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It seems like preemptively complaining about downvoted, somehow increases your karma, so inb4 I get downvoted for being a "shill". This is the kind of reaction

by Aunche 5y ago

It seems like preemptively complaining about downvoted, somehow increases your karma, so inb4 I get downvoted for being a "shill". This is the kind of reactionary attitude that causes YouTube to tune its moderation algorithms to be overly err on the side of demonetizing. Later, even more people will complain that their favorite YouTuber is being demonetized. Everyone has their own brilliant ideas of perfect moderation, but at the end of the day, they would never be willing to accept that responsibility themselves and the blowback that comes with it. See the grandstanding that occured during the section 230 Congressional hearings as a perfect example. Why can't YouTube simply just make a mistake and correct for it? When governments failed to protect a plane from being forcibly escorted, I don't see why people expect a private business to fix all the world's geopolitical issues.

zwkrt 5y ago
The problem with YouTube isn’t the specific way it is moderated it is the entire ecosystem it creates. It is addictive for end users. It devalues “content” (an advertising term for the things on the page that aren’t ads) that doesn’t hook users. It is hostile to creative projects that don’t carefully avoid IP or monetization guidelines. It has no incentive to uphold the public interest in terms of information distributed, liberties upheld, or mental health. Like a paper clip maximizer YouTube has a singular goal of increasing revenue; users, children, content, creators, employees, and international peace be damned.
vineyardmike 5y ago
> YouTube to tune its moderation algorithms to be overly err on the side of demonetizing. Yeah but this video is of a political prisoner who was tortured and the account is a government account. The youtubers getting improperly demonetized are often minorities with content that could be offensive to some group of people (eg. gay youtubers talking about their life... is offensive to extremely religious people). There is a big moderation quality gap between "official government posts torture prisoners" and "random gay 21yo in LA describes college life". I DO expect youtube to be able to get this balance at least right, all of the time.
drzaiusapelord 5y ago
This is such a brilliant comment. Everyone seems to know what perfect moderation is because they see something they don't like and know it should be removed, which is fair enough I suppose, but if we wrote policy on all those events to cover them pre-emptively then they can probably kiss 50% of their popular streamers away, especially those who lean conservative (hatespeech, bigotry, and ironically Russian propaganda problems) and gamers (lots of n word drops, misogyny, transphobia, homophobia, etc). So youtube can do this but if they did it, the very same people who claim to want this would lose their collective minds. They don't realize they're baddies too on some level, and want only their own kind of baddies to have free reign in the media. Great point about the governments too! Youtube can't fix what trillions in collective worldwide military spending can't fix. If dictators are this brazen and getting away wit this, as well as the American dictator wanna-be getting away with 1/6, sorry but FAANG can't help you. We're too fargone for tech solutions at this point. Fix your governments first.
ALittleLight 5y ago
It's a reactionary attitude to ask that services you pay for with time or money work well? Yes, I expect YouTube to remove objectionable content and not remove innocuous content. I don't expect them to be perfect, but I do expect "pretty good and getting better" and they fall far short. It matters that they are falling short and only correct their mistakes when massive social pressure is applied because most issues can't generate the social pressure needed to get Google to notice. That means most of their errors won't actually get fixed. Google makes insane amounts of profits, but they don't have the resources to moderate content well?

by Aunche 5y ago

zwkrt 5y ago

The problem with YouTube isn’t the specific way it is moderated it is the entire ecosystem it creates. It is addictive for end users. It devalues “content” (an advertising term for the things on the page that aren’t ads) that doesn’t hook users. It is hostile to creative projects that don’t carefully avoid IP or monetization guidelines. It has no incentive to uphold the public interest in terms of information distributed, liberties upheld, or mental health. Like a paper clip maximizer YouTube has a singular goal of increasing revenue; users, children, content, creators, employees, and international peace be damned.

vineyardmike 5y ago

> YouTube to tune its moderation algorithms to be overly err on the side of demonetizing. Yeah but this video is of a political prisoner who was tortured and the account is a government account. The youtubers getting improperly demonetized are often minorities with content that could be offensive to some group of people (eg. gay youtubers talking about their life... is offensive to extremely religious people). There is a big moderation quality gap between "official government posts torture prisoners" and "random gay 21yo in LA describes college life". I DO expect youtube to be able to get this balance at least right, all of the time.

drzaiusapelord 5y ago

This is such a brilliant comment. Everyone seems to know what perfect moderation is because they see something they don't like and know it should be removed, which is fair enough I suppose, but if we wrote policy on all those events to cover them pre-emptively then they can probably kiss 50% of their popular streamers away, especially those who lean conservative (hatespeech, bigotry, and ironically Russian propaganda problems) and gamers (lots of n word drops, misogyny, transphobia, homophobia, etc). So youtube can do this but if they did it, the very same people who claim to want this would lose their collective minds. They don't realize they're baddies too on some level, and want only their own kind of baddies to have free reign in the media. Great point about the governments too! Youtube can't fix what trillions in collective worldwide military spending can't fix. If dictators are this brazen and getting away wit this, as well as the American dictator wanna-be getting away with 1/6, sorry but FAANG can't help you. We're too fargone for tech solutions at this point. Fix your governments first.

ALittleLight 5y ago

It's a reactionary attitude to ask that services you pay for with time or money work well? Yes, I expect YouTube to remove objectionable content and not remove innocuous content. I don't expect them to be perfect, but I do expect "pretty good and getting better" and they fall far short. It matters that they are falling short and only correct their mistakes when massive social pressure is applied because most issues can't generate the social pressure needed to get Google to notice. That means most of their errors won't actually get fixed. Google makes insane amounts of profits, but they don't have the resources to moderate content well?