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Instead of seeing the bright side of life, in which this person clearly vastly improved their situation in life, all they can see is what they don’t have. “I k

Instead of seeing the bright side of life, in which this person clearly vastly improved their situation in life, all they can see is what they don’t have. “I knew I was the only poor person at my tech startup because I had the only fat body in the building.” I’m sorry, but no, being poor doesn’t make you fat. Your eating choices make you fat. Poor people have agency too. Agency is not something you buy. This is coming from someone who probably makes half of what you make in a year.

est31 5y ago
There are food deserts in the USA, where you literally can't buy high quality food like vegetables in a large area, and have to resort to only eating the highly processed and highly unhealthy food. These food deserts usually are located in the poorer neighbourhoods. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_desert https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_desert
- andrewnicolalde 5y ago
  TIL, thank you!
- gadders 5y ago
  Then eat less of it?
  - ratww 5y ago
    Eating healthy is not just about eating less, it's also about eating the right things. If eating was just about quantity then nobody would eat salads, there would be no Keto diet, and nobody would complain about McDonalds.
    - gadders 5y ago
      Calories In/Calories Out is 90% of it. You're better off being relatively slim on junk food than being fat on good quality good.
      - istjohn 5y ago
        But junk food is less filling and satiating than real food and much more dense calorically. You can eat lettuce all day and never consume the number of calories in a fast food burger.
      - teachingassist 5y ago
        > You're better off being relatively slim on junk food than being fat on good quality good. This has consistently proved false. Being 'underweight' is associated with significant excess death; being 'overweight' is associated with a lower death rate than 'normal' BMI: e.g. https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/article-abstract/200731 https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/article-abstract/20073... (many other sources are available)
        albedoa 5y ago
        Can you help me reconcile the apparent contradiction between the title and the results? Title: > Excess Deaths Associated With [...] Overweight Results: > Overweight was not associated with excess mortality (−86 094 deaths; 95% CI, −161 223 to −10 966).
        teachingassist 5y ago
        I'd translate this title into non-academic English as: "Are excess deaths associated with being overweight?" (The result is: no - or actually yes, but negatively).
        proxyon 5y ago
        > Being 'underweight' is associated with significant excess death; being 'overweight' is associated with a lower death rate than 'normal' BMI: This is nonsense. In many medical deaths such as cancer (and especially since euthanasia isn't available) the person dies by slowly withering away. One of the first things that happens is that they become skinny and frail. That doesn't associate underweightedness with mortality. It intentionally draws a false correlation.
- monoideism 5y ago
  Food deserts are a big problem. Most of the urban food deserts developed after major riots burned down existing grocery stores in the late 60s (and then again in the 80s in LA). New food deserts now exist in Minneapolis (and likely other cities as well) after the recent rioting and burning there: https://www.startribune.com/minneapolis-longfellow-neighborhood-almost-food-desert-after-riots/570928442/ https://www.startribune.com/minneapolis-longfellow-neighborh... https://www.marketplace.org/2020/06/04/neighborhoods-where-stores-were-destroyed-become-food-deserts-overnight/ https://www.marketplace.org/2020/06/04/neighborhoods-where-s... Ironically, in the most recent riots, many - perhaps most - of the destructive rioters were middle-class "activist" kids who don't have to live with the results of their actions.
- Kharvok 5y ago
  Food deserts mostly myth. I'm looking for the study in my notes but there is only a very slight difference in diets between tax brackets.
- CountDrewku 5y ago
  Which supermarket chains in the US do not provide vegetables, fruit, meat and only offer processed food? Please find us a 'food desert' where there are no supermarkets nearby. This is a myth that's easily refuted. There's an argument to be made that poorer people aren't educated on healthy food choices but the idea that they don't have access to anything but processed food is just silly.
8fGTBjZxBcHq 5y ago
It's normal and cool actually that we can take something that affects a MAJORITY of Americans and is tightly correlated to poverty and make it a matter of individual responsibility and moral weakness.
- emteycz 5y ago
  It is correlated, not caused by poverty. Rich people are often fat too, and the reason is poor education (not even rich people schools teach this) and poor self-control.
  - muglug 5y ago
    It’s not just food education. If you’re poor in the US you’re much less likely to live near a source of fresh meat and produce, which makes calorie-rich fast food more tempting. You’re more at the mercy of many multi-billion-dollar industries that serve unhealthy food to the masses.
    - jjdin14 5y ago
      “Less likely”, “more at the mercy”, it still comes down to the individuals choices, it’s not that hard to not be obese when poor.
      - MattRix 5y ago
        “it’s not that hard to not be obese when poor.” The statistics make it quite clear that it is hard, maybe your assumptions are wrong.
        username90 5y ago
        Or your assumption wrong. Here is a reasonable explanation: People are poor since they got bad self control, which also makes them fat. People who lack self control are easily tempted with shitty fast food, so their areas mostly serves it rather than real food creating these "food deserts". If there was demand for food in those areas people would sell it, but there isn't. Edit: A strong piece of evidence is that people aren't getting poorer, but they sure are getting fatter.
teachingassist 5y ago
Food insecurity is an aspect of poverty and is not uncommon in the United States. "Your eating choices" as a poor person might be to eat what and when and where you can afford to.
- username90 5y ago
  Why could people manage to stay slim 20 years ago but not today? It isn't like the poor are more insecure now than back then.
  - teachingassist 5y ago
    The last 20 years has probably made (much) less difference than you appear to think. From Wikipedia: "The rate of increase in the incidence of obesity began to slow in the 2000s". But, to attempt to answer your question: e.g., the expectation that both adults in a household will work means that people/parents are more likely to be time-poor and not able to cook. Cooking skills have been lost.
- fmajid 5y ago
  Eating choices are not really choices (or Hobson's choices) when you have to work multiple jobs to make ends meet and have no time left for food prep.
watwut 5y ago
> Instead of seeing the bright side of life, in which this person clearly vastly improved their situation in life, all they can see is what they don’t have. First, I dont think this accurately describes the list at all. Second, it is ok for people to express negative feelings or observations. Forced positivity is toxic.
jgtrosh 5y ago
Obesity is significantly correlated with lower income. However, in an individual case it is not sufficient to draw conclusions. Edit: also you seem to present the author's formulation as meaning that they believe poverty caused them to be fat. As far as I can tell she is merely pointing out a series of correlations to both prove that she, in fact, stood out as poor, and to show how this distinction affected her furthermore. Btw I'd say the only actively harmful behaviour from the company she pointed out was making her suggest a salary rather than them making an offering.
Cthulhu_ 5y ago
wow never thought about it like that thanks im cured
- benatkin 5y ago
  Thinking about it like that (my eating choices) is actually how I lost 15 pounds once, haha. I gained it back.
DigitalSea 5y ago
There are quite a few papers out there on the subject. As someone who has studied a little bit of sociology, I can tell you there are numerous sociological factors which basically determine that wealthier people have access to better food, better medical care and live healthier lives in comparison to lower-socioeconomic people. Where you live alone determines your health equity, if you live in a remote area or small town away from a large city, your access to fresh and non-processed foods is heavily reduced. This is a great paper I suggest you read: https://academic.oup.com/epirev/article/29/1/29/433380 https://academic.oup.com/epirev/article/29/1/29/433380 -- this is a good starting point, there are others spanning back the last three decades or so. It is also worth noting that it's not necessarily how much money you have that is the contributing factor, it can be other factors. The lack of green areas or pathways to walk/exercise (especially prevalent in remote Australian communities), the number of hospitals or doctors close by. But, ultimately, lack of health services and fresh food are correlated to obesity both of which are determined by your location which, in turn, is determined by your financial status.
- giantg2 5y ago
  "if you live in a remote area or small town away from a large city, your access to fresh and non-processed foods is heavily reduced." This simply isn't true. Most food deserts are in the poorer areas of the cities because nobody is bringing fresh produce in there to sell. If you live in the country or small town, many of these places have farm stands, farmers markets, and local farmers providing seasonal produce to the local stores. Not to mention, lower density housing generally means that there is enough land to have a veggie garden, depending on the specific circumstances.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - ryanbrunner 5y ago
    Rural areas being chock full of farmers markets is mostly nostalgia, anyone I know who lives in the country is far more likely to shop exclusively at Walmart than anyone in the city, and likely to prefer more non-perishable food (i.e. processed) because daily or multiple times a week shopping trips are infeasible. The farms in rural areas are generally focused on growing a single thing (either one type of livestock, or all corn, etc.), entirely for wholesale, farmers markets are a distraction for most of them, outside of smaller farms that are more of a lifestyle / hobby thing a lot of the time. Farm stands sometimes exist, but they're an exception rather than the rule in most places, and unless you're in an area known for growing fruit or something like that (and primarily selling to tourists driving by) it'll be one-off things like sweet corn in season or eggs.
cosmodisk 5y ago
Being poor doesn't make you fat per se, but if you look at most stats, higher social levels(whatever that means in each country) usually means less obesity. When I worked in construction, most people were eating an absolute crap and were often overweight. Then I joined a professional services company and I literally walked into an office of 50 or so people, where everybody was slim and most people ate pretty healthy, home made food. There are lots of factors why that's the case,but to say it's not happening like this wouldn't be right either.
istjohn 5y ago
This is true in a superficial sense. But healthy food is generally more expensive than junk food. Gym memberships, exercize equipment, personal trainers, and outdoor recreation costs time and money. It's hard to prioritize self-care when you're struggling with the day-to-day stresses of poverty, like how do I get to work after my car broke down for the third time this month. Poverty is stressful and stress-eating is a thing. Sure, there is no law of physics that makes poor people overweight, but it is much easier to have a thin waistline when you have a fat bank account. And indeed we observe that in the US, poor people are heavier than wealthier people.
indymike 5y ago
> Instead of seeing the bright side of life, in which this person clearly vastly improved their situation in life, all they can see is what they don’t have. I think there is a self-deprecating humor to the article, and I enjoyed it. Life in tech world is strange sometimes.
darkerside 5y ago
This one was odd. And why didn't she "belong" to the gym? This woman has impostor syndrome on steroids.
- istjohn 5y ago
  She states that she was made to feel unwelcome at the gym.
  - darkerside 5y ago
    What did she want, a Christmas card?
htamas 5y ago
Exactly my thoughts. This person just wants to make herself feel good about victimizing herself. Justifying unhealthy behaviour and habits by being poor earlier in her life? Come on. Yes, some of her colleagues seem to be on the other extremes, but many of her examples are just ridicolous. Eg: adult soccer leagues are one of the cheapest activities I can think of, besides running (which is also done by "rich" people). I'm also coming from a poor family and area, and I also had a few revelations, but nothing like this. My very first of these experiences was at a company paid dinner, where the waiters rolled out a trolley of beverages next to our a table and went away for a couple of minutes. I joked to my colleagues at the table that we could just steal that trolley and nobody would notice it. Nobody laughed, of course and I realised that at that point in my life I could buy a truck of those beverages on my hourly wage. That was nearly 3 months into my career and I just moved on right away.
FriedrichN 5y ago
I must say I was rather triggered by that statement. I'm 100% sure that at one point my earnings were much lower than hers and I wasn't "a fat body". I had a second hand road bike that consisted of many different parts and I loved that thing, I've put thousands of kilometers on that old frame. And guess what, I still use it to this day, even though I could buy a fancy new one. As a matter of fact, not having a lot of money only emphasizes the fact that your health is one of the things you can influence.
- MattRix 5y ago
  Did you grow up poor, as she did? If not, then you are missing the important context of what it’s like to grow up in a food scarce environment.
  - FriedrichN 5y ago
    We never had much money, but we ate well. And I ate a lot, but I was also very active. Being active is free. I know this will upset people, but if poor people are fat, food is not scarce. The quality of food may be low, but low food quality does not make one fat, a surplus of calories does. To be absolutely clear, I know there is a strong correlation between socioeconomic status and obesity. It's much more complicated than "just eat less", many factors play into this. Including food IQ. It's much more easy to overeat on Cheetos than it is on potatoes and green beans. A persons social environment will have a big influence on how and what they eat, how much they will move, etc.
    - MattRix 5y ago
      Low quality food absolutely can make you fat because it makes it harder to eat properly. Unhealthy food isn’t just “easier to overeat” but also messes with insulin to make you feel more hungry than you actually are.
    - CRConrad 5y ago
      > The quality of food may be low, but low food quality does not make one fat, a surplus of calories does. That low quality food is food with a surplus of calories. That's a large part of what makes it low quality.
hacker_newz 5y ago
If you think this person "clearly vastly improved their situation in life" you may need to read the article again.
- CountDrewku 5y ago
  Are you suggesting that she chose to be employed at a start up and is actively choosing to stay there because it's a worse situation than she had before?
websitescenes 5y ago
Victim blaming is THE classic tactic used to ignore the very real situational plights of many, if not most, Americans.
- isoskeles 5y ago
  Counterpoint: Playing the victim is THE classic tactic used to rationalize and excuse the behavior of many, if not most, Americans. (If you found this point incorrect, dumb, or worthless, consider that is how many people feel about the point I am replying to.)
  - websitescenes 5y ago
    The only difference is that if I’m wrong, some people got free stuff but if you’re wrong, people are languishing in despair with little to no lifeline. Are you willing to bet other peoples lives on the idea that your experience is truth? It’s not something I am willing to do; I value human life too much.
leoc 5y ago
It seems that much of Chapter 6 of Wigan Pier is still pretty relevant: http://www.george-orwell.org/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier/5.html http://www.george-orwell.org/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier/5.html
- istjohn 5y ago
  Would it not be better if they spent more money on wholesome things like oranges and wholemeal bread or if they even, like the writer of the letter to the New Statesman, saved on fuel and ate their carrots raw? Yes, it would, but the point is that no ordinary human being is ever going to do such a thing. The ordinary human being would sooner starve than live on brown bread and raw carrots. And the peculiar evil is this, that the less money you have, the less inclined you feel to spend it on wholesome food. A millionaire may enjoy breakfasting off orange juice and Ryvita biscuits; an unemployed man doesn't. Here the tendency of which I spoke at the end of the last chapter comes into play. When you are unemployed, which is to say when you are underfed, harassed, bored, and miserable, you don't want to eat dull wholesome food. You want something a little bit 'tasty'. There is always some cheaply pleasant thing to tempt you. Let's have three pennorth of chips! Run out and buy us a twopenny ice-cream! Put the kettle on and we'll all have a nice cup of tea! That is how your mind works when you are at the P.A.C. level. White bread-and-marg and sugared tea don't nourish you to any extent, but they are nicer (at least most people think so) than brown bread-and-dripping and cold water. Unemployment is an endless misery that has got to be constantly palliated, and especially with tea, the English-man's opium. A cup of tea or even an aspirin is much better as a temporary stimulant than a crust of brown bread.
  - leoc 5y ago
    Yes, but before that excerpt Orwell pointed out that the financial margins involved in eating healthily on the minimum income were much narrower than the "why don't they just" contingent knew or admitted. That doesn't carry over to the contemporary US as self-evidently as the psychological point does, but I suspect that it does carry over somewhat. I do encourage anyone who hasn't already to read the whole chapter http://www.george-orwell.org/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier/5.html http://www.george-orwell.org/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier/5.html : it's not really very long though I felt that the relevant parts were a bit too long, all together, to fit in a comment.
throwaway0a5e 5y ago
Everyone replying is saying various things about how it's not the poors fault that they've been taken advantage of and have crappy food options and that's why they're fat. They might be right about the bad food options but what these people don't get is that if you're poor you have a lot of bigger more time pressing, more tractable problems to solve than being fat. Most of these people would still be fat if they had more ready access to "good" food because good food wouldn't magically make being fat jump to the top of their priority list. When you have little money you can very easily justify skipping lunch everyday or something like that. Skipping breakfast or lunch, having a very minimal meal for the one you don't skip (think PB&J, maybe with a fruit cup if you're feeling like a high roller) and then having your big meal at dinner so that your hunger is focused on the parts of the day when you're working and distracted and you go to sleep full is a very, very, tractable form of dieting and cost cutting rolled into one. But if you have enough money to indulge in food/beer then why not do it, it's about the only luxury you can afford.
umeshunni 5y ago
Am I the only one who realizes that this is a work of fiction. This is the author: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meg_Elison https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meg_Elison
- xsmasher 5y ago
  Some elements, like being fat and going to Berkeley match up; what makes you conclude it is a work of fiction?

est31 5y ago

There are food deserts in the USA, where you literally can't buy high quality food like vegetables in a large area, and have to resort to only eating the highly processed and highly unhealthy food. These food deserts usually are located in the poorer neighbourhoods. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_desert https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_desert

andrewnicolalde 5y ago
TIL, thank you!
gadders 5y ago
Then eat less of it?
- ratww 5y ago
  Eating healthy is not just about eating less, it's also about eating the right things. If eating was just about quantity then nobody would eat salads, there would be no Keto diet, and nobody would complain about McDonalds.
  - gadders 5y ago
    Calories In/Calories Out is 90% of it. You're better off being relatively slim on junk food than being fat on good quality good.
    - istjohn 5y ago
      But junk food is less filling and satiating than real food and much more dense calorically. You can eat lettuce all day and never consume the number of calories in a fast food burger.
    - teachingassist 5y ago
      > You're better off being relatively slim on junk food than being fat on good quality good. This has consistently proved false. Being 'underweight' is associated with significant excess death; being 'overweight' is associated with a lower death rate than 'normal' BMI: e.g. https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/article-abstract/200731 https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/article-abstract/20073... (many other sources are available)
      - albedoa 5y ago
        Can you help me reconcile the apparent contradiction between the title and the results? Title: > Excess Deaths Associated With [...] Overweight Results: > Overweight was not associated with excess mortality (−86 094 deaths; 95% CI, −161 223 to −10 966).
        teachingassist 5y ago
        I'd translate this title into non-academic English as: "Are excess deaths associated with being overweight?" (The result is: no - or actually yes, but negatively).
      - proxyon 5y ago
        > Being 'underweight' is associated with significant excess death; being 'overweight' is associated with a lower death rate than 'normal' BMI: This is nonsense. In many medical deaths such as cancer (and especially since euthanasia isn't available) the person dies by slowly withering away. One of the first things that happens is that they become skinny and frail. That doesn't associate underweightedness with mortality. It intentionally draws a false correlation.
monoideism 5y ago
Food deserts are a big problem. Most of the urban food deserts developed after major riots burned down existing grocery stores in the late 60s (and then again in the 80s in LA). New food deserts now exist in Minneapolis (and likely other cities as well) after the recent rioting and burning there: https://www.startribune.com/minneapolis-longfellow-neighborhood-almost-food-desert-after-riots/570928442/ https://www.startribune.com/minneapolis-longfellow-neighborh... https://www.marketplace.org/2020/06/04/neighborhoods-where-stores-were-destroyed-become-food-deserts-overnight/ https://www.marketplace.org/2020/06/04/neighborhoods-where-s... Ironically, in the most recent riots, many - perhaps most - of the destructive rioters were middle-class "activist" kids who don't have to live with the results of their actions.
Kharvok 5y ago
Food deserts mostly myth. I'm looking for the study in my notes but there is only a very slight difference in diets between tax brackets.
CountDrewku 5y ago
Which supermarket chains in the US do not provide vegetables, fruit, meat and only offer processed food? Please find us a 'food desert' where there are no supermarkets nearby. This is a myth that's easily refuted. There's an argument to be made that poorer people aren't educated on healthy food choices but the idea that they don't have access to anything but processed food is just silly.

8fGTBjZxBcHq 5y ago

It's normal and cool actually that we can take something that affects a MAJORITY of Americans and is tightly correlated to poverty and make it a matter of individual responsibility and moral weakness.

emteycz 5y ago
It is correlated, not caused by poverty. Rich people are often fat too, and the reason is poor education (not even rich people schools teach this) and poor self-control.
- muglug 5y ago
  It’s not just food education. If you’re poor in the US you’re much less likely to live near a source of fresh meat and produce, which makes calorie-rich fast food more tempting. You’re more at the mercy of many multi-billion-dollar industries that serve unhealthy food to the masses.
  - jjdin14 5y ago
    “Less likely”, “more at the mercy”, it still comes down to the individuals choices, it’s not that hard to not be obese when poor.
    - MattRix 5y ago
      “it’s not that hard to not be obese when poor.” The statistics make it quite clear that it is hard, maybe your assumptions are wrong.
      - username90 5y ago
        Or your assumption wrong. Here is a reasonable explanation: People are poor since they got bad self control, which also makes them fat. People who lack self control are easily tempted with shitty fast food, so their areas mostly serves it rather than real food creating these "food deserts". If there was demand for food in those areas people would sell it, but there isn't. Edit: A strong piece of evidence is that people aren't getting poorer, but they sure are getting fatter.

teachingassist 5y ago

Food insecurity is an aspect of poverty and is not uncommon in the United States. "Your eating choices" as a poor person might be to eat what and when and where you can afford to.

username90 5y ago
Why could people manage to stay slim 20 years ago but not today? It isn't like the poor are more insecure now than back then.
- teachingassist 5y ago
  The last 20 years has probably made (much) less difference than you appear to think. From Wikipedia: "The rate of increase in the incidence of obesity began to slow in the 2000s". But, to attempt to answer your question: e.g., the expectation that both adults in a household will work means that people/parents are more likely to be time-poor and not able to cook. Cooking skills have been lost.
fmajid 5y ago
Eating choices are not really choices (or Hobson's choices) when you have to work multiple jobs to make ends meet and have no time left for food prep.

watwut 5y ago

> Instead of seeing the bright side of life, in which this person clearly vastly improved their situation in life, all they can see is what they don’t have. First, I dont think this accurately describes the list at all. Second, it is ok for people to express negative feelings or observations. Forced positivity is toxic.

jgtrosh 5y ago

Obesity is significantly correlated with lower income. However, in an individual case it is not sufficient to draw conclusions. Edit: also you seem to present the author's formulation as meaning that they believe poverty caused them to be fat. As far as I can tell she is merely pointing out a series of correlations to both prove that she, in fact, stood out as poor, and to show how this distinction affected her furthermore. Btw I'd say the only actively harmful behaviour from the company she pointed out was making her suggest a salary rather than them making an offering.

Cthulhu_ 5y ago

wow never thought about it like that thanks im cured

benatkin 5y ago
Thinking about it like that (my eating choices) is actually how I lost 15 pounds once, haha. I gained it back.

DigitalSea 5y ago

There are quite a few papers out there on the subject. As someone who has studied a little bit of sociology, I can tell you there are numerous sociological factors which basically determine that wealthier people have access to better food, better medical care and live healthier lives in comparison to lower-socioeconomic people. Where you live alone determines your health equity, if you live in a remote area or small town away from a large city, your access to fresh and non-processed foods is heavily reduced. This is a great paper I suggest you read: https://academic.oup.com/epirev/article/29/1/29/433380 https://academic.oup.com/epirev/article/29/1/29/433380 -- this is a good starting point, there are others spanning back the last three decades or so. It is also worth noting that it's not necessarily how much money you have that is the contributing factor, it can be other factors. The lack of green areas or pathways to walk/exercise (especially prevalent in remote Australian communities), the number of hospitals or doctors close by. But, ultimately, lack of health services and fresh food are correlated to obesity both of which are determined by your location which, in turn, is determined by your financial status.

giantg2 5y ago
"if you live in a remote area or small town away from a large city, your access to fresh and non-processed foods is heavily reduced." This simply isn't true. Most food deserts are in the poorer areas of the cities because nobody is bringing fresh produce in there to sell. If you live in the country or small town, many of these places have farm stands, farmers markets, and local farmers providing seasonal produce to the local stores. Not to mention, lower density housing generally means that there is enough land to have a veggie garden, depending on the specific circumstances.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- ryanbrunner 5y ago
  Rural areas being chock full of farmers markets is mostly nostalgia, anyone I know who lives in the country is far more likely to shop exclusively at Walmart than anyone in the city, and likely to prefer more non-perishable food (i.e. processed) because daily or multiple times a week shopping trips are infeasible. The farms in rural areas are generally focused on growing a single thing (either one type of livestock, or all corn, etc.), entirely for wholesale, farmers markets are a distraction for most of them, outside of smaller farms that are more of a lifestyle / hobby thing a lot of the time. Farm stands sometimes exist, but they're an exception rather than the rule in most places, and unless you're in an area known for growing fruit or something like that (and primarily selling to tourists driving by) it'll be one-off things like sweet corn in season or eggs.

cosmodisk 5y ago

Being poor doesn't make you fat per se, but if you look at most stats, higher social levels(whatever that means in each country) usually means less obesity. When I worked in construction, most people were eating an absolute crap and were often overweight. Then I joined a professional services company and I literally walked into an office of 50 or so people, where everybody was slim and most people ate pretty healthy, home made food. There are lots of factors why that's the case,but to say it's not happening like this wouldn't be right either.

istjohn 5y ago

This is true in a superficial sense. But healthy food is generally more expensive than junk food. Gym memberships, exercize equipment, personal trainers, and outdoor recreation costs time and money. It's hard to prioritize self-care when you're struggling with the day-to-day stresses of poverty, like how do I get to work after my car broke down for the third time this month. Poverty is stressful and stress-eating is a thing. Sure, there is no law of physics that makes poor people overweight, but it is much easier to have a thin waistline when you have a fat bank account. And indeed we observe that in the US, poor people are heavier than wealthier people.

indymike 5y ago

> Instead of seeing the bright side of life, in which this person clearly vastly improved their situation in life, all they can see is what they don’t have. I think there is a self-deprecating humor to the article, and I enjoyed it. Life in tech world is strange sometimes.

darkerside 5y ago

This one was odd. And why didn't she "belong" to the gym? This woman has impostor syndrome on steroids.

istjohn 5y ago
She states that she was made to feel unwelcome at the gym.
- darkerside 5y ago
  What did she want, a Christmas card?

htamas 5y ago

Exactly my thoughts. This person just wants to make herself feel good about victimizing herself. Justifying unhealthy behaviour and habits by being poor earlier in her life? Come on. Yes, some of her colleagues seem to be on the other extremes, but many of her examples are just ridicolous. Eg: adult soccer leagues are one of the cheapest activities I can think of, besides running (which is also done by "rich" people). I'm also coming from a poor family and area, and I also had a few revelations, but nothing like this. My very first of these experiences was at a company paid dinner, where the waiters rolled out a trolley of beverages next to our a table and went away for a couple of minutes. I joked to my colleagues at the table that we could just steal that trolley and nobody would notice it. Nobody laughed, of course and I realised that at that point in my life I could buy a truck of those beverages on my hourly wage. That was nearly 3 months into my career and I just moved on right away.

FriedrichN 5y ago

I must say I was rather triggered by that statement. I'm 100% sure that at one point my earnings were much lower than hers and I wasn't "a fat body". I had a second hand road bike that consisted of many different parts and I loved that thing, I've put thousands of kilometers on that old frame. And guess what, I still use it to this day, even though I could buy a fancy new one. As a matter of fact, not having a lot of money only emphasizes the fact that your health is one of the things you can influence.

MattRix 5y ago
Did you grow up poor, as she did? If not, then you are missing the important context of what it’s like to grow up in a food scarce environment.
- FriedrichN 5y ago
  We never had much money, but we ate well. And I ate a lot, but I was also very active. Being active is free. I know this will upset people, but if poor people are fat, food is not scarce. The quality of food may be low, but low food quality does not make one fat, a surplus of calories does. To be absolutely clear, I know there is a strong correlation between socioeconomic status and obesity. It's much more complicated than "just eat less", many factors play into this. Including food IQ. It's much more easy to overeat on Cheetos than it is on potatoes and green beans. A persons social environment will have a big influence on how and what they eat, how much they will move, etc.
  - MattRix 5y ago
    Low quality food absolutely can make you fat because it makes it harder to eat properly. Unhealthy food isn’t just “easier to overeat” but also messes with insulin to make you feel more hungry than you actually are.
  - CRConrad 5y ago
    > The quality of food may be low, but low food quality does not make one fat, a surplus of calories does. That low quality food is food with a surplus of calories. That's a large part of what makes it low quality.

hacker_newz 5y ago

If you think this person "clearly vastly improved their situation in life" you may need to read the article again.

CountDrewku 5y ago
Are you suggesting that she chose to be employed at a start up and is actively choosing to stay there because it's a worse situation than she had before?

websitescenes 5y ago

Victim blaming is THE classic tactic used to ignore the very real situational plights of many, if not most, Americans.

isoskeles 5y ago
Counterpoint: Playing the victim is THE classic tactic used to rationalize and excuse the behavior of many, if not most, Americans. (If you found this point incorrect, dumb, or worthless, consider that is how many people feel about the point I am replying to.)
- websitescenes 5y ago
  The only difference is that if I’m wrong, some people got free stuff but if you’re wrong, people are languishing in despair with little to no lifeline. Are you willing to bet other peoples lives on the idea that your experience is truth? It’s not something I am willing to do; I value human life too much.

leoc 5y ago

It seems that much of Chapter 6 of Wigan Pier is still pretty relevant: http://www.george-orwell.org/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier/5.html http://www.george-orwell.org/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier/5.html

istjohn 5y ago
Would it not be better if they spent more money on wholesome things like oranges and wholemeal bread or if they even, like the writer of the letter to the New Statesman, saved on fuel and ate their carrots raw? Yes, it would, but the point is that no ordinary human being is ever going to do such a thing. The ordinary human being would sooner starve than live on brown bread and raw carrots. And the peculiar evil is this, that the less money you have, the less inclined you feel to spend it on wholesome food. A millionaire may enjoy breakfasting off orange juice and Ryvita biscuits; an unemployed man doesn't. Here the tendency of which I spoke at the end of the last chapter comes into play. When you are unemployed, which is to say when you are underfed, harassed, bored, and miserable, you don't want to eat dull wholesome food. You want something a little bit 'tasty'. There is always some cheaply pleasant thing to tempt you. Let's have three pennorth of chips! Run out and buy us a twopenny ice-cream! Put the kettle on and we'll all have a nice cup of tea! That is how your mind works when you are at the P.A.C. level. White bread-and-marg and sugared tea don't nourish you to any extent, but they are nicer (at least most people think so) than brown bread-and-dripping and cold water. Unemployment is an endless misery that has got to be constantly palliated, and especially with tea, the English-man's opium. A cup of tea or even an aspirin is much better as a temporary stimulant than a crust of brown bread.
- leoc 5y ago
  Yes, but before that excerpt Orwell pointed out that the financial margins involved in eating healthily on the minimum income were much narrower than the "why don't they just" contingent knew or admitted. That doesn't carry over to the contemporary US as self-evidently as the psychological point does, but I suspect that it does carry over somewhat. I do encourage anyone who hasn't already to read the whole chapter http://www.george-orwell.org/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier/5.html http://www.george-orwell.org/The_Road_to_Wigan_Pier/5.html : it's not really very long though I felt that the relevant parts were a bit too long, all together, to fit in a comment.

throwaway0a5e 5y ago

Everyone replying is saying various things about how it's not the poors fault that they've been taken advantage of and have crappy food options and that's why they're fat. They might be right about the bad food options but what these people don't get is that if you're poor you have a lot of bigger more time pressing, more tractable problems to solve than being fat. Most of these people would still be fat if they had more ready access to "good" food because good food wouldn't magically make being fat jump to the top of their priority list. When you have little money you can very easily justify skipping lunch everyday or something like that. Skipping breakfast or lunch, having a very minimal meal for the one you don't skip (think PB&J, maybe with a fruit cup if you're feeling like a high roller) and then having your big meal at dinner so that your hunger is focused on the parts of the day when you're working and distracted and you go to sleep full is a very, very, tractable form of dieting and cost cutting rolled into one. But if you have enough money to indulge in food/beer then why not do it, it's about the only luxury you can afford.

umeshunni 5y ago

Am I the only one who realizes that this is a work of fiction. This is the author: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meg_Elison https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meg_Elison

xsmasher 5y ago
Some elements, like being fat and going to Berkeley match up; what makes you conclude it is a work of fiction?