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I don't get these "confession" videos. Not only is it usually obvious that they are coerced, either by the person's demeanour or obvious signs of violence. They

I don't get these "confession" videos. Not only is it usually obvious that they are coerced, either by the person's demeanour or obvious signs of violence. They are such a trope of dictatorships it wouldn't even be possible to broadcast the most truthful of any such confession video without looking suspicious. Indeed the very act of humiliating your enemies in public is incompatible with the idea of democracy. So, what gives? Is it supposed to demonstrate the regime's ability to break you? Do these dictatorships just suck at PR as much as they suck at other aspects of governing?

bjornsing 5y ago
I suspect it’s meant to deter opponents and fool the loyal base, both at the same time. I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s effective, at both objectives.
watwut 5y ago
It shows power. If you do a he did, this will happen to you. All with plausible deniality. If allows for many bad faith arguments.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
superjan 5y ago
Some people may be fooled, but more importantly, if you are an ally of the regime it helps you to an alternative story (fairy tale) that you can claim to believe in, and then pressure others to act on the premisse that the fairy tale is true.
- rodgerd 5y ago
  Precisely. It becomes a talking point, whether for true believers in support of the current Belarussian regime or its allies, or useful idiots; one of the challenges of an open society is how to move without becoming hopelessly bogged down in bad-faith argumentation: "skeptical environmentalists", pro-tobacco fake science, or the latest push from apparently Russian-based PR agencies to pay influencers for an astroturf campaign against vaccination.
  - shashurup 5y ago
    What is a point of making a vaccine and then starting antivaccination PR campaign? Disclaimer: I live in Russia and what is told about Russia here on HN slowly kills me with its striking primitivism.
    - rocqua 5y ago
      I guess that stoking anti-vax sentiment in the US increases political division. Moreover, it delays recovery from the pandemic, leaving the US economically worse off. I think a lot of "Russian influence campaign" suspicions held by people are just because they cannot fathom the other side being genuine. Helped by the fact that Russia does, in fact, run the occasional influence campaign in the US.
      - shashurup 5y ago
        Aha, got it, it initially is not for internal consumption, so I'm not that aware of that. Can you share some links? I'm really curious how does it look like.
        rocqua 5y ago
        I don't have any links. I am not sure whether Russia even is stoking anti-vax. It is clear that they have been attempting to influence elections. In the US but also in other places, like Austria. It seems unlikely they stick to elections.
        krn 5y ago
        > Can you share some links? I'm really curious how does it look like. https://www.rferl.org/a/russia-pfizer-covid-disinformation-serebryanskaya-murky-vaccine-influencers/31277170.html https://www.rferl.org/a/russia-pfizer-covid-disinformation-s...
        shashurup 5y ago
        That is really interesting, thanks!
httpsterio 5y ago
Plausible deniability
- sam_lowry_ 5y ago
  This does not seem to work with classical music, though. Probably because there is more money at stake.
RhodoGSA 5y ago
>Is it supposed to demonstrate the regime's ability to break you. 1984 did it first.
saba2008 5y ago
It is supposed to induce terror and thus compliance in population. >incompatible with the idea of democracy So is Belarusian regime. >suck at PR Do concentration camp administration suck at PR? Beating random prisoners to death for no reason is quite efficient way of keeping people under control. But if Lukashenka gets torn to bloody pieces by the crowd - then yes, he did suck at PR indeed.
jakelazaroff 5y ago
The point is to flex their power while still maintaining a veneer of deniability. Everyone knows what's going on, but their supporters will still use it as a pretext to argue that nothing is wrong. It's the same reason Israel claims that every building they level in Gaza is a military target. It's the same reason cops in the US cite noncompliance as a justification for violence. It's the same reason Republicans allege voter fraud when they make laws to suppress millions of votes. Authoritarians will never, ever, ever admit "we're dictators" or "this is about power". They will always have an excuse for it.
- reducesuffering 5y ago
  > It's the same reason Israel claims that every building they level in Gaza is a military target. Want to cite that counterclaim? Which innocent building was razed?
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - jrochkind1 5y ago
    > It's the same reason cops in the US cite noncompliance as a justification for violence. how about that one? Which person that doesn't deserve it has ever been the victim of police violence? Can you prove it?
    - jasonwatkinspdx 5y ago
      Imagine posting this on the anniversary of George Floyd's death.
    - anders_p 5y ago
      Jesus Christ you can't be serious? Have never heard about what happened during the Civil Rights movement? Try a web search for police violence. You will see hours upon hours of unprovoked violence by the US police. Your comment is quite frankly incredibly ignorant.
xdennis 5y ago
It's also used to break people. It reduces a person's self worth when he confesses to something he didn't do. It makes him feel like he let people down.
jasonwatkinspdx 5y ago
The hypocrisy of it is the entire point. It's a demonstration of power. Combined with the rhetoric what it clearly communicates is "play the farce or we'll do this to you too." They don't suck at PR, they are doing exact what they want and it is extremely effective. You simply are coming into it with the wrong frame, one based on viewing it in the detached and abstract hypothetical, vs the embodied view of someone who is in that society and has everything to lose. Everyone ultimately knows the Big Lie is false. The PR is showing that the truth does not matter vs the power of the regime. One of the most chilling examples of this is the footage from when Saddam took absolute power. He paraded out a "confessor" that showed signs of torture in front of the legislature. The confessor started reading a list of names of sitting members of the legislature. As he continued, the entire congress became panic'd. Many of them began screaming hyperbolic pledges of loyalty to Saddam, prostrating in the aisles, etc. Once the list of names was done, roughly half the legislature was named. Saddam took everyone outside, distributed firearms, and made the half that was not named execute the half that was. He did that to make the survivors complicit in his new dictatorship. The message was: if I go down, you go with me now. That's what this sort of stuff is about. Not some armchair platonic musing about whether it's hypocritical vs the ideals of democracy.
shashurup 5y ago
It seems like the years of power created some kind reality distortion field around him so that he don't see all the futility of his attempts to look good. There is no escape from "dictator vs.freedom fighter" narrative. The dictator is always bad nevermind the net effect of his years in power. The freedom fighter is always good and no insinuations about him beign paid by foreing agencies or turning his country into war or just chaos would change that.

bjornsing 5y ago

I suspect it’s meant to deter opponents and fool the loyal base, both at the same time. I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s effective, at both objectives.

watwut 5y ago

It shows power. If you do a he did, this will happen to you. All with plausible deniality. If allows for many bad faith arguments.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

superjan 5y ago

Some people may be fooled, but more importantly, if you are an ally of the regime it helps you to an alternative story (fairy tale) that you can claim to believe in, and then pressure others to act on the premisse that the fairy tale is true.

rodgerd 5y ago
Precisely. It becomes a talking point, whether for true believers in support of the current Belarussian regime or its allies, or useful idiots; one of the challenges of an open society is how to move without becoming hopelessly bogged down in bad-faith argumentation: "skeptical environmentalists", pro-tobacco fake science, or the latest push from apparently Russian-based PR agencies to pay influencers for an astroturf campaign against vaccination.
- shashurup 5y ago
  What is a point of making a vaccine and then starting antivaccination PR campaign? Disclaimer: I live in Russia and what is told about Russia here on HN slowly kills me with its striking primitivism.
  - rocqua 5y ago
    I guess that stoking anti-vax sentiment in the US increases political division. Moreover, it delays recovery from the pandemic, leaving the US economically worse off. I think a lot of "Russian influence campaign" suspicions held by people are just because they cannot fathom the other side being genuine. Helped by the fact that Russia does, in fact, run the occasional influence campaign in the US.
    - shashurup 5y ago
      Aha, got it, it initially is not for internal consumption, so I'm not that aware of that. Can you share some links? I'm really curious how does it look like.
      - rocqua 5y ago
        I don't have any links. I am not sure whether Russia even is stoking anti-vax. It is clear that they have been attempting to influence elections. In the US but also in other places, like Austria. It seems unlikely they stick to elections.
      - krn 5y ago
        > Can you share some links? I'm really curious how does it look like. https://www.rferl.org/a/russia-pfizer-covid-disinformation-serebryanskaya-murky-vaccine-influencers/31277170.html https://www.rferl.org/a/russia-pfizer-covid-disinformation-s...
        shashurup 5y ago
        That is really interesting, thanks!

httpsterio 5y ago

Plausible deniability

sam_lowry_ 5y ago
This does not seem to work with classical music, though. Probably because there is more money at stake.

RhodoGSA 5y ago

>Is it supposed to demonstrate the regime's ability to break you. 1984 did it first.

saba2008 5y ago

It is supposed to induce terror and thus compliance in population. >incompatible with the idea of democracy So is Belarusian regime. >suck at PR Do concentration camp administration suck at PR? Beating random prisoners to death for no reason is quite efficient way of keeping people under control. But if Lukashenka gets torn to bloody pieces by the crowd - then yes, he did suck at PR indeed.

jakelazaroff 5y ago

The point is to flex their power while still maintaining a veneer of deniability. Everyone knows what's going on, but their supporters will still use it as a pretext to argue that nothing is wrong. It's the same reason Israel claims that every building they level in Gaza is a military target. It's the same reason cops in the US cite noncompliance as a justification for violence. It's the same reason Republicans allege voter fraud when they make laws to suppress millions of votes. Authoritarians will never, ever, ever admit "we're dictators" or "this is about power". They will always have an excuse for it.

reducesuffering 5y ago
> It's the same reason Israel claims that every building they level in Gaza is a military target. Want to cite that counterclaim? Which innocent building was razed?
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- jrochkind1 5y ago
  > It's the same reason cops in the US cite noncompliance as a justification for violence. how about that one? Which person that doesn't deserve it has ever been the victim of police violence? Can you prove it?
  - jasonwatkinspdx 5y ago
    Imagine posting this on the anniversary of George Floyd's death.
  - anders_p 5y ago
    Jesus Christ you can't be serious? Have never heard about what happened during the Civil Rights movement? Try a web search for police violence. You will see hours upon hours of unprovoked violence by the US police. Your comment is quite frankly incredibly ignorant.

xdennis 5y ago

It's also used to break people. It reduces a person's self worth when he confesses to something he didn't do. It makes him feel like he let people down.

jasonwatkinspdx 5y ago

The hypocrisy of it is the entire point. It's a demonstration of power. Combined with the rhetoric what it clearly communicates is "play the farce or we'll do this to you too." They don't suck at PR, they are doing exact what they want and it is extremely effective. You simply are coming into it with the wrong frame, one based on viewing it in the detached and abstract hypothetical, vs the embodied view of someone who is in that society and has everything to lose. Everyone ultimately knows the Big Lie is false. The PR is showing that the truth does not matter vs the power of the regime. One of the most chilling examples of this is the footage from when Saddam took absolute power. He paraded out a "confessor" that showed signs of torture in front of the legislature. The confessor started reading a list of names of sitting members of the legislature. As he continued, the entire congress became panic'd. Many of them began screaming hyperbolic pledges of loyalty to Saddam, prostrating in the aisles, etc. Once the list of names was done, roughly half the legislature was named. Saddam took everyone outside, distributed firearms, and made the half that was not named execute the half that was. He did that to make the survivors complicit in his new dictatorship. The message was: if I go down, you go with me now. That's what this sort of stuff is about. Not some armchair platonic musing about whether it's hypocritical vs the ideals of democracy.

shashurup 5y ago

It seems like the years of power created some kind reality distortion field around him so that he don't see all the futility of his attempts to look good. There is no escape from "dictator vs.freedom fighter" narrative. The dictator is always bad nevermind the net effect of his years in power. The freedom fighter is always good and no insinuations about him beign paid by foreing agencies or turning his country into war or just chaos would change that.