8 ms·

Where? My ex-girlfriend from 12 years ago came from Amish country and I got to meet some when we visited her family. Not a single house even had electricity. Th

Where? My ex-girlfriend from 12 years ago came from Amish country and I got to meet some when we visited her family. Not a single house even had electricity. They wouldn't have been able to charge a mobile phone even if they had them. I remember mentioning some Italian food I liked for some reason or other while having dinner with them and none of them even knew what I was talking about. They knew about the existence of Italy, but none of the cuisine, not even basic names of dishes. They didn't exactly come across as people with exposure to the broader world afforded by remote communications technology. I'm sure every community is different, though, as you would expect in the absence of widespread remote communications.

bryanrasmussen 5y ago
So, nobody in this family when they had rumspringa went out and ate pizza?
- willcipriano 5y ago
  My reading of this really depends on the food involved. If it's something like bagna càuda the OP is being a little pretentious, if it's spaghetti I'm shocked.
  - bryanrasmussen 5y ago
    yeah, hence my pizza quip.
  - nonameiguess 5y ago
    The specific item I remember quite well because of the hubbub it caused (apparently, my astonishment was was considered insulting) was tiramisu. I don't think that is pretentious. It's available from common supermarkets, but this was a few miles outside of Gap, Pennsylvania. I don't know the area well, but Gap is only a town of a thousand people that likely doesn't have restaurants. Lancaster would have, given it has a college. It's not like I got a detailed life history from these people, but if you ever get the chance, the level of culture shock can be striking. The biggest event of my time there was the neighbor's horse that was used to drive the plows sustaining an enormous gash on its front right leg. That effectively stopped work as people rushed to try and stitch it up. With no machinery, they're entirely reliant on horses to accomplish any meaningful field work, so a serious injury to one can severely impact yield. They are prepared for that, though. Thanks to not making much in the way of purchases of virtually anything from the outside world, resources only flow in so they have a surplus of everything they need to last years if they need to hunker down. Any form of community wealth is entirely kept in the community, so there were apparently some fairly vast intergenerational savings built up. So I don't know if the concern was really that being down a plow was going to have any material impact on anyone's ability to eat, but it was dramatic nonetheless. I didn't ask, but I got the impression the guy driving the plow was as distraught as he was because he considered the horse a friend. He seemed distressed by the amount of pain it was in.
    - Stratoscope 5y ago
      > apparently, my astonishment was considered insulting If you feel astonished that someone is unfamiliar with something, that is an emotion best kept to yourself. I have learned this the hard way when people reacted poorly to my own expressions of astonishment. Consider how someone might feel after hearing you say something like this: "What??? You've never heard of tiramisu???" (I'm not saying that's how you put it, just giving an example of an astonished reaction.) Instead, meet them where they are and explain without judgment the unfamiliar term: "Oh, tiramisu is a delicious Italian dessert. It's made with ladyfinger cookies, mascarpone, and coffee. Mascarpone is a soft creamy Italian cheese, often used in desserts, sometimes in savory dishes too. Would you like me to send you a tiramisu recipe? You will be in for a real treat!"
      - munificent 5y ago
        Related: https://xkcd.com/1053/ https://xkcd.com/1053/
      - scubbo 5y ago
        +1 to the sibling suggestion of xkcd's "Lucky Ten Thousand", but also https://jvns.ca/blog/2017/04/27/no-feigning-surprise/ https://jvns.ca/blog/2017/04/27/no-feigning-surprise/ EDIT: Which, I see now, also quotes the xkcd strip.
        Stratoscope 5y ago
        That is a great little article. I like the way it addresses how someone may feel that "I'm not feigning surprise, I really am surprised!" As the article says, regardless of how you feel internally, choose the external action that is likely to give a happy interaction rather than an unhappy one.
    - Natsu 5y ago
      I wouldn't say that tiramisu is that common. I myself probably only learned of it 10 years ago or so. I can only think of one place that serves it, and I live in a very large city. As for the animals, yes, it's pretty normal to bond with them and care about them, especially something like a horse. It's definitely a completely different culture, though, no doubts about that.
  - meristohm 5y ago
    There’s no reply option for the answer to your question, so I’ll add mine here: I’ve heard of tiramisu but can’t picture it, can’t remember tasting it, and my memories of food still feel robust. I’ve done more than my fair share of world travel, including all over Italy, and I’m generally adventurous with food.
    - ggambetta 5y ago
      As someone who signed up to participate in the Tiramisù World Cup in Treviso (near Venice) [but ended up not going], I can only offer my condolences :_(
    - Stratoscope 5y ago
      > There’s no reply option for the answer to your question HN tip: The reply link on new comments in a thread may not appear immediately. I think this is a measure to discourage heated back-and-forth replies. But you can always click the "n minutes ago" link to open the individual comment and reply there.
dbcurtis 5y ago
Every community IS different. Amish hold Sunday meeting in their homes, rotating who hosts. Therefore, everyone in the community must live within a practical buggy ride of each other. The community elects a bishop. The bishop has final say for that community. So.... lots of variation in the nuances of rules between communities. “Live in the world without being of the world.” There are many interpretations of that.
- jghn 5y ago
  Yep. I went to a Mennonite wedding a few years back and the thing that struck me was just how much perceived variation there was within the larger Anabaptist community vs how much real variation there was. There were noticeable differences community to community, often less than a mile away. Things like their stance on modern technology, plain dress, etc. At the same time it was considered a huge deal that the bride & groom came from different communities as they had conflicting theological views. I forget the key difference but it was something smaller than I experienced as a child whenever we'd change Roman Catholic Churches.
  - kazen44 5y ago
    > we'd change Roman Catholic Churches just curious what do you mean by changing Roman Catholic churches? As far as i know there is only one roman catholic church, but with different dogma's depending on region.
    - User23 5y ago
      There are many churches in full communion with Rome that are not Roman[1]. [1] https://canonlawmadeeasy.com/2007/09/20/are-they-really-catholic-part-i/ https://canonlawmadeeasy.com/2007/09/20/are-they-really-cath...
      - dragonwriter 5y ago
        > There are many churches in full communion with Rome that are not Roman[1]. No there aren’t; your source seems to have confused the descriptor “Roman Catholic Church” which refers to the entire body in union with Rome for what is usually described, where it needs to be distinguished, as “Latin Church” [0], the autonomous particular sui iuris church within the Roman Catholic headed by the Patriarch of Rome (who, as Pope, is also head of the entire Roman Catholic Church, with superceding authority over the heads of the sui iuris churches.) [0] formerly also commonly “Western...” but the use of that descriptor has since been fairly authoritatively declared as no longer approrpriate.
reaperducer 5y ago
Where? My ex-girlfriend from 12 years ago came from Amish country and I got to meet some when we visited her family. Not a single house even had electricity. Lots of places. The term "the Amish" is so broad that it is largely meaningless, unless everything you know is based on stereotypes. See also: "The Americans," and "The Christians." You and I are both "HN Users," but I suspect very different. I wouldn't want to be judged based on your lifestyle just because we both belong to this group.
stonemetal12 5y ago
The Amish near me have a little hut (kind a looks like a guard shack) at the end of their driveway. That is where they keep their cell phone.
skissane 5y ago
> Not a single house even had electricity. They wouldn't have been able to charge a mobile phone even if they had them. Some Amish communities allow electricity but not in the house. For example, they may accept electric milking equipment for cows, and have electricity to power that, but the electricity connection is only to the milking shed not to the residence. Or, they may own a business, and connect their business premises to electricity, but not the house.

bryanrasmussen 5y ago

So, nobody in this family when they had rumspringa went out and ate pizza?

willcipriano 5y ago
My reading of this really depends on the food involved. If it's something like bagna càuda the OP is being a little pretentious, if it's spaghetti I'm shocked.
- bryanrasmussen 5y ago
  yeah, hence my pizza quip.
- nonameiguess 5y ago
  The specific item I remember quite well because of the hubbub it caused (apparently, my astonishment was was considered insulting) was tiramisu. I don't think that is pretentious. It's available from common supermarkets, but this was a few miles outside of Gap, Pennsylvania. I don't know the area well, but Gap is only a town of a thousand people that likely doesn't have restaurants. Lancaster would have, given it has a college. It's not like I got a detailed life history from these people, but if you ever get the chance, the level of culture shock can be striking. The biggest event of my time there was the neighbor's horse that was used to drive the plows sustaining an enormous gash on its front right leg. That effectively stopped work as people rushed to try and stitch it up. With no machinery, they're entirely reliant on horses to accomplish any meaningful field work, so a serious injury to one can severely impact yield. They are prepared for that, though. Thanks to not making much in the way of purchases of virtually anything from the outside world, resources only flow in so they have a surplus of everything they need to last years if they need to hunker down. Any form of community wealth is entirely kept in the community, so there were apparently some fairly vast intergenerational savings built up. So I don't know if the concern was really that being down a plow was going to have any material impact on anyone's ability to eat, but it was dramatic nonetheless. I didn't ask, but I got the impression the guy driving the plow was as distraught as he was because he considered the horse a friend. He seemed distressed by the amount of pain it was in.
  - Stratoscope 5y ago
    > apparently, my astonishment was considered insulting If you feel astonished that someone is unfamiliar with something, that is an emotion best kept to yourself. I have learned this the hard way when people reacted poorly to my own expressions of astonishment. Consider how someone might feel after hearing you say something like this: "What??? You've never heard of tiramisu???" (I'm not saying that's how you put it, just giving an example of an astonished reaction.) Instead, meet them where they are and explain without judgment the unfamiliar term: "Oh, tiramisu is a delicious Italian dessert. It's made with ladyfinger cookies, mascarpone, and coffee. Mascarpone is a soft creamy Italian cheese, often used in desserts, sometimes in savory dishes too. Would you like me to send you a tiramisu recipe? You will be in for a real treat!"
    - munificent 5y ago
      Related: https://xkcd.com/1053/ https://xkcd.com/1053/
    - scubbo 5y ago
      +1 to the sibling suggestion of xkcd's "Lucky Ten Thousand", but also https://jvns.ca/blog/2017/04/27/no-feigning-surprise/ https://jvns.ca/blog/2017/04/27/no-feigning-surprise/ EDIT: Which, I see now, also quotes the xkcd strip.
      - Stratoscope 5y ago
        That is a great little article. I like the way it addresses how someone may feel that "I'm not feigning surprise, I really am surprised!" As the article says, regardless of how you feel internally, choose the external action that is likely to give a happy interaction rather than an unhappy one.
  - Natsu 5y ago
    I wouldn't say that tiramisu is that common. I myself probably only learned of it 10 years ago or so. I can only think of one place that serves it, and I live in a very large city. As for the animals, yes, it's pretty normal to bond with them and care about them, especially something like a horse. It's definitely a completely different culture, though, no doubts about that.
- meristohm 5y ago
  There’s no reply option for the answer to your question, so I’ll add mine here: I’ve heard of tiramisu but can’t picture it, can’t remember tasting it, and my memories of food still feel robust. I’ve done more than my fair share of world travel, including all over Italy, and I’m generally adventurous with food.
  - ggambetta 5y ago
    As someone who signed up to participate in the Tiramisù World Cup in Treviso (near Venice) [but ended up not going], I can only offer my condolences :_(
  - Stratoscope 5y ago
    > There’s no reply option for the answer to your question HN tip: The reply link on new comments in a thread may not appear immediately. I think this is a measure to discourage heated back-and-forth replies. But you can always click the "n minutes ago" link to open the individual comment and reply there.

dbcurtis 5y ago

Every community IS different. Amish hold Sunday meeting in their homes, rotating who hosts. Therefore, everyone in the community must live within a practical buggy ride of each other. The community elects a bishop. The bishop has final say for that community. So.... lots of variation in the nuances of rules between communities. “Live in the world without being of the world.” There are many interpretations of that.

jghn 5y ago
Yep. I went to a Mennonite wedding a few years back and the thing that struck me was just how much perceived variation there was within the larger Anabaptist community vs how much real variation there was. There were noticeable differences community to community, often less than a mile away. Things like their stance on modern technology, plain dress, etc. At the same time it was considered a huge deal that the bride & groom came from different communities as they had conflicting theological views. I forget the key difference but it was something smaller than I experienced as a child whenever we'd change Roman Catholic Churches.
- kazen44 5y ago
  > we'd change Roman Catholic Churches just curious what do you mean by changing Roman Catholic churches? As far as i know there is only one roman catholic church, but with different dogma's depending on region.
  - User23 5y ago
    There are many churches in full communion with Rome that are not Roman[1]. [1] https://canonlawmadeeasy.com/2007/09/20/are-they-really-catholic-part-i/ https://canonlawmadeeasy.com/2007/09/20/are-they-really-cath...
    - dragonwriter 5y ago
      > There are many churches in full communion with Rome that are not Roman[1]. No there aren’t; your source seems to have confused the descriptor “Roman Catholic Church” which refers to the entire body in union with Rome for what is usually described, where it needs to be distinguished, as “Latin Church” [0], the autonomous particular sui iuris church within the Roman Catholic headed by the Patriarch of Rome (who, as Pope, is also head of the entire Roman Catholic Church, with superceding authority over the heads of the sui iuris churches.) [0] formerly also commonly “Western...” but the use of that descriptor has since been fairly authoritatively declared as no longer approrpriate.

reaperducer 5y ago

Where? My ex-girlfriend from 12 years ago came from Amish country and I got to meet some when we visited her family. Not a single house even had electricity. Lots of places. The term "the Amish" is so broad that it is largely meaningless, unless everything you know is based on stereotypes. See also: "The Americans," and "The Christians." You and I are both "HN Users," but I suspect very different. I wouldn't want to be judged based on your lifestyle just because we both belong to this group.

stonemetal12 5y ago

The Amish near me have a little hut (kind a looks like a guard shack) at the end of their driveway. That is where they keep their cell phone.

skissane 5y ago

> Not a single house even had electricity. They wouldn't have been able to charge a mobile phone even if they had them. Some Amish communities allow electricity but not in the house. For example, they may accept electric milking equipment for cows, and have electricity to power that, but the electricity connection is only to the milking shed not to the residence. Or, they may own a business, and connect their business premises to electricity, but not the house.