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It's incredible that a company as irresponsible as Tesla is allowed to operate vehicles on public roadways. "Well, we dropped a bunch of safety features, we're

It's incredible that a company as irresponsible as Tesla is allowed to operate vehicles on public roadways. "Well, we dropped a bunch of safety features, we're going to try to add them back via software update in the near future" is not the behavior of a company that should be entrusted with public safety. Combine this with the fact that this is a choice to deliberately cripple the vehicle by removing a standard driver assistance sensor, and if I were dumb enough to have an open order, this would be a really good reason to cancel it.

Kranar 5y ago
Claiming that Tesla is an irresponsible company is pretty strong in the absence of evidence. Do you have evidence that I can review to see in what ways Tesla vehicles are more dangerous than other vehicles? From what I can find Tesla vehicles are significantly safer in terms of accidents per mile, deaths per mile, and they have the highest safety rating of any vehicle. Of course I could be misled and you have evidence that suggests that Tesla's are not only more dangerous, but that the company releases vehicles so dangerous and irresponsible that it should not be in any way trusted. I'd like to see how you came to that conclusion.
- clouddrover 5y ago
  It's irresponsible to heavily promote "full self driving" when the reality is that the cars don't have that capability. The advertising works and some people truly believe in this supposed "full self driving". They start saying things like "Coming home from LA after work thank god for self drive" and "What would I do without my full self driving tesla after a long day at work". And the result is: https://insideevs.com/news/507038/nhtsa-investigate-tesla-crash-california/ https://insideevs.com/news/507038/nhtsa-investigate-tesla-cr...
  - xiphias2 5y ago
    It was a TikTok accident, if you want them to stop happening without bannking TikTok, you need to ban knives: https://www.indiatoday.in/trending-news/story/tiktok-accidents-kill-even-as-ban-order-sword-hangs-over-it-1502306-2019-04-15 https://www.indiatoday.in/trending-news/story/tiktok-acciden...
    - clouddrover 5y ago
      No, it was overconfidence in "full self driving". Musk says this with a megaphone to his 55.9 million followers: https://www.theverge.com/2019/4/22/18510828/tesla-elon-musk-autonomy-day-investor-comments-self-driving-cars-predictions https://www.theverge.com/2019/4/22/18510828/tesla-elon-musk-... But Tesla privately tells regulators that "full self driving" is only level 2: https://www.thedrive.com/tech/39647/tesla-admits-current-full-self-driving-beta-will-always-be-a-level-2-system-emails https://www.thedrive.com/tech/39647/tesla-admits-current-ful... And Tesla privately says that Musk's comments don't match engineering reality: https://www.theverge.com/2021/5/7/22424592/tesla-elon-musk-autopilot-dmv-fsd-exaggeration https://www.theverge.com/2021/5/7/22424592/tesla-elon-musk-a... You can't have it both ways. The most responsible thing Musk can do is to publicly admit that "full self driving" is no such thing and change the name to something more realistic.
- FartyMcFarter 5y ago
  > Claiming that Tesla is an irresponsible company is pretty strong in the absence of evidence. There is evidence though. Look at the beginning of this Tesla marketing video (in particular the "person in the driver's seat is only there for legal reasons" quote): https://vimeo.com/192179726 https://vimeo.com/192179726
- avereveard 5y ago
  > are significantly safer in terms of accidents per mile, deaths per mile safer than what tho. the average driving cohort? well not a great record, since it includes old vehicles and all kind of people, while the tesla entry price act as a filter. > and they have the highest safety rating of any vehicle. vehicles get a flat set of points for "soft" safety features like active braking and avoidance. the amount of death by people being burning when the bactery catch fire imply the real word performance doesn't always correlate to the score.
baby 5y ago
Someone is against the future here.
- ocdtrekkie 5y ago
  The future is coming, but Elon Musk will not be the guy who ushers it in. For one, this is just a dumb decision: It both means a crippled safety package today, and one less sensor one can use tomorrow. Considering Tesla hasn't actually developed self-driving capability, they can't actually say for certain if the hardware that is on the cars today is enough or not. (Any time they promise you've purchased a car that has everything it needs to do this, Tesla is lying, because they can't know the requirements of a system they haven't yet produced.) It certainly is only going backwards on the likelihood that there is once they start removing sensors.

Kranar 5y ago

Claiming that Tesla is an irresponsible company is pretty strong in the absence of evidence. Do you have evidence that I can review to see in what ways Tesla vehicles are more dangerous than other vehicles? From what I can find Tesla vehicles are significantly safer in terms of accidents per mile, deaths per mile, and they have the highest safety rating of any vehicle. Of course I could be misled and you have evidence that suggests that Tesla's are not only more dangerous, but that the company releases vehicles so dangerous and irresponsible that it should not be in any way trusted. I'd like to see how you came to that conclusion.

clouddrover 5y ago
It's irresponsible to heavily promote "full self driving" when the reality is that the cars don't have that capability. The advertising works and some people truly believe in this supposed "full self driving". They start saying things like "Coming home from LA after work thank god for self drive" and "What would I do without my full self driving tesla after a long day at work". And the result is: https://insideevs.com/news/507038/nhtsa-investigate-tesla-crash-california/ https://insideevs.com/news/507038/nhtsa-investigate-tesla-cr...
- xiphias2 5y ago
  It was a TikTok accident, if you want them to stop happening without bannking TikTok, you need to ban knives: https://www.indiatoday.in/trending-news/story/tiktok-accidents-kill-even-as-ban-order-sword-hangs-over-it-1502306-2019-04-15 https://www.indiatoday.in/trending-news/story/tiktok-acciden...
  - clouddrover 5y ago
    No, it was overconfidence in "full self driving". Musk says this with a megaphone to his 55.9 million followers: https://www.theverge.com/2019/4/22/18510828/tesla-elon-musk-autonomy-day-investor-comments-self-driving-cars-predictions https://www.theverge.com/2019/4/22/18510828/tesla-elon-musk-... But Tesla privately tells regulators that "full self driving" is only level 2: https://www.thedrive.com/tech/39647/tesla-admits-current-full-self-driving-beta-will-always-be-a-level-2-system-emails https://www.thedrive.com/tech/39647/tesla-admits-current-ful... And Tesla privately says that Musk's comments don't match engineering reality: https://www.theverge.com/2021/5/7/22424592/tesla-elon-musk-autopilot-dmv-fsd-exaggeration https://www.theverge.com/2021/5/7/22424592/tesla-elon-musk-a... You can't have it both ways. The most responsible thing Musk can do is to publicly admit that "full self driving" is no such thing and change the name to something more realistic.
FartyMcFarter 5y ago
> Claiming that Tesla is an irresponsible company is pretty strong in the absence of evidence. There is evidence though. Look at the beginning of this Tesla marketing video (in particular the "person in the driver's seat is only there for legal reasons" quote): https://vimeo.com/192179726 https://vimeo.com/192179726
avereveard 5y ago
> are significantly safer in terms of accidents per mile, deaths per mile safer than what tho. the average driving cohort? well not a great record, since it includes old vehicles and all kind of people, while the tesla entry price act as a filter. > and they have the highest safety rating of any vehicle. vehicles get a flat set of points for "soft" safety features like active braking and avoidance. the amount of death by people being burning when the bactery catch fire imply the real word performance doesn't always correlate to the score.

baby 5y ago

Someone is against the future here.

ocdtrekkie 5y ago
The future is coming, but Elon Musk will not be the guy who ushers it in. For one, this is just a dumb decision: It both means a crippled safety package today, and one less sensor one can use tomorrow. Considering Tesla hasn't actually developed self-driving capability, they can't actually say for certain if the hardware that is on the cars today is enough or not. (Any time they promise you've purchased a car that has everything it needs to do this, Tesla is lying, because they can't know the requirements of a system they haven't yet produced.) It certainly is only going backwards on the likelihood that there is once they start removing sensors.