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"Japan’s mobile web operators generate revenue by making sites and content providers pay considerable fees for prominent positions in their default menus." Jap

"Japan’s mobile web operators generate revenue by making sites and content providers pay considerable fees for prominent positions in their default menus." Japan's mobile web is completely controlled by the carriers. This just doesn't feel right. I want my Internet to be uncontrolled, unregulated. I don't want to pay any carrier (Rogers in my case) anything above my plan fees to be able to use the services of my phone. Japan is obviously an advanced market (the article reads like science fiction in some places!), but at what cost do these advances come?

briansmith 18y ago
Either you have to let the carriers control things or you have to have regulation. Without regulation, the carriers are free to do what they want since they own the network. To force them to do things they don't want to do, you have to have regulation. If regulation is stifling innovation then you can abolish the regulations. But, that just means everybody is free to do what they want, and you are back to where you started.
- mtw 18y ago
  "Either you have to let the carriers control things or you have to have regulation" Apple proved this wrong, and I expect Google's android to do the same (well if they deliver what they announced)
  - alex_c 18y ago
    "Apple proved this wrong" Not really, some of the control shifted from the carriers to Apple, and the result isn't much better (or all that different overall)...
  - briansmith 18y ago
    "Apple proved this wrong" Where is Skype for iPhone? Why isn't tethering built into the iPhone? Why did they pull Netshare from the app store? "I expect Google's android to do the same." First, what can Android do that Windows Mobile and Symbian haven't already been doing for years? Android is just Google's attempt to get its advertisements displayed more often on mobile devices. It is the same thing that every advertising company has been trying to do in Japan, the US, and everywhere else ever since it's been possible to advertise on phones. Authorized retailers for AT&T/Verizon/etc. cannot sell any devices that aren't approved by the respective carrier. If the carrier doesn't approve the Android devices then they can only be sold at stores that don't sell service contracts. Those independent stores are not successful in the US, because everybody wants a phone tied to a service contract so that the cost of the phone is subsidized. If the carriers don't subsidize Android phones they will be priced out of the market. Further, any carrier can block any device. IMEI numbers are allocated in blocks and it isn't hard to identify the model based on the IMEI number. Without regulation ("net neutrality") they can also block any application or any protocol from operating on their network.
    - mtw 18y ago
      The Apple "platform" is not 100% free (you can't do yet voip or tethering), but for the first time, mobile software developers can deploy easily applications without asking permissions from carriers. Also, your web browsing experience on the iPhone is independent from the carrier. For instance, on any other carrier, they cram their links and "preferred partners" on starting page. Again, I agree there are limitations. If you are looking for complete "freedom", have a look at openmoko. "everybody wants a phone tied to a service contract so that the cost of the phone is subsidized" disagree. look at prepaid phones.
      - briansmith 18y ago
        Even with the iPhone, carriers have the final say. If AT&T doesn't like an application, it can just ask Apple to remove it from the AppStore. Or, they could just block the network access that the application needs to work (e.g. blacklist websites that the application contacts). It is true that the iPhone doesn't come with vendor customizations, which is nice. However, none of the AT&T phones I have purchased have been extensively customized either. Most prepaid phones are subsidized by the carriers that distribute them (e.g. AT&T GoPhone), and those phones are locked to that carrier and have customized firmware. In the US, there are very few OEM phone sales. That is why you only see Nokia stores in the very biggest cities here (Chicago, New York, LA); I don't think there are any Sony-Ericsson shops in the US at all. OEM phones just don't sell.

briansmith 18y ago

Either you have to let the carriers control things or you have to have regulation. Without regulation, the carriers are free to do what they want since they own the network. To force them to do things they don't want to do, you have to have regulation. If regulation is stifling innovation then you can abolish the regulations. But, that just means everybody is free to do what they want, and you are back to where you started.

mtw 18y ago
"Either you have to let the carriers control things or you have to have regulation" Apple proved this wrong, and I expect Google's android to do the same (well if they deliver what they announced)
- alex_c 18y ago
  "Apple proved this wrong" Not really, some of the control shifted from the carriers to Apple, and the result isn't much better (or all that different overall)...
- briansmith 18y ago
  "Apple proved this wrong" Where is Skype for iPhone? Why isn't tethering built into the iPhone? Why did they pull Netshare from the app store? "I expect Google's android to do the same." First, what can Android do that Windows Mobile and Symbian haven't already been doing for years? Android is just Google's attempt to get its advertisements displayed more often on mobile devices. It is the same thing that every advertising company has been trying to do in Japan, the US, and everywhere else ever since it's been possible to advertise on phones. Authorized retailers for AT&T/Verizon/etc. cannot sell any devices that aren't approved by the respective carrier. If the carrier doesn't approve the Android devices then they can only be sold at stores that don't sell service contracts. Those independent stores are not successful in the US, because everybody wants a phone tied to a service contract so that the cost of the phone is subsidized. If the carriers don't subsidize Android phones they will be priced out of the market. Further, any carrier can block any device. IMEI numbers are allocated in blocks and it isn't hard to identify the model based on the IMEI number. Without regulation ("net neutrality") they can also block any application or any protocol from operating on their network.
  - mtw 18y ago
    The Apple "platform" is not 100% free (you can't do yet voip or tethering), but for the first time, mobile software developers can deploy easily applications without asking permissions from carriers. Also, your web browsing experience on the iPhone is independent from the carrier. For instance, on any other carrier, they cram their links and "preferred partners" on starting page. Again, I agree there are limitations. If you are looking for complete "freedom", have a look at openmoko. "everybody wants a phone tied to a service contract so that the cost of the phone is subsidized" disagree. look at prepaid phones.
    - briansmith 18y ago
      Even with the iPhone, carriers have the final say. If AT&T doesn't like an application, it can just ask Apple to remove it from the AppStore. Or, they could just block the network access that the application needs to work (e.g. blacklist websites that the application contacts). It is true that the iPhone doesn't come with vendor customizations, which is nice. However, none of the AT&T phones I have purchased have been extensively customized either. Most prepaid phones are subsidized by the carriers that distribute them (e.g. AT&T GoPhone), and those phones are locked to that carrier and have customized firmware. In the US, there are very few OEM phone sales. That is why you only see Nokia stores in the very biggest cities here (Chicago, New York, LA); I don't think there are any Sony-Ericsson shops in the US at all. OEM phones just don't sell.