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Is this an article trying to generate sympathy for Facebook, claiming Apple is just as bad in this case and that they dont really care about privacy? Seems kind

by S_A_P 5y ago

Is this an article trying to generate sympathy for Facebook, claiming Apple is just as bad in this case and that they dont really care about privacy? Seems kinda suspect to me. Maybe I misinterpreted the tone here. I dont think Apple is all good and Facebook is all bad, but in the aggregate Apple does do more for privacy than Facebook and Facebook does want to know as much as possible about your life to push that into selling ads.

nerbert 5y ago
I read it more as an article looking back at things and describing the dynamics at play / unspoken intentions & the result. Apple pulled off a huge power move against Google and Facebook, and it paid off beautifully. It's worth taking a minute to describe what just happened.
echelon 5y ago
No sympathy for Facebook, but the article illuminates the vast anticompetitive hammer that Apple yields. Apple shouldn't be in charge of commerce on iPhone. It's as if there were only two electric companies, and they charged Tesla 30% to charge your car. The electric company is now in charge of the ads being beamed into your skull, because they had all the power and wanted more ways to make money. It's cute to say that it's in the name of consumer privacy and all, but really the powerful company is just thirsty for more. Apple is a monopoly's monopoly.
- eecc 5y ago
  > Apple shouldn't be in charge of commerce on iPhone. So who should be? Facebook? Google? Microsoft? Adobe? Disney? Samsung? How many APIs and app packaging do you think app developers would bother working with? How much time do you think it would take for the network effect to desertify all-but-one? Given the only incentive for these stores would be user monetization, how long would it take for the winner to make confetti out of your privacy? If Apple's strategy is "Privacy is a luxury item we embed in our products", how would breaking Apple's monopoly on Apple's products affect Privacy?
  - fortyrod 5y ago
    It's a tough one. I'm annoyed that Amazon forked Android and now I have to build for their store.
  - shkkmo 5y ago
    > how would breaking Apple's monopoly on Apple's products affect Privacy? Currently you are forced to use Apple's AppStore and payments. Apple invades your privacy and tracks your activity without any ability to opt out. If you could install other software on the devices you own, you would have a choice to avoid this tracking.
  - telendram 5y ago
    What @shkkmo said is right : the problem is the total absence of consumer choice. It's strange that he got downvoted for telling something so obvious.
    - eecc 5y ago
      Because you think installing another Store and its flavor of apps wouldn't also come with various degrees of pernicious privacy invasion? What's the point of choice if all choices are bad? This whole "Consumer Choice™" delusion is some wonder to behold.
- D-Coder 5y ago
  > Apple shouldn't be in charge of commerce on iPhone. So just opt in when the phone gives you the choice.
ctvo 5y ago
> I dont think Apple is all good and Facebook is all bad, but in the aggregate Apple does do more for privacy than Facebook and Facebook does want to know as much as possible about your life to push that into selling ads. The article was about how Apple is out maneuvering Facebook. By restricting Facebook's third party access to customer information, Apple reinforces its own advertising position. They recently added another placement to the search page in the AppStore, and will no doubt expand to more areas. Their hiring of a former Facebook ad executive is telling. It addresses this good guy / bad guy narrative. Apple is better at PR not necessarily better for consumer privacy.
- disgu 5y ago
  But not once has the problem been the fact that Facebook serves ads. It's also not a problem when Apple does it and the problem also isn't how much real estate the ads take up on the store or wherever they're shown. The problem has always been how Facebook gathers and uses the data they collect on you to better find out what ads to serve.
  - zaphar 5y ago
    The article isn't pointing out a problem with serving ads. It's discussing the PR strategies around the tracking that powers ads. Despite the fact that Apple is also tracking the user, it is winning the PR battle.
- shkkmo 5y ago
  I would disagree, Apple is absolutely better (or rather, less harmful) than Facebook when it comes to user privacy. This absolutely does not mean that Apple is realy a defender of consumer privacy. Apple does not support privacy out of principle but does it for PR and market share. Apple will (and does) happily compromise privacy for their bottom line.
telendram 5y ago
> in the aggregate Apple does do more for privacy than Facebook Then you are extremely naive. Apple takes away from you as much private data as it can. It's just very bad at exploiting it, primarily because the company already earns so much money, it's not even incentivized in recognizing the benefit of data mining. But with iPhones sells diminishing every year, the situation is changing. Growth must come from services. Apple will continue to slurp away your private data. Apple will invest more into this resource, and make more and more use of it, including for the targeted Ads that used to be "so evil" when they came from another Ad network, but hey, if it's Apple, it's different.

by S_A_P 5y ago

nerbert 5y ago

I read it more as an article looking back at things and describing the dynamics at play / unspoken intentions & the result. Apple pulled off a huge power move against Google and Facebook, and it paid off beautifully. It's worth taking a minute to describe what just happened.

echelon 5y ago

No sympathy for Facebook, but the article illuminates the vast anticompetitive hammer that Apple yields. Apple shouldn't be in charge of commerce on iPhone. It's as if there were only two electric companies, and they charged Tesla 30% to charge your car. The electric company is now in charge of the ads being beamed into your skull, because they had all the power and wanted more ways to make money. It's cute to say that it's in the name of consumer privacy and all, but really the powerful company is just thirsty for more. Apple is a monopoly's monopoly.

eecc 5y ago
> Apple shouldn't be in charge of commerce on iPhone. So who should be? Facebook? Google? Microsoft? Adobe? Disney? Samsung? How many APIs and app packaging do you think app developers would bother working with? How much time do you think it would take for the network effect to desertify all-but-one? Given the only incentive for these stores would be user monetization, how long would it take for the winner to make confetti out of your privacy? If Apple's strategy is "Privacy is a luxury item we embed in our products", how would breaking Apple's monopoly on Apple's products affect Privacy?
- fortyrod 5y ago
  It's a tough one. I'm annoyed that Amazon forked Android and now I have to build for their store.
- shkkmo 5y ago
  > how would breaking Apple's monopoly on Apple's products affect Privacy? Currently you are forced to use Apple's AppStore and payments. Apple invades your privacy and tracks your activity without any ability to opt out. If you could install other software on the devices you own, you would have a choice to avoid this tracking.
- telendram 5y ago
  What @shkkmo said is right : the problem is the total absence of consumer choice. It's strange that he got downvoted for telling something so obvious.
  - eecc 5y ago
    Because you think installing another Store and its flavor of apps wouldn't also come with various degrees of pernicious privacy invasion? What's the point of choice if all choices are bad? This whole "Consumer Choice™" delusion is some wonder to behold.
D-Coder 5y ago
> Apple shouldn't be in charge of commerce on iPhone. So just opt in when the phone gives you the choice.

ctvo 5y ago

> I dont think Apple is all good and Facebook is all bad, but in the aggregate Apple does do more for privacy than Facebook and Facebook does want to know as much as possible about your life to push that into selling ads. The article was about how Apple is out maneuvering Facebook. By restricting Facebook's third party access to customer information, Apple reinforces its own advertising position. They recently added another placement to the search page in the AppStore, and will no doubt expand to more areas. Their hiring of a former Facebook ad executive is telling. It addresses this good guy / bad guy narrative. Apple is better at PR not necessarily better for consumer privacy.

disgu 5y ago
But not once has the problem been the fact that Facebook serves ads. It's also not a problem when Apple does it and the problem also isn't how much real estate the ads take up on the store or wherever they're shown. The problem has always been how Facebook gathers and uses the data they collect on you to better find out what ads to serve.
- zaphar 5y ago
  The article isn't pointing out a problem with serving ads. It's discussing the PR strategies around the tracking that powers ads. Despite the fact that Apple is also tracking the user, it is winning the PR battle.
shkkmo 5y ago
I would disagree, Apple is absolutely better (or rather, less harmful) than Facebook when it comes to user privacy. This absolutely does not mean that Apple is realy a defender of consumer privacy. Apple does not support privacy out of principle but does it for PR and market share. Apple will (and does) happily compromise privacy for their bottom line.

telendram 5y ago

> in the aggregate Apple does do more for privacy than Facebook Then you are extremely naive. Apple takes away from you as much private data as it can. It's just very bad at exploiting it, primarily because the company already earns so much money, it's not even incentivized in recognizing the benefit of data mining. But with iPhones sells diminishing every year, the situation is changing. Growth must come from services. Apple will continue to slurp away your private data. Apple will invest more into this resource, and make more and more use of it, including for the targeted Ads that used to be "so evil" when they came from another Ad network, but hey, if it's Apple, it's different.