5 ms·

Definitely. I started with PHP when I was only 12 or 13 years old. Adding some logic inside your .html files (mostly includes, that were like magic back then[1]

by 101008 5y ago

Definitely. I started with PHP when I was only 12 or 13 years old. Adding some logic inside your .html files (mostly includes, that were like magic back then[1]), renaming to .php and upload them to the server using FTP was so simple. A few years later, when I had to set up a lot of things to run Django I was surprised at how hard it was. PHP was simple to use, and to understand its logic, because it was embeded into HTML itself if you want to. No need to write views, controllers, templates, anything. And most of the shared hosting (paid and free) supported it. [1]Includes were like magic back then because if you had a heavy content website with a lot of inner pages (fansites), updating the navigation sidebar was a pain in the ass. Originally they were made with framesets, later iframes (with no borders, but if the content changed, a scrollbar appeared). When I (and my friends) started to use PHP and be able to use includes, it was awesome. (Edited to fix formatting)

iammiles 5y ago
This is the same story for me. Moving from PHP to Python was really difficult conceptually for me. For years fiddling with Apache configs and uploading files via FTP was web development. I sometimes find myself thinking about teenagers getting started nowadays and the accessibility of development, but I suppose there are a lot more resources now than the early 2000s for some enterprising kids to get started.
- cronix 5y ago
  Yes, but at the same time, web development was a much simpler process back then to get into and actually start to learn. No virtual machines to have to learn, or npm, or git, or... just code in php/html in notepad and maybe some raw basic javascript until js frameworks started becoming a thing and upload it via ftp. I mean, you didn't even have css to worry about...you just threw everything into a table! (lol!) There were only a few standard screen resolutions you had to worry about, and only desktops/laptops that were always oriented in the same position (landscape). I'm not saying it wasn't crude, but it was a lot faster to go from knowing 0 to building a dynamic web page with a real visitor counter vs everything extra you have to consider using modern devices and tooling.
  - kaba0 5y ago
    I mean, the exact same things work now, a beginner don’t have to use docker, don’t have to care about responsive layouts, etc. Similarly to how one can start writing python scripts without having to know OOP, maintainability, or even functions. It will suck, but it is a valuable learning step.
  - coliveira 5y ago
    It is important to point out that this simplicity was by design. There was a ton of complex UI frameworks in the 90s, but Tim Berners Lee decided to get away with that complexity. Of course, developers being who they are, decided that simple is not what they wanted, and created probably one of the most complicated development stacks the world has ever seen on the top of the web browser.
  - 0xEFF 5y ago
    Nearly 20 years ago I wrote a dynamic listing page in PHP that renders an html table from data in MySQL. Today it still works.
- bsharitt 5y ago
  Starting with PHP and Visual Basic got me on the way to making cool stuff really fast, but I think they both made the leap to "real" programing languages later. With web development, I didn't really move on from PHP's "HTML with extra stuff" until I came across Ruby on Rails, and I'm not sure I ever really got past VB for high level GUI desktop stuff, but I was able to get into some lower level C in high school, but I've never really done desktop GUI programming since other than a little bit of Cocoa/Objective-C with earlier version of Mac OS X.
lancesells 5y ago
I learned PHP / MYSQL back in the 2000 because I had a website with ~100 pages. The only reason I had back then was to not have to update ~100 files whenever I changed the navigation.
- ricardo81 5y ago
  Pretty much the same for me. A migration from using MS Access and FP extensions to PHP/MySQL.
midasuni 5y ago
I used SSI to include things like footers, but pho was great if you were into front end stuff

by 101008 5y ago

iammiles 5y ago

This is the same story for me. Moving from PHP to Python was really difficult conceptually for me. For years fiddling with Apache configs and uploading files via FTP was web development. I sometimes find myself thinking about teenagers getting started nowadays and the accessibility of development, but I suppose there are a lot more resources now than the early 2000s for some enterprising kids to get started.

cronix 5y ago
Yes, but at the same time, web development was a much simpler process back then to get into and actually start to learn. No virtual machines to have to learn, or npm, or git, or... just code in php/html in notepad and maybe some raw basic javascript until js frameworks started becoming a thing and upload it via ftp. I mean, you didn't even have css to worry about...you just threw everything into a table! (lol!) There were only a few standard screen resolutions you had to worry about, and only desktops/laptops that were always oriented in the same position (landscape). I'm not saying it wasn't crude, but it was a lot faster to go from knowing 0 to building a dynamic web page with a real visitor counter vs everything extra you have to consider using modern devices and tooling.
- kaba0 5y ago
  I mean, the exact same things work now, a beginner don’t have to use docker, don’t have to care about responsive layouts, etc. Similarly to how one can start writing python scripts without having to know OOP, maintainability, or even functions. It will suck, but it is a valuable learning step.
- coliveira 5y ago
  It is important to point out that this simplicity was by design. There was a ton of complex UI frameworks in the 90s, but Tim Berners Lee decided to get away with that complexity. Of course, developers being who they are, decided that simple is not what they wanted, and created probably one of the most complicated development stacks the world has ever seen on the top of the web browser.
- 0xEFF 5y ago
  Nearly 20 years ago I wrote a dynamic listing page in PHP that renders an html table from data in MySQL. Today it still works.
bsharitt 5y ago
Starting with PHP and Visual Basic got me on the way to making cool stuff really fast, but I think they both made the leap to "real" programing languages later. With web development, I didn't really move on from PHP's "HTML with extra stuff" until I came across Ruby on Rails, and I'm not sure I ever really got past VB for high level GUI desktop stuff, but I was able to get into some lower level C in high school, but I've never really done desktop GUI programming since other than a little bit of Cocoa/Objective-C with earlier version of Mac OS X.

lancesells 5y ago

I learned PHP / MYSQL back in the 2000 because I had a website with ~100 pages. The only reason I had back then was to not have to update ~100 files whenever I changed the navigation.

ricardo81 5y ago
Pretty much the same for me. A migration from using MS Access and FP extensions to PHP/MySQL.

midasuni 5y ago

I used SSI to include things like footers, but pho was great if you were into front end stuff