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The neighborhood watch is often staffed by amateurs. Security forces are trained professionals. If a neighborhood watch is necessary, then an on-demand security

by deugo 5y ago

The neighborhood watch is often staffed by amateurs. Security forces are trained professionals. If a neighborhood watch is necessary, then an on-demand security force seems better. What would you think happens if you abuse this service to call security on your poor neighbors? They keep showing up? I don't think so. I do think the neighborhood watch could take it personally. Security force is a perfectly respectable and responsible job, and many ex-police and ex-military use their skill set to get into this field. If officers always showed up, and always showed up on time, then you would not need private citizens. Rule of law is for the government to control. Citizens just want their parents to feel safe, and be able to call security to drive through their street, when they suspect gang/drug activity.

whydoyoucare 5y ago
I agree with your opinion. I consider "Citizen" filling a usefull role of protection for those who can afford it. As/when they start becoming problematic, we will figure out how to deal with it. Until then, we have to go by the service they claim to offer in good faith. I want my family to feel safe. It is my responsibility to do everything in my capacity as a law-abiding citizen to ensure their safety.
- gowld 5y ago
  This comment applies perfectly aptly to Jim Crow.
  - whydoyoucare 5y ago
    Rather than hit-and-run, it may be useful to propose an alternative, so I can examine my position and correct if necessary. Thanks.
aaron-santos 5y ago
Citizen shareholders should see a massive opportunity in a "Protect" product offering which cuts down on neighbors spuriously using the service against other customers. The addition of protection money to the revenue stream would benefit them greatly.
- edoceo 5y ago
  Joke right? Cause what you suggest is straight the fsck old-school gangster.
  - aaron-santos 5y ago
    That some people are unsure should be telling.
newacct583 5y ago
This is a horrifying equivalence. A "neighborhood watch" is at best a surveillance and reporting organization. It's literally right there in the name. "Neighborhood watches" don't go around making armed attempts to intervene in crime, and to the extent they do (c.f. the killing of Ahmaud Arbery) it's exactly as disastrous as the dystopia we're discussing with respect to "security forces", and for the same reasons.
- deugo 5y ago
  I do not equate them. I value unbiased professionals over amateurs "protecting their turf". If there are crimes happening which require armed intervention, that is exactly a reason for having a professional security force. If the police does not show for such a crime, but you need to rely on security force, well good luck to you, and glad you have a backup on dial. A security force is also going to cooperate with the police and perform surveillance. Not like they pull up in an armored van and exit with weapons drawn, because a neighbor called them for an illegal lemonade stand. I don't think the killing of Ahmaud Arbery was by a neighborhood watch. Professionals would probably not have let it come that far. Same with Trayvon Martin: if a professional force had responded calmly, he may have been alive. So if a neighborhood watch is necessary (either for the feeling of protection or actual crime fighting) then a professional force would seem a lot better.
  - kelnos 5y ago
    > A security force is also going to cooperate with the police and perform surveillance. Not like they pull up in an armored van and exit with weapons drawn, because a neighbor called them for an illegal lemonade stand. I am curious as to why you believe that this scenario isn't exactly what would happen. Because I think eventually this is... exactly what would happen.
    - deugo 5y ago
      Security forces are professionals, and professionals at dealing with such situations. They'd be very bad at their job if they armed intervened in non-violent or non-pressing crimes. It is like expecting your Uber driver to take a short-cut over a pedestrian lane: maybe they arrive a tiny bit earlier to the one that paid them, but now they lose their license. If I do imagine this would happen, assume it would be true, then just to be clear: I do not agree with armed interventions to shut down these illegal lemonade stands, and I wished the marketing in the leaked e-mails would have made it clear, that armed interventions of all crime, is what this service is meant for.

by deugo 5y ago

whydoyoucare 5y ago

I agree with your opinion. I consider "Citizen" filling a usefull role of protection for those who can afford it. As/when they start becoming problematic, we will figure out how to deal with it. Until then, we have to go by the service they claim to offer in good faith. I want my family to feel safe. It is my responsibility to do everything in my capacity as a law-abiding citizen to ensure their safety.

gowld 5y ago
This comment applies perfectly aptly to Jim Crow.
- whydoyoucare 5y ago
  Rather than hit-and-run, it may be useful to propose an alternative, so I can examine my position and correct if necessary. Thanks.

aaron-santos 5y ago

Citizen shareholders should see a massive opportunity in a "Protect" product offering which cuts down on neighbors spuriously using the service against other customers. The addition of protection money to the revenue stream would benefit them greatly.

edoceo 5y ago
Joke right? Cause what you suggest is straight the fsck old-school gangster.
- aaron-santos 5y ago
  That some people are unsure should be telling.

newacct583 5y ago

This is a horrifying equivalence. A "neighborhood watch" is at best a surveillance and reporting organization. It's literally right there in the name. "Neighborhood watches" don't go around making armed attempts to intervene in crime, and to the extent they do (c.f. the killing of Ahmaud Arbery) it's exactly as disastrous as the dystopia we're discussing with respect to "security forces", and for the same reasons.

deugo 5y ago
I do not equate them. I value unbiased professionals over amateurs "protecting their turf". If there are crimes happening which require armed intervention, that is exactly a reason for having a professional security force. If the police does not show for such a crime, but you need to rely on security force, well good luck to you, and glad you have a backup on dial. A security force is also going to cooperate with the police and perform surveillance. Not like they pull up in an armored van and exit with weapons drawn, because a neighbor called them for an illegal lemonade stand. I don't think the killing of Ahmaud Arbery was by a neighborhood watch. Professionals would probably not have let it come that far. Same with Trayvon Martin: if a professional force had responded calmly, he may have been alive. So if a neighborhood watch is necessary (either for the feeling of protection or actual crime fighting) then a professional force would seem a lot better.
- kelnos 5y ago
  > A security force is also going to cooperate with the police and perform surveillance. Not like they pull up in an armored van and exit with weapons drawn, because a neighbor called them for an illegal lemonade stand. I am curious as to why you believe that this scenario isn't exactly what would happen. Because I think eventually this is... exactly what would happen.
  - deugo 5y ago
    Security forces are professionals, and professionals at dealing with such situations. They'd be very bad at their job if they armed intervened in non-violent or non-pressing crimes. It is like expecting your Uber driver to take a short-cut over a pedestrian lane: maybe they arrive a tiny bit earlier to the one that paid them, but now they lose their license. If I do imagine this would happen, assume it would be true, then just to be clear: I do not agree with armed interventions to shut down these illegal lemonade stands, and I wished the marketing in the leaked e-mails would have made it clear, that armed interventions of all crime, is what this service is meant for.