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Compared to a tank full of gasoline?

MengerSponge 5y ago
Yes. Gasoline has a relatively narrow ignition range, it has much less rigorous sealing requirements, and it burns with a flame that's visible in daylight. The problem is that we can't easily make gasoline with solar panels and water.
- adrian_b 5y ago
  Actually it is possible to make gasoline with solar panels, water and carbon dioxide from the air. Making synthetic gasoline was already possible before WWII and that was used a lot by Germany. It is true that making hydrogen is easier, because making gasoline requires additional steps and equipment, but due to the large disadvantages of storing and handling hydrogen, making gasoline is nonetheless preferable and it does not require any infrastructure change. While hydrogen is preferred currently for room-temperature fuel cells, for the moment that seems like a dead end, because the current catalysts are much too expensive. High-temperature fuel cells can use gasoline, so hydrogen no longer has advantages. Even if one would not choose gasoline, there are still other much better ways to chemically store solar energy than hydrogen, e.g. ammonia or methanol.
  - SigmundA 5y ago
    Or just charge a battery with the solar panels at much greater efficiency.
    - adrian_b 5y ago
      For short-term storage a rechargeable battery is certainly preferable. For long-term storage, the battery auto-discharges, so the efficiency drops quickly with the storage time, until it becomes much less than for storing the energy by synthesizing some appropriate chemical compound. For storing solar energy, both short-term storage (e.g. for a day or a week), like rechargeable batteries, and long-term storage (e.g. for a year or more), like synthetic gasoline, are needed.
      - SigmundA 5y ago
        Lithium self discharges at 1-2% per month, not an issue in most circumstances, not sure where it would be an issue, if it was just have a maintaining solar panel nearby.
  - MengerSponge 5y ago
    Wasn't Germany's synthetic gasoline derived from coal? Fun fact: methanol has a similar "invisible fire" risk, which is the origin of the "Don't let the invisible fire burn my friend" joke in Talladega Nights.

Yes. Gasoline has a relatively narrow ignition range, it has much less rigorous sealing requirements, and it burns with a flame that's visible in daylight. The problem is that we can't easily make gasoline with solar panels and water.

adrian_b 5y ago
Actually it is possible to make gasoline with solar panels, water and carbon dioxide from the air. Making synthetic gasoline was already possible before WWII and that was used a lot by Germany. It is true that making hydrogen is easier, because making gasoline requires additional steps and equipment, but due to the large disadvantages of storing and handling hydrogen, making gasoline is nonetheless preferable and it does not require any infrastructure change. While hydrogen is preferred currently for room-temperature fuel cells, for the moment that seems like a dead end, because the current catalysts are much too expensive. High-temperature fuel cells can use gasoline, so hydrogen no longer has advantages. Even if one would not choose gasoline, there are still other much better ways to chemically store solar energy than hydrogen, e.g. ammonia or methanol.
- SigmundA 5y ago
  Or just charge a battery with the solar panels at much greater efficiency.
  - adrian_b 5y ago
    For short-term storage a rechargeable battery is certainly preferable. For long-term storage, the battery auto-discharges, so the efficiency drops quickly with the storage time, until it becomes much less than for storing the energy by synthesizing some appropriate chemical compound. For storing solar energy, both short-term storage (e.g. for a day or a week), like rechargeable batteries, and long-term storage (e.g. for a year or more), like synthetic gasoline, are needed.
    - SigmundA 5y ago
      Lithium self discharges at 1-2% per month, not an issue in most circumstances, not sure where it would be an issue, if it was just have a maintaining solar panel nearby.
- MengerSponge 5y ago
  Wasn't Germany's synthetic gasoline derived from coal? Fun fact: methanol has a similar "invisible fire" risk, which is the origin of the "Don't let the invisible fire burn my friend" joke in Talladega Nights.