4 ms·

Is there a safer alternative?

by flemhans 5y ago

mrfox321 5y ago
ketamine? weed once your frontal lobe is developed?
- moshmosh 5y ago
  Legitimately very interested to see a comparable study for cannabis, in adult users. [EDIT] everything I could find with a quick search is about heavy, long-term use only, which evidently has little effect on white matter, and uneven effects on grey matter, increasing it in some areas and decreasing it in others. Nothing about long-term light use, occasional "binge" use, anything like that.
  - scotty79 5y ago
    I read that heavy cannabis users regain their full capacity just after few weeks. So probably if there's any damage it's nowhere near as extensive as in the case of alcohol.
- thisisbrians 5y ago
  Not sure why you're being downvoted. Both are extremely safe compared to ethanol — in terms of both self-harm and harm inflicted upon others.
  - stolenmerch 5y ago
    My guess is because they're not really an alternative because they don't produce the same numbing effects many people seek in ethanol consumption. Also, they are still illegal, stigmatized, and difficult to find in many places.
  - emptysongglass 5y ago
    Tons of studies show that weed effects emotional processing, increases risk of of sudden psychosis, and yes, even gray matter loss. [1] This idea that weed is safe due in part to its associations with "Nature" is really a social fabrication. People just fought for another thing they wanted to imbibe that wrecks us in another, not necessarily equivalent, way. Personal experience is it's one of the few recreational drugs I can't handle as I experience extreme paranoia, rarely terrifying out of body experiences, and always an inability to speak, which is extremely uncomfortable as I deeply value my ability to communicate. [1] https://www.nature.com/articles/npp201467 https://www.nature.com/articles/npp201467
    - thisisbrians 5y ago
      I didn't say it was safe — I said it was safer than ethanol. With that said, I appreciate your comment. I didn't know all of this specifically.
    - WarOnPrivacy 5y ago
      > Personal experience is it's one of the few recreational drugs I can't handle as I experience extreme paranoia I get those too. After considering it for decades, I'm fairly convinced it's due to my psychological makeup - specifically fearing an unmasked loss of control.
mettamage 5y ago
Alcohol is drugs such as weed, mdma and heroine. One is more dangerous than the other, but they have one thing in common. Drugs damage the body and/or to some extent in some way, shape or form. Don't do alcohol. If you have social pressure, fake it. Like order a beer and don't actually drink it, pretend to sip. I think people need to take this more seriously and start to think for themselves. I know it's hard, we have habits, but it's damaging. The safer alternative being: don't do it. If you want drug like feelings, I'd recommend exercising, being in love or sex. I'm pretty sure one is able to get pretty far with dancing on music as well.
- loganfrederick 5y ago
  The parent was getting downvoted, and as someone who drinks, I don't necessarily find anything offensive about the parent comment (unless it broke a specific HN guideline). It reminded me of my go-to when I don't want to drink alcohol at an event; I'll order a sugar-free Red Bull on ice. It looks like a cocktail, has more flavor than a water, and no hangover.
  - mettamage 5y ago
    It's perhaps too opinionated and not substantiated enough. I was trying to be brief. Unfortunately, I was too brief. I don't want to write out an essay and get sources where there are comparisons between alcohol and other drugs and how alcohol is basically a drug (e.g. [1, 2]). The reason I didn't is because I assume the average HN'er knows this. [1] https://www.frontiersin.org/files/Articles/592199/fpsyt-11-592199-HTML/image_m/fpsyt-11-592199-g002.jpg https://www.frontiersin.org/files/Articles/592199/fpsyt-11-5... [2] https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyt.2020.592199/full https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyt.2020.5921...
- cheeze 5y ago
  Most things damage your body in some way, shape, or form. Obviously the best solution is to not drink, but IMO it's not a great alternative. Something like what you mentioned at the end makes more sense.
tpm 5y ago
Safer in what dimension? Alcohol when abused is consumed in huge amounts and damages pretty much all body organs. Other drugs with comparable effects (say CNS depressants like GBL or benzos) are also very unsafe but mostly damage only your brain, make you dependent, make you do stupid stuff to yourself (like choke on your vomit or sleep behind the wheel) or people around you but probably won't fry your liver.
shawnz 5y ago
GHB is kind of similar to alcohol, but I'm not sure that the long term effects on the brain are any better.
sabellito 5y ago
Well, there's this newish hangover-free thing: https://www.sentiaspirits.com/ https://www.sentiaspirits.com/ Has some reviews floating around the internet: https://metro.co.uk/2021/01/22/alcohol-free-spirit-sentia-promises-good-effects-of-booze-without-a-hangover-13947226/ https://metro.co.uk/2021/01/22/alcohol-free-spirit-sentia-pr... The creator, David Nutt, has a long history of trying to bring attention to the problems alcohol brings. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Nutt https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Nutt
- c0nducktr 5y ago
  Does anyone know of a way to get this shipped to the USA?
  - tristanj 5y ago
    If you're ok with comparable alternatives, Amazon sells a variety of non-alcoholic wines.
    - c0nducktr 5y ago
      That might work, I'm interested in this one specifically because in the article that was added, the person reviewing it said it made them feel tipsy-drunk, but never more than that, which sounds absolutely ideal for me. I do wonder how much is due to the claimed GABA uptake enhancement from the ingredients and how much of that would be attributed to placebo though.

Is there a safer alternative?

mrfox321 5y ago

ketamine? weed once your frontal lobe is developed?

moshmosh 5y ago
Legitimately very interested to see a comparable study for cannabis, in adult users. [EDIT] everything I could find with a quick search is about heavy, long-term use only, which evidently has little effect on white matter, and uneven effects on grey matter, increasing it in some areas and decreasing it in others. Nothing about long-term light use, occasional "binge" use, anything like that.
- scotty79 5y ago
  I read that heavy cannabis users regain their full capacity just after few weeks. So probably if there's any damage it's nowhere near as extensive as in the case of alcohol.
thisisbrians 5y ago
Not sure why you're being downvoted. Both are extremely safe compared to ethanol — in terms of both self-harm and harm inflicted upon others.
- stolenmerch 5y ago
  My guess is because they're not really an alternative because they don't produce the same numbing effects many people seek in ethanol consumption. Also, they are still illegal, stigmatized, and difficult to find in many places.
- emptysongglass 5y ago
  Tons of studies show that weed effects emotional processing, increases risk of of sudden psychosis, and yes, even gray matter loss. [1] This idea that weed is safe due in part to its associations with "Nature" is really a social fabrication. People just fought for another thing they wanted to imbibe that wrecks us in another, not necessarily equivalent, way. Personal experience is it's one of the few recreational drugs I can't handle as I experience extreme paranoia, rarely terrifying out of body experiences, and always an inability to speak, which is extremely uncomfortable as I deeply value my ability to communicate. [1] https://www.nature.com/articles/npp201467 https://www.nature.com/articles/npp201467
  - thisisbrians 5y ago
    I didn't say it was safe — I said it was safer than ethanol. With that said, I appreciate your comment. I didn't know all of this specifically.
  - WarOnPrivacy 5y ago
    > Personal experience is it's one of the few recreational drugs I can't handle as I experience extreme paranoia I get those too. After considering it for decades, I'm fairly convinced it's due to my psychological makeup - specifically fearing an unmasked loss of control.

mettamage 5y ago

Alcohol is drugs such as weed, mdma and heroine. One is more dangerous than the other, but they have one thing in common. Drugs damage the body and/or to some extent in some way, shape or form. Don't do alcohol. If you have social pressure, fake it. Like order a beer and don't actually drink it, pretend to sip. I think people need to take this more seriously and start to think for themselves. I know it's hard, we have habits, but it's damaging. The safer alternative being: don't do it. If you want drug like feelings, I'd recommend exercising, being in love or sex. I'm pretty sure one is able to get pretty far with dancing on music as well.

loganfrederick 5y ago
The parent was getting downvoted, and as someone who drinks, I don't necessarily find anything offensive about the parent comment (unless it broke a specific HN guideline). It reminded me of my go-to when I don't want to drink alcohol at an event; I'll order a sugar-free Red Bull on ice. It looks like a cocktail, has more flavor than a water, and no hangover.
- mettamage 5y ago
  It's perhaps too opinionated and not substantiated enough. I was trying to be brief. Unfortunately, I was too brief. I don't want to write out an essay and get sources where there are comparisons between alcohol and other drugs and how alcohol is basically a drug (e.g. [1, 2]). The reason I didn't is because I assume the average HN'er knows this. [1] https://www.frontiersin.org/files/Articles/592199/fpsyt-11-592199-HTML/image_m/fpsyt-11-592199-g002.jpg https://www.frontiersin.org/files/Articles/592199/fpsyt-11-5... [2] https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyt.2020.592199/full https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyt.2020.5921...
cheeze 5y ago
Most things damage your body in some way, shape, or form. Obviously the best solution is to not drink, but IMO it's not a great alternative. Something like what you mentioned at the end makes more sense.

tpm 5y ago

Safer in what dimension? Alcohol when abused is consumed in huge amounts and damages pretty much all body organs. Other drugs with comparable effects (say CNS depressants like GBL or benzos) are also very unsafe but mostly damage only your brain, make you dependent, make you do stupid stuff to yourself (like choke on your vomit or sleep behind the wheel) or people around you but probably won't fry your liver.

shawnz 5y ago

GHB is kind of similar to alcohol, but I'm not sure that the long term effects on the brain are any better.

sabellito 5y ago

Well, there's this newish hangover-free thing: https://www.sentiaspirits.com/ https://www.sentiaspirits.com/ Has some reviews floating around the internet: https://metro.co.uk/2021/01/22/alcohol-free-spirit-sentia-promises-good-effects-of-booze-without-a-hangover-13947226/ https://metro.co.uk/2021/01/22/alcohol-free-spirit-sentia-pr... The creator, David Nutt, has a long history of trying to bring attention to the problems alcohol brings. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Nutt https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Nutt

c0nducktr 5y ago
Does anyone know of a way to get this shipped to the USA?
- tristanj 5y ago
  If you're ok with comparable alternatives, Amazon sells a variety of non-alcoholic wines.
  - c0nducktr 5y ago
    That might work, I'm interested in this one specifically because in the article that was added, the person reviewing it said it made them feel tipsy-drunk, but never more than that, which sounds absolutely ideal for me. I do wonder how much is due to the claimed GABA uptake enhancement from the ingredients and how much of that would be attributed to placebo though.