preference of brew process is mostly about convenience (other than not cooking it on a burner), I’m happy with a French press at home and either drip or espresso at a cafe, whichever gets me out the door quickest. So it’s rare I try a new one unless there’s a social reason. I know lots of people love aeropress and if you’re curious I’d say give it a try and see if you like it :)