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"That's capitalism, baby!" That's how a company is "supposed" to act in a free market, right? They have all the only supply, and can thus "should" charge whate

"That's capitalism, baby!" That's how a company is "supposed" to act in a free market, right? They have all the only supply, and can thus "should" charge whatever the market on that street can bear. <s> I mean, it even creates a perfect opportunity for someone to come in and undercut Charter, amirite? </s>

andrew_ 5y ago
I downvoted this because the guidelines [1] specifically state "Don't be snarky." There are plenty of outlets for snark. I like HN for thoughtful replies, even when I disagree with them. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html#:~:text=Please%20don't%20use%20HN,find%20interesting%E2%80%94not%20for%20promotion https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html#:~:text=Ple....
- falcolas 5y ago
  They guidelines also recommend not discussing downvotes. "Don't feed egregious comments by replying" Downvote and move on - comments like this feel like mob-mentality karma farming.
  - andrew_ 5y ago
    I wouldn't classify the comment I replied to as egregious. I can't find in the guidelines where it mentions not discussing downvotes. Perhaps you could cite that, specifically.
db48x 5y ago
Almost. It’s how capitalism is expected to work when you have to get permission from the city before you can support customers on a new street. The existing companies could roll out fiber to everyone in just a few years if they didn’t have to go through the whole process of getting approvals, waiting through public comment periods, rebutting stupid public comments, etc, etc for every single street. Or worse, getting approval from your direct competitors because you’re required to use their telephone poles.
bobthechef 5y ago
You have a point. We have been trained to think that "fair market price" is whatever the market will bear and that this is the just price. All you need is to sprinkle some "consent" on it. But a moment's thought shows that no sane person actually believes this. Consider: (1) A storm hits your area and destroys homes. Hardware stores ramp up prices way up, not because the cost of labor to produce them has increased, but to increase profits because everyone is in a bind and needs building supplies so they have a place to live. Libertarian Man will say "the demand will constrain prices", but it's not a question of constraint per se, but rather that prices are exorbitant (let's say it means the local populace will need to go into a lifetime of debt as a result). (2) A loan shark is approached by someone who can't get a loan from a bank, but desperately needs one. The loan shark charges compound interest that keeps this person in debt for a lifetime. Some might say "we have usury laws for that", but it's not a question of law per se, but rather that desperation is being exploited to fleece the loaning party. Now, in practice, the market may often be a relatively good mechanism for determining an approximate just price, but not always and maybe we just have to play this by ear and live with this kind of nonsense (the perfect is the enemy of the good). But let's not pretend the market is some magical force that guarantees the good. I say this as someone who prefers the free market (not unregulated, though) and recognizes both the benefits and how natural it is as opposed to something as dreadful, stifling, and inhuman as a centrally planned economy.

andrew_ 5y ago

I downvoted this because the guidelines [1] specifically state "Don't be snarky." There are plenty of outlets for snark. I like HN for thoughtful replies, even when I disagree with them. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html#:~:text=Please%20don't%20use%20HN,find%20interesting%E2%80%94not%20for%20promotion https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html#:~:text=Ple....

falcolas 5y ago
They guidelines also recommend not discussing downvotes. "Don't feed egregious comments by replying" Downvote and move on - comments like this feel like mob-mentality karma farming.
- andrew_ 5y ago
  I wouldn't classify the comment I replied to as egregious. I can't find in the guidelines where it mentions not discussing downvotes. Perhaps you could cite that, specifically.

db48x 5y ago

Almost. It’s how capitalism is expected to work when you have to get permission from the city before you can support customers on a new street. The existing companies could roll out fiber to everyone in just a few years if they didn’t have to go through the whole process of getting approvals, waiting through public comment periods, rebutting stupid public comments, etc, etc for every single street. Or worse, getting approval from your direct competitors because you’re required to use their telephone poles.

bobthechef 5y ago

You have a point. We have been trained to think that "fair market price" is whatever the market will bear and that this is the just price. All you need is to sprinkle some "consent" on it. But a moment's thought shows that no sane person actually believes this. Consider: (1) A storm hits your area and destroys homes. Hardware stores ramp up prices way up, not because the cost of labor to produce them has increased, but to increase profits because everyone is in a bind and needs building supplies so they have a place to live. Libertarian Man will say "the demand will constrain prices", but it's not a question of constraint per se, but rather that prices are exorbitant (let's say it means the local populace will need to go into a lifetime of debt as a result). (2) A loan shark is approached by someone who can't get a loan from a bank, but desperately needs one. The loan shark charges compound interest that keeps this person in debt for a lifetime. Some might say "we have usury laws for that", but it's not a question of law per se, but rather that desperation is being exploited to fleece the loaning party. Now, in practice, the market may often be a relatively good mechanism for determining an approximate just price, but not always and maybe we just have to play this by ear and live with this kind of nonsense (the perfect is the enemy of the good). But let's not pretend the market is some magical force that guarantees the good. I say this as someone who prefers the free market (not unregulated, though) and recognizes both the benefits and how natural it is as opposed to something as dreadful, stifling, and inhuman as a centrally planned economy.