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> The problem here is that something done outside of work is making coworkers uncomfortable at work. That is now a work problem. No, it's not a work problem. T

by imgabe 5y ago

> The problem here is that something done outside of work is making coworkers uncomfortable at work. That is now a work problem. No, it's not a work problem. The mistaken assumption here is that it is everyone else's job to ensure that you feel comfortable all the time. It's not. Your feelings are your problem. If there is a tangible harm that someone is doing to you, like paying you less money than everyone else, denying you promotions that you are qualified for or something like, that, then that is something that can be addressed. People feel uncomfortable all the time for all sorts of reasons. It's not other people's responsibility to address it. Maybe you're a telemarketer and you feel uncomfortable talking to people on the phone. Too bad. Either get over it or find a different job. Maybe you "feel uncomfortable" working around people of different races. Too bad, suck it up. "I feel uncomfortable" is just one blip of information. It is not an ultimate trump card that automatically commands everything else in the world to conform around it.

didibus 5y ago
I disagree with you, as an employer it's very relevant. Why would I bother with someone that makes others uncomfortable, I can find other people to replace them in their role, it'll help my team work better and my business be more competitive. Similarly, someone who's hypersensitive might also be difficult to work with and be an issue and I might want to find someone with a bit more resilience. So clearly, both end of the spectrum can be an issue. It's very reasonable for me to want to staff my business with people who make others comfortable and don't have overt hateful public engagements, which can also tolerate the relevant heat that comes with the job. > I feel uncomfortable" is just one blip of information. It is not an ultimate trump card that automatically commands everything else in the world to conform around it If you've read all I wrote and understood this, then I miserably failed to express myself it seems. Since my take is that you have to evaluate things on a case by case basis, specifically because it is not a trump card, but it's also not an irrelevant data point. The employee that keeps getting: "they make me uncomfortable" as feedback from others is probably a nuisance to have on my staff. And now I need to evaluate why that is, is it truly that they are being demoralizing and unpleasant, or is it others who are hypersensitive. That's the case by case. And now, personally, if you've a public Twitter that constantly bash on women and suggests their rightful place is at home raising children and cooking for their husbands. And I have a bunch of women on my staff that are doing a great job, and they tell me that this other guy at work makes them uncomfortable and affects the quality of their work in turn from creating a bad environment, well ya, seems rational that it'll be to that guy that I'll tell to suck it up, and not to all my other women employees.
- imgabe 5y ago
  In practical terms, an employee who has such a highly misogynistic Twitter feed is probably also doing things at work that are actionable and make people feel uncomfortable. My point is that the Twitter feed (or whatever outside thing) is not, in and of itself, an actionable thing for a workplace to act on. Like if the person were perfectly cordial and professional at work, but also had this Twitter feed. First, how would you even know about it in that scenario? Why are you going out of your way to seek out and obsess over things that make you upset and deteriorate the quality of your work? How and why would you even let that affect the quality of your work? Like, imagine if an employee said "I can't do work today, I watched a really upsetting movie last night". Seriously? The impression I would get from that is that this is an emotionally immature person who does not know how to manage their feelings, not that I need to bend over backwards to make them feel safe.

by imgabe 5y ago

didibus 5y ago

I disagree with you, as an employer it's very relevant. Why would I bother with someone that makes others uncomfortable, I can find other people to replace them in their role, it'll help my team work better and my business be more competitive. Similarly, someone who's hypersensitive might also be difficult to work with and be an issue and I might want to find someone with a bit more resilience. So clearly, both end of the spectrum can be an issue. It's very reasonable for me to want to staff my business with people who make others comfortable and don't have overt hateful public engagements, which can also tolerate the relevant heat that comes with the job. > I feel uncomfortable" is just one blip of information. It is not an ultimate trump card that automatically commands everything else in the world to conform around it If you've read all I wrote and understood this, then I miserably failed to express myself it seems. Since my take is that you have to evaluate things on a case by case basis, specifically because it is not a trump card, but it's also not an irrelevant data point. The employee that keeps getting: "they make me uncomfortable" as feedback from others is probably a nuisance to have on my staff. And now I need to evaluate why that is, is it truly that they are being demoralizing and unpleasant, or is it others who are hypersensitive. That's the case by case. And now, personally, if you've a public Twitter that constantly bash on women and suggests their rightful place is at home raising children and cooking for their husbands. And I have a bunch of women on my staff that are doing a great job, and they tell me that this other guy at work makes them uncomfortable and affects the quality of their work in turn from creating a bad environment, well ya, seems rational that it'll be to that guy that I'll tell to suck it up, and not to all my other women employees.

imgabe 5y ago
In practical terms, an employee who has such a highly misogynistic Twitter feed is probably also doing things at work that are actionable and make people feel uncomfortable. My point is that the Twitter feed (or whatever outside thing) is not, in and of itself, an actionable thing for a workplace to act on. Like if the person were perfectly cordial and professional at work, but also had this Twitter feed. First, how would you even know about it in that scenario? Why are you going out of your way to seek out and obsess over things that make you upset and deteriorate the quality of your work? How and why would you even let that affect the quality of your work? Like, imagine if an employee said "I can't do work today, I watched a really upsetting movie last night". Seriously? The impression I would get from that is that this is an emotionally immature person who does not know how to manage their feelings, not that I need to bend over backwards to make them feel safe.