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> Often the first trick is having children. It turns out to be a good way to spend a lot of money. After hearing this for years, I assumed we’d be hemorrhaging

> Often the first trick is having children. It turns out to be a good way to spend a lot of money. After hearing this for years, I assumed we’d be hemorrhaging cash once we had kids. As it turns out, kids have been surprisingly much cheaper than I thought. It’s very possible to spend exorbitant amounts of money on children, but it’s not a necessity. Obviously, plenty of families are raising kids at the median US income which is vastly lower than what we can make in tech careers. The internet narrative that kids will destroy your finances has been greatly exaggerated for those of us in tech careers. I suggest everyone considering children take some time to talk to actual prenatal around them rather than assuming the worst from internet anecdotes.

MereInterest 5y ago
From what I've read, a decent portion of the cost is in additional housing expenses. If a couple is planning on having children, those housing costs will most likely come at prior to actually having kids, moving into a larger space in preparation. As a result, the cost difference at the time of having kids isn't as much of a jump. (At least, that's my interpretation of the available data as I put together estimated budgets for the next 5/10/20 years.)
- dtnewman 5y ago
  Child care is crazy expensive if you have two working parents with full time jobs. Most schools or day cares let out around three. If you normally get home between six and seven like most people do then you still need to figure out a few hours of care which means hiring someone. But finding a good person who only wants those hours is hard. And even if your daycare has late hours many people don’t want their kid in daycare for that long, since they don’t get individual attention and if you can afford it you probably don’t want your child in daycare from 8-6 every day. So unless you have family nearby who help you raise kids, it can cost a fortune.
  - PragmaticPulp 5y ago
    > Child care is crazy expensive if you have two working parents with full time jobs. Childcare is expensive, but it's still a fraction of the after-tax compensation of most professional jobs. Recent tax changes have made it even more affordable. > Most schools or day cares let out around three. If you normally get home between six and seven like most people do then you still need to figure out a few hours of care which means hiring someone. Every daycare we toured was open until 5-6PM. I don't know anyone who hires additional help for a couple hours in the afternoon. If you're in tech, it's not hard to find a job that allows both parents to stagger their working hours so that one can pick them up. Around here, it's very common for parents of young children to come into the office early and leave early to pick up kids. It's a common practice and plenty of companies support it. > So unless you have family nearby who help you raise kids, it can cost a fortune. Again, this hasn't been my experience nor that of any of my parent friends. Also keep in mind that kids grow up fast and daycare isn't something you need to do forever. Frankly, most non-parents I know have vastly overestimated how expensive and painful it is to raise kids. This is especially true of those who grew up reading Reddit, where angry /r/childfree posts used to hit the front page with regularity.
deleted 5y ago
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c22 5y ago
Even if the best case scenario is cheaper than you thought it's still a huge gamble. What if your kid is born with a condition that requires lifelong expensive treatment? What if your kid turns out to be a clumsy driver, or never moves out of your home?
jjav 5y ago
> The internet narrative that kids will destroy your finances has been greatly exaggerated for those of us in tech careers. That's a pretty dangerous suggestion to anyone contemplating this. Kids are brutally expensive (in the US at least). Love my kid more than anything in the universe but let's not pretend it's cheap. Current spend is about $30K-$40K per year. Post-tax money of course, so that's ~$80K off the top from gross salary. And then there's future university costs, which are trending to be more than my entire gross salary per year so not sure how that'll work out.
- canadianfella 5y ago
  What the hell are you spending $40,000 on for your kid?
- invalidOrTaken 5y ago
  What goes into that number? My brother has three kids and is making $50K as a medical resident, what am I missing?
  - PragmaticPulp 5y ago
    The thing about raising children is that the sky is the limit when it comes to spending money, time, and resources on them. It's not hard to find stories about people who spend their entire incomes on child raising. The catch is that these stories can be seen at every level of income, from $30K to $300K or more. Expenses can and will balloon to exorbitant amounts if you're not careful. It helps to know parents with more traditional income levels to see how they function. If you're only surrounded by people spending $80K/year on their kids, it starts to feel like spending that much is the only option. It's not.
  - jjav 5y ago
    School alone is ~$20K. Babysitter costs vary based on hours, but it's never less than $1K/month. So those two make up ~35K/year. Add food, toys, camps, etc and it gets to 40K.
    - 5y ago
dan-robertson 5y ago
Right but if you’re in a typical high-paying tech career (and you don’t want to send your children to private schools) then spending a more typical amount on your children means spending proportionally much less of your income than the average American (remember, this thread was about why more Americans born in the 60’s aren’t millionaires). It will be especially affordable if you get e.g. some level of childcare as a work benefit as this is often one of the biggest expenses to ordinary middle class Americans (either directly or in opportunity cost to parents who have to take more time off work)
sokoloff 5y ago
We lived happily in an 800 square foot apartment, paid nothing for child care, both held well-paid full-time professional jobs, and saved nothing towards college funds. All of those changed in some way or other once we started planning to have kids. It’s also been totally worth it, but that’s beside the financial impact.
pkphilip 5y ago
Well said. There is too much being made about how difficult and expensive it is to bring up kids... and sometimes by people who spend thousands on their pets!
rdlecler1 5y ago
Bay Area child care: $1,800-$2,000/child. Then factor additional rooms with housing at $1,000-$1,200/sqft. A couple of children easily add expenses of $8-$10k/month is pre tax income.
- PragmaticPulp 5y ago
  Raising multiple young children with their own individual bedrooms in one of the most expensive cities in the country is an edge case. That said, it's entirely doable, especially in an age where FAANG companies are paying huge compensation in that area anyway. Obviously, it doesn't make sense for someone with a median non-tech salary to try to raise multiple kids in one of the most expensive areas in the country. For tech people working tech jobs, it still works out fine though.
nickd2001 5y ago
As a dad, I Aagree 100%. To be honest I don't know how people actually manage to spend those reported fortunes on their kids. For example, kids often show more interest in pine cones than expensive toys. Or play ancient worthless but still good musical instruments. etc etc. I think a lot of people think they need a gigantic car when they have kids. Just tell 'em when you go away on holiday you can only take a few toys. Seems to work, everything will still be there when you come back. ;)

MereInterest 5y ago

From what I've read, a decent portion of the cost is in additional housing expenses. If a couple is planning on having children, those housing costs will most likely come at prior to actually having kids, moving into a larger space in preparation. As a result, the cost difference at the time of having kids isn't as much of a jump. (At least, that's my interpretation of the available data as I put together estimated budgets for the next 5/10/20 years.)

dtnewman 5y ago
Child care is crazy expensive if you have two working parents with full time jobs. Most schools or day cares let out around three. If you normally get home between six and seven like most people do then you still need to figure out a few hours of care which means hiring someone. But finding a good person who only wants those hours is hard. And even if your daycare has late hours many people don’t want their kid in daycare for that long, since they don’t get individual attention and if you can afford it you probably don’t want your child in daycare from 8-6 every day. So unless you have family nearby who help you raise kids, it can cost a fortune.
- PragmaticPulp 5y ago
  > Child care is crazy expensive if you have two working parents with full time jobs. Childcare is expensive, but it's still a fraction of the after-tax compensation of most professional jobs. Recent tax changes have made it even more affordable. > Most schools or day cares let out around three. If you normally get home between six and seven like most people do then you still need to figure out a few hours of care which means hiring someone. Every daycare we toured was open until 5-6PM. I don't know anyone who hires additional help for a couple hours in the afternoon. If you're in tech, it's not hard to find a job that allows both parents to stagger their working hours so that one can pick them up. Around here, it's very common for parents of young children to come into the office early and leave early to pick up kids. It's a common practice and plenty of companies support it. > So unless you have family nearby who help you raise kids, it can cost a fortune. Again, this hasn't been my experience nor that of any of my parent friends. Also keep in mind that kids grow up fast and daycare isn't something you need to do forever. Frankly, most non-parents I know have vastly overestimated how expensive and painful it is to raise kids. This is especially true of those who grew up reading Reddit, where angry /r/childfree posts used to hit the front page with regularity.

deleted 5y ago

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c22 5y ago

Even if the best case scenario is cheaper than you thought it's still a huge gamble. What if your kid is born with a condition that requires lifelong expensive treatment? What if your kid turns out to be a clumsy driver, or never moves out of your home?

jjav 5y ago

> The internet narrative that kids will destroy your finances has been greatly exaggerated for those of us in tech careers. That's a pretty dangerous suggestion to anyone contemplating this. Kids are brutally expensive (in the US at least). Love my kid more than anything in the universe but let's not pretend it's cheap. Current spend is about $30K-$40K per year. Post-tax money of course, so that's ~$80K off the top from gross salary. And then there's future university costs, which are trending to be more than my entire gross salary per year so not sure how that'll work out.

canadianfella 5y ago
What the hell are you spending $40,000 on for your kid?
invalidOrTaken 5y ago
What goes into that number? My brother has three kids and is making $50K as a medical resident, what am I missing?
- PragmaticPulp 5y ago
  The thing about raising children is that the sky is the limit when it comes to spending money, time, and resources on them. It's not hard to find stories about people who spend their entire incomes on child raising. The catch is that these stories can be seen at every level of income, from $30K to $300K or more. Expenses can and will balloon to exorbitant amounts if you're not careful. It helps to know parents with more traditional income levels to see how they function. If you're only surrounded by people spending $80K/year on their kids, it starts to feel like spending that much is the only option. It's not.
- jjav 5y ago
  School alone is ~$20K. Babysitter costs vary based on hours, but it's never less than $1K/month. So those two make up ~35K/year. Add food, toys, camps, etc and it gets to 40K.
  - 5y ago

dan-robertson 5y ago

Right but if you’re in a typical high-paying tech career (and you don’t want to send your children to private schools) then spending a more typical amount on your children means spending proportionally much less of your income than the average American (remember, this thread was about why more Americans born in the 60’s aren’t millionaires). It will be especially affordable if you get e.g. some level of childcare as a work benefit as this is often one of the biggest expenses to ordinary middle class Americans (either directly or in opportunity cost to parents who have to take more time off work)

sokoloff 5y ago

We lived happily in an 800 square foot apartment, paid nothing for child care, both held well-paid full-time professional jobs, and saved nothing towards college funds. All of those changed in some way or other once we started planning to have kids. It’s also been totally worth it, but that’s beside the financial impact.

pkphilip 5y ago

Well said. There is too much being made about how difficult and expensive it is to bring up kids... and sometimes by people who spend thousands on their pets!

rdlecler1 5y ago

Bay Area child care: $1,800-$2,000/child. Then factor additional rooms with housing at $1,000-$1,200/sqft. A couple of children easily add expenses of $8-$10k/month is pre tax income.

PragmaticPulp 5y ago
Raising multiple young children with their own individual bedrooms in one of the most expensive cities in the country is an edge case. That said, it's entirely doable, especially in an age where FAANG companies are paying huge compensation in that area anyway. Obviously, it doesn't make sense for someone with a median non-tech salary to try to raise multiple kids in one of the most expensive areas in the country. For tech people working tech jobs, it still works out fine though.

nickd2001 5y ago

As a dad, I Aagree 100%. To be honest I don't know how people actually manage to spend those reported fortunes on their kids. For example, kids often show more interest in pine cones than expensive toys. Or play ancient worthless but still good musical instruments. etc etc. I think a lot of people think they need a gigantic car when they have kids. Just tell 'em when you go away on holiday you can only take a few toys. Seems to work, everything will still be there when you come back. ;)