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Tesla isn't a car company, though. They even removed "Motors" from their name years ago - showing wider interest, and not just batteries. Solar roofing as well,

Tesla isn't a car company, though. They even removed "Motors" from their name years ago - showing wider interest, and not just batteries. Solar roofing as well, and others. I don't hold TSLA right now, regretfully, I entered pre-split at $27 and sold at $200. I also think the current price is way too high, for what it's worth. WAY too high. But it's not at all about cars, at least not for me, when trying to justify the valuation. It's about energy at large scale, and transportation at large scale. Not just car sales. Or battery sales. Edit: Currently P/E is ~570! I remember it being 1,300 recently. Yikes.

kikokikokiko 5y ago
Take a look at the "Common Sense Skeptic" youtube channel. Tesla's purchase of Solar City is a scandal on itself, it was never a play on entering the solar roof business. It was just a bail out using Tesla's shareholders money to save Musks and his business partners (which were Musks cousins btw) investments. This channel also destroys all the hype surrounding Starship, it's a joy to watch.
- epistasis 5y ago
  It's quite possible for the Solar City purchase to have been executed at a terrible price that is basically crony capitalism and deserves jail time, while it simultaneously being a great value add for Tesla. Controlling solar generation, backup batteries, and car charging all at once is difficult when cobbling together pieces from vendors that don't interoperate, when there's nobody else willing to write the middle ware to connect it all. With Tesla's ridiculous valuation, they can make all sorts of terrible purchases like that and still succeed just fine.
- karolist 5y ago
  Everyone should watch this video, more so people who refer to other car companies as "legacy automakers". Another good channel to remove the veil is Thunderf00t.
  - Robotbeat 5y ago
    Thunderf00t’s criticisms ring pretty hollow, TBH. Criticism of Musk is one thing. The whole “remove the veil” sorta “red-pill” type language, criticism that Musk has never done anything useful or noteworthy other than scamming falls apart for anyone who has been paying attention for more than a couple years. Electric cars pre-Tesla were a joke. Tesla had enormous influence. And SpaceX (which was founded by Musk, who runs it as chief engineer) launched more mass to orbit last year than the rest of the world combined, a remarkable turnaround from the failure of US companies to be commercially competitive. There are things worth being skeptical of. “Full self-driving,” for instance or even, sure, the Solar City deal (although arguable). Perma-skeptics like Thunderf00t, though, never acknowledge this kind of stuff.
    - karolist 5y ago
      I agree with your main point, and not all of Thunderf00t's criticism and math is valid, some feels a bit forced, like in the SpaceX debunked video. I think he unintentionally built his channel around Musk skeptics and now has to follow the track he laid for himself. However, there's plenty of stuff to be skeptical about and I do not get the rebuttals that Musk created jobs, or helped put electric cars on the map therefore he's beyond criticism. I was his fan right till Thailand cave story developed. I think the hate Musk gets is fuelled by such shenanigans and more so by his fanboys online. I'm not informed enough to dig into your SpaceX claim but my first instinct would be to check if SpaceX lifted so much cargo just because they have that largest client (the US), that had no alternative options (Shuttle program discontinued). That is, no one else had clients with so much cargo lifting needs so no one lifted as much, but not because of technical ability. Because Musk likes to play with numbers like that. For example his claims about Boring company's price per mile looks impressive because he compares the boring price with the price of a complete metro project price (Thunderf00t's SpaceX debunked video has more details).
iamadog1 5y ago
The P/E is probably still skewed. They're accounting for the robotaxi windfall which is leveraging their buyback program, kind of ridiculous considering the constant delays and skepticism surrounding their fully autonomous system and then you've got to consider the regulatory hurdles that are inevitably going to develop after deployment.
jeffreyrogers 5y ago
Panasonic makes Tesla's batteries though. I've heard this argument since at least 2015. I was told then that Tesla was just leveraging Panasonic and would eventually make their own batteries. Still hasn't happened.

kikokikokiko 5y ago

Take a look at the "Common Sense Skeptic" youtube channel. Tesla's purchase of Solar City is a scandal on itself, it was never a play on entering the solar roof business. It was just a bail out using Tesla's shareholders money to save Musks and his business partners (which were Musks cousins btw) investments. This channel also destroys all the hype surrounding Starship, it's a joy to watch.

epistasis 5y ago
It's quite possible for the Solar City purchase to have been executed at a terrible price that is basically crony capitalism and deserves jail time, while it simultaneously being a great value add for Tesla. Controlling solar generation, backup batteries, and car charging all at once is difficult when cobbling together pieces from vendors that don't interoperate, when there's nobody else willing to write the middle ware to connect it all. With Tesla's ridiculous valuation, they can make all sorts of terrible purchases like that and still succeed just fine.
karolist 5y ago
Everyone should watch this video, more so people who refer to other car companies as "legacy automakers". Another good channel to remove the veil is Thunderf00t.
- Robotbeat 5y ago
  Thunderf00t’s criticisms ring pretty hollow, TBH. Criticism of Musk is one thing. The whole “remove the veil” sorta “red-pill” type language, criticism that Musk has never done anything useful or noteworthy other than scamming falls apart for anyone who has been paying attention for more than a couple years. Electric cars pre-Tesla were a joke. Tesla had enormous influence. And SpaceX (which was founded by Musk, who runs it as chief engineer) launched more mass to orbit last year than the rest of the world combined, a remarkable turnaround from the failure of US companies to be commercially competitive. There are things worth being skeptical of. “Full self-driving,” for instance or even, sure, the Solar City deal (although arguable). Perma-skeptics like Thunderf00t, though, never acknowledge this kind of stuff.
  - karolist 5y ago
    I agree with your main point, and not all of Thunderf00t's criticism and math is valid, some feels a bit forced, like in the SpaceX debunked video. I think he unintentionally built his channel around Musk skeptics and now has to follow the track he laid for himself. However, there's plenty of stuff to be skeptical about and I do not get the rebuttals that Musk created jobs, or helped put electric cars on the map therefore he's beyond criticism. I was his fan right till Thailand cave story developed. I think the hate Musk gets is fuelled by such shenanigans and more so by his fanboys online. I'm not informed enough to dig into your SpaceX claim but my first instinct would be to check if SpaceX lifted so much cargo just because they have that largest client (the US), that had no alternative options (Shuttle program discontinued). That is, no one else had clients with so much cargo lifting needs so no one lifted as much, but not because of technical ability. Because Musk likes to play with numbers like that. For example his claims about Boring company's price per mile looks impressive because he compares the boring price with the price of a complete metro project price (Thunderf00t's SpaceX debunked video has more details).

iamadog1 5y ago

The P/E is probably still skewed. They're accounting for the robotaxi windfall which is leveraging their buyback program, kind of ridiculous considering the constant delays and skepticism surrounding their fully autonomous system and then you've got to consider the regulatory hurdles that are inevitably going to develop after deployment.

jeffreyrogers 5y ago

Panasonic makes Tesla's batteries though. I've heard this argument since at least 2015. I was told then that Tesla was just leveraging Panasonic and would eventually make their own batteries. Still hasn't happened.