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While the Japanese are amazing at hardware, they seem totally incapable of building world class software. No notable audio production software or soft synth pl

While the Japanese are amazing at hardware, they seem totally incapable of building world class software. No notable audio production software or soft synth plugins is Japanese, which is weird, considering that many of their synths are digital in nature (thus contain basically a soft-synth). Same thing in cameras, Nikon, Canon, Pentax, Sony built amazing camera yet the camera software is basically stuck in the 90s, not to mention stuff like Instagram...

goatinaboat 5y ago
Same thing in cameras, Nikon, Canon, Pentax, Sony built amazing camera yet the camera software is basically stuck in the 90s Traditionally in Japan, you would, for example, simply print straight from the camera to the printer. You can see all the support for this if you look in your camera's settings. Putting a PC in the middle is more of a Western style of working. The PC software is bad because the people who write it don't use it themselves and don't really see why anyone would want to, when they could simply skip that step altogether.
- hfkfmtkrkf 5y ago
  By camera software I actually meant the stuff running on the actual camera (firmware if you wish). Where is my upload to Instagram feature for example? Why didn't they add this if they want to avoid needing a PC?
Kye 5y ago
>> "No notable audio production software or soft synth plugins is Japanese, which is weird, considering that many of their synths are digital in nature (thus contain basically a soft-synth)." Synth1 is well-known in electronic music. >> "Same thing in cameras, Nikon, Canon, Pentax, Sony built amazing camera yet the camera software is basically stuck in the 90s, not to mention stuff like Instagram..." I aim the camera. I press the button. It puts the resulting readings from the sensor in a raw file on the SD card. This has worked without fail for thousands of pictures. The rare times I need to use anything I can't get to with a physical button, they're all easily accessed on a single screen by touch with the i button. What else do I need? They keep piling connectivity junk on, but airplane mode shuts it down.
- user-the-name 5y ago
  The things new iPhones do with software and camera is both absolutely revolutionary and completely unheard of in the world of big cameras.
  - Kye 5y ago
    My point was the in-camera software doesn't matter for my use case as long as it stays out of the way. The person I replied to didn't specify what kind of camera. The brands in the list implied non-phone cameras to me.
    - user-the-name 5y ago
      The point is, there is a LOT more the software can do for you than "stay out of the way". The software can do massive things for your image quality and assisting you in bad conditions. But big cameras do not even try.
      - Kye 5y ago
        I don't want them to try. I don't care if the features are there as long as I can turn them off, but I don't want it. The things I can do off-camera will always be far ahead of whatever's inside. Capture One/Lightroom and Affinity Photo/Photoshop will have those features with higher quality long before they reach non-phone cameras. They work with the raw data right off the sensor. Nothing done with the limited power of an on-board processor will beat a good raw processor in pulling a good photo out of subpar conditions.
        user-the-name 5y ago
        You absolutely can not do the kinds of things the iPhone does off-camera. The iPhone can do three-second exposures free-handed, and have them come out pretty sharp without even trying to hold the phone still. That is not something you do in postprocessing.
agumonkey 5y ago
> While the Japanese are amazing at hardware You're listing hardware companies though, we'd have to look at Japanese software companies to see. Now I agree Sony and others struggled to absorb software and considering they were very high grade hardware device manufacturers the delta was damning. It's a different approach I guess
martial_cc 5y ago
What about Korg software? While I'm not sure what country they develop their software in, the company is Japanese.
- musicale 5y ago
  ^ KORG's software is fantastic. Killer apps for the iPad as far as I'm concerned. Gadget is one of my favorite DAWs.
mlacks 5y ago
NalNezumi 6 days ago [–] While establishing a "cause & effect" here seems very hard, from my personal experience working in software field in Japan, I think the winning concept here is actually the combination of removing middleman and paying good salaries. Japan is very very behind in IT/digitalization compared to most western countries. This doesn't just mean it's behind in product portfolio and quality, but that perception of software engineer & managers and still quite behind. The respect that a lot of software engineers enjoys in US/EU is not quite there yet in Japan(and salary often reflect this). The C-suite usually doesn't have a firm understanding of software/IT world, and instead ends-up hiring a lot of "Scrum-experts/Agile coaches" and hires software engineers from consultancy or recruitment companies for cheap. There's ofc companies that doesn't fall in this category, but for middle-sized companies in Japan (which is the bulk of the economy), this is the true state of things. Middle-men in Japan have therefore been way more encroaching on this, and they have the incentive to not improve the respect/social standing the software engineers have. "Removing managers" in this article does not mean the same thing as it would in US/EU, conditions are different. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27178486 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27178486
nunja 5y ago
They produce world class video games though.
scarecrowbob 5y ago
Well, I personally got a whole lot of production work done in the 00s with Sony Vegas... so there's at least one counter example.
- musicale 5y ago
  I think Sony also published ACID Pro for a while.
cronix 5y ago
Same in the 3D world, and video production. I can't think of 1 Japanese software product.
musicale 5y ago
> No notable audio production software or soft synth plugins is Japanese, which is weird, considering that many of their synths are digital in nature Have you tried KORG Gadget? It's incredible and a solid DAW/virtual studio in its own right. Basically a killer app for the iPad, and it's also available for macOS. All of KORG's music apps are fantastic, and basically reason enough to buy an iPad: Gadget, Module, ODYSSEi, iWavestation, iPolySix, iMS-20, iMono/Poly, iElectribe (and its Wave and Gorillaz variants), iKaossilator and iM1. In addition to PC/Mac/iOS, KORG also has even ported several of its music apps to the Nintendo Switch and 3DS/DS. Definitely fun to make music on a gaming handheld. KORG is one of my favorite music software/virtual instrument/plugin developers, hands down. And they've been on fire in terms of hardware synths over the past few years as well, both with new/affordable analog as well as classic reissues.

goatinaboat 5y ago

Same thing in cameras, Nikon, Canon, Pentax, Sony built amazing camera yet the camera software is basically stuck in the 90s Traditionally in Japan, you would, for example, simply print straight from the camera to the printer. You can see all the support for this if you look in your camera's settings. Putting a PC in the middle is more of a Western style of working. The PC software is bad because the people who write it don't use it themselves and don't really see why anyone would want to, when they could simply skip that step altogether.

hfkfmtkrkf 5y ago
By camera software I actually meant the stuff running on the actual camera (firmware if you wish). Where is my upload to Instagram feature for example? Why didn't they add this if they want to avoid needing a PC?

Kye 5y ago

>> "No notable audio production software or soft synth plugins is Japanese, which is weird, considering that many of their synths are digital in nature (thus contain basically a soft-synth)." Synth1 is well-known in electronic music. >> "Same thing in cameras, Nikon, Canon, Pentax, Sony built amazing camera yet the camera software is basically stuck in the 90s, not to mention stuff like Instagram..." I aim the camera. I press the button. It puts the resulting readings from the sensor in a raw file on the SD card. This has worked without fail for thousands of pictures. The rare times I need to use anything I can't get to with a physical button, they're all easily accessed on a single screen by touch with the i button. What else do I need? They keep piling connectivity junk on, but airplane mode shuts it down.

user-the-name 5y ago
The things new iPhones do with software and camera is both absolutely revolutionary and completely unheard of in the world of big cameras.
- Kye 5y ago
  My point was the in-camera software doesn't matter for my use case as long as it stays out of the way. The person I replied to didn't specify what kind of camera. The brands in the list implied non-phone cameras to me.
  - user-the-name 5y ago
    The point is, there is a LOT more the software can do for you than "stay out of the way". The software can do massive things for your image quality and assisting you in bad conditions. But big cameras do not even try.
    - Kye 5y ago
      I don't want them to try. I don't care if the features are there as long as I can turn them off, but I don't want it. The things I can do off-camera will always be far ahead of whatever's inside. Capture One/Lightroom and Affinity Photo/Photoshop will have those features with higher quality long before they reach non-phone cameras. They work with the raw data right off the sensor. Nothing done with the limited power of an on-board processor will beat a good raw processor in pulling a good photo out of subpar conditions.
      - user-the-name 5y ago
        You absolutely can not do the kinds of things the iPhone does off-camera. The iPhone can do three-second exposures free-handed, and have them come out pretty sharp without even trying to hold the phone still. That is not something you do in postprocessing.

agumonkey 5y ago

> While the Japanese are amazing at hardware You're listing hardware companies though, we'd have to look at Japanese software companies to see. Now I agree Sony and others struggled to absorb software and considering they were very high grade hardware device manufacturers the delta was damning. It's a different approach I guess

martial_cc 5y ago

What about Korg software? While I'm not sure what country they develop their software in, the company is Japanese.

musicale 5y ago
^ KORG's software is fantastic. Killer apps for the iPad as far as I'm concerned. Gadget is one of my favorite DAWs.

mlacks 5y ago

NalNezumi 6 days ago [–] While establishing a "cause & effect" here seems very hard, from my personal experience working in software field in Japan, I think the winning concept here is actually the combination of removing middleman and paying good salaries. Japan is very very behind in IT/digitalization compared to most western countries. This doesn't just mean it's behind in product portfolio and quality, but that perception of software engineer & managers and still quite behind. The respect that a lot of software engineers enjoys in US/EU is not quite there yet in Japan(and salary often reflect this). The C-suite usually doesn't have a firm understanding of software/IT world, and instead ends-up hiring a lot of "Scrum-experts/Agile coaches" and hires software engineers from consultancy or recruitment companies for cheap. There's ofc companies that doesn't fall in this category, but for middle-sized companies in Japan (which is the bulk of the economy), this is the true state of things. Middle-men in Japan have therefore been way more encroaching on this, and they have the incentive to not improve the respect/social standing the software engineers have. "Removing managers" in this article does not mean the same thing as it would in US/EU, conditions are different. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27178486 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27178486

nunja 5y ago

They produce world class video games though.

scarecrowbob 5y ago

Well, I personally got a whole lot of production work done in the 00s with Sony Vegas... so there's at least one counter example.

musicale 5y ago
I think Sony also published ACID Pro for a while.

cronix 5y ago

Same in the 3D world, and video production. I can't think of 1 Japanese software product.

musicale 5y ago

> No notable audio production software or soft synth plugins is Japanese, which is weird, considering that many of their synths are digital in nature Have you tried KORG Gadget? It's incredible and a solid DAW/virtual studio in its own right. Basically a killer app for the iPad, and it's also available for macOS. All of KORG's music apps are fantastic, and basically reason enough to buy an iPad: Gadget, Module, ODYSSEi, iWavestation, iPolySix, iMS-20, iMono/Poly, iElectribe (and its Wave and Gorillaz variants), iKaossilator and iM1. In addition to PC/Mac/iOS, KORG also has even ported several of its music apps to the Nintendo Switch and 3DS/DS. Definitely fun to make music on a gaming handheld. KORG is one of my favorite music software/virtual instrument/plugin developers, hands down. And they've been on fire in terms of hardware synths over the past few years as well, both with new/affordable analog as well as classic reissues.