5 ms·

Show HN: I built uFincs – a privacy-first, encrypted personal finance app

58 points by devinsit 5y ago

devinsit 5y ago
Hey HN! I'm excited to (officially) show off the project I've been working on (for far too long): uFincs, a privacy-first personal finance app! https://ufincs.com https://ufincs.com Yes, it's another personal finance app. Yes, there sure are a lot of them. But when I got tired of using GnuCash a couple years ago, I figured I should try something a little different and throw my hat in the ring. The result? No banks, no budgets, no data collecting. Just a clean UI, a privacy-first attitude, and good old double-entry accounting. The main thing that makes us so 'privacy-first' is the fact that we do client-side encryption: all of the financial data that you enter is encrypted before it leaves your browser and hits our servers. That way, you maintain sole ownership of your data. Want more of the juicy technical details? Check out our security overview: https://ufincs.com/policies/security https://ufincs.com/policies/security If you want to skip past all of the marketing fluff, feel free to drop into using the app right away: https://ufincs.com/noaccount https://ufincs.com/noaccount. Since uFincs is offline-first and a PWA, we can offer the ability to use the app completely without an account, for free! Of course, if you want to easily access your data on all your devices, that's where a paid account comes in handy :) And if you're getting some mad déjà vu from all this, it's because I commented about uFincs a couple weeks ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26970716 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26970716 Finally, since I know some people were hesitant about the pricing, I decided to throw together a special coupon just for you guys: "HN15". It's 15% off, forever, on any of the plans, for the first 100 new sign-ups. If you have any questions, feel free to check out out the FAQ (https://ufincs.com/faq https://ufincs.com/faq), but I'll be here all day to respond to any comments!
- agentdrtran 5y ago
  Any plans for Plaid/etc integration for transaction syncing?
  - devinsit 5y ago
    Absolutely none at all! uFincs is all about manual entry (although CSV import + recurring transactions makes things a bit easier). I made a deliberate choice to not support any bank integrations for privacy reasons (although simplicity is also a big factor).
    - qshaman 5y ago
      privacy in what sense? the bank owns your data already, if you don't store any user data in the cloud, then is private by design, right? I was looking for something like this, but I do need auto import my transaction data, across all banks and brokers, etc. Offline first and only, ala Personal Capital, but secure and safe. Paying 20 bucks a month for the privilege of manual data entry is a bit much. There is a bunch of open source alternatives(GNU Cash, etc...), that let you manually enter your data. That said, this is my particular use case. I do wish you the best, and the app does look pretty.
      - devinsit 5y ago
        Privacy in the sense that, while the bank may own your data already, third-parties like Plaid do not. And at least up in here Canada, we're a bit weaker on the whole 'bank API' system, so it generally turns into a wonderful game of "hand over your bank account credentials". Anyways, I definitely understand where you're coming from. Plenty of other products that do have bank integrations though, so at least of there's lots of options for you! And thanks for the design feedback :)
        qshaman 5y ago
        Plaid is own by Visa, but I get your point. As I said, wish you the best!
        skinnymuch 5y ago
        The deal did not go through. Plaid just got valued at close to triple what Visa was going to spend on it in a recent fund raise at around $14B post money.
- jimkleiber 5y ago
  Ah, I really like how clean the UI feels and also the e2ee. I'd love if this also could have a mobile app, as I then could document transactions on the go more easily. Any plans for a mobile app?
  - devinsit 5y ago
    Thanks for the feedback on the UI! Definitely put some time into trying to get that right. And yep, we have plans for dedicated mobile/desktop apps for sometime this year. Android will almost certainly come before iOS though.
- huhtenberg 5y ago
  Privacy-first finance app should really have a self-hosted option front and center. That's not even negotiable. That's because otherwise the privacy property of the app hinges on a trust in vendor and the assumption that they won't serve some funny JS on the next page reload. The one and only way to address this is to provide a self-hosted, completely self-contained version. There's really no way around this. It's not a matter of encrypting things or storing them locally, it's a matter of divorcing yourself as a developer from users' data. Right now, it's a packaged deal. PS. Looks very nice though. Clearly lots of thought went into the design and UX elements. This part is really well done!
  - devinsit 5y ago
    Yep, I agree. If you want perfect security and a 100% trust-less solution, then uFincs certainly isn't it. But I like to think that, at least when put in contrast with other products on the market, choosing to do these privacy/security related things is better than not. I elaborate on this further in our security doc (https://ufincs.com/policies/security#the-catch https://ufincs.com/policies/security#the-catch) and the FAQ (https://ufincs.com/faq#is-a-ufincs-a-trustless-system https://ufincs.com/faq#is-a-ufincs-a-trustless-system).
    - huhtenberg 5y ago
      Well, the thing is that if you say "privacy-first", you are pitching to people who care about this sort of thing. For these people the fact that uFincs is not self-hosted is an instant no-go. And for people who don't see it as a problem, the privacy angle doesn't matter much either. See the disconnect? You have a good product, for sure, but the pitch needs a revision.
      - devinsit 5y ago
        Oh I'm well aware of the disconnect. I just disagree that there are only people who care about privacy to the degree that they have to self-host everything. I believe there's room to ride the line between being 'privacy-first' (in that we care about privacy, first and foremost) and offering convenience (i.e. providing a web app). I'm sure my customers who signed up with ProtonMail and Fastmail addresses can attest to that fact. And for those who do fall all the way to the self-hosting side, well, there's plenty of other options on the market! Of course, there's nothing stopping us from being one of those options, it's just not our priority at this very moment.
- kemonocode 5y ago
  Others have already mentioned how it's a non-starter if there isn't an option to self-host so I won't bring that up: instead, for those who don't mind that I'd suggest easier means to import data from existing formats. Offer an on-ramp for people who too are fed up of GnuCash or have been using Ledger up until now and could use something friendlier. Best of luck in your project!
likecarter 5y ago
Looks nice! What language is this written in?
- devinsit 5y ago
  Thanks! The app itself is all React + Redux + TypeScript. Backend API is Node + Feathers + TypeScript. So certainly nothing fancy.
  - mritchie712 5y ago
    tailwind too, right?
    - devinsit 5y ago
      The marketing site (https://ufincs.com https://ufincs.com) uses React + NextJS + Tailwind. The app itself (https://app.ufincs.com https://app.ufincs.com) uses a design system that I built completely custom (with plain old Sass).
jedimastert 5y ago
I really appreciate the "Get out your credit card" call to action. Just the right kind of humor for a personal finance site. Super tiny nit: I might put the per-month cost next to the annual price (and maybe how many months/years next to the lifetime cost). It was not immediately apparent to me that the annual price is 50% cheaper, which is fairly substantial.
- devinsit 5y ago
  Yeah, deciding to go straight-shooter with some of copy was definitely a risk, but thanks for letting me know that you appreciate it :) And yeah, the pricing section could definitely be made clearer on that. Thanks for the feedback.
p2detar 5y ago
The problem I've always had with these type of apps is keeping them in sync with what I've spent using my CC or bank transfers. After a while it gets truly annoying to import or god forbid type in all weekly transactions. I see that CSV import is supported. For people like me it will be truly useful to outline, with examples, how and what exactly can be automated using CSV or other methods. In my family we use Wallet [1], which allows for shared family accounts, budgets and bank account sync. The app definitely has some issues, like because of the PSD2 requirements, sync sometimes fails for some banks. It lacks a solid algorithm that recognizes/remembers the type of synced expenses. It also lacks some features like investment type of accounts that support stocks or crypto with real-time updates. That being said, it still provides an immediate look over our current finances and monthly balance with as little need for account management as possible. I hope this feedback helps. [1] https://budgetbakers.com https://budgetbakers.com
- devinsit 5y ago
  I can definitely see where you're coming from regarding the whole syncing thing. Personally, I've gotten into a habit of recording my transactions right after they happen (or at worst, at the end of the day), but somehow I get the feeling that I'm particularly crazy for doing that. In any case, I agree that we could do better as far as showing examples/features altogether, but I figured (at least for the time being), just letting people use the app without an account (https://ufincs.com/noaccount https://ufincs.com/noaccount) is as good a demo as any. Definitely useful feedback, thanks!
falcolas 5y ago
I know this is probably useless feedback, but here's how I read the product name: You Finks! For what it's worth.
- devinsit 5y ago
  Yep, that's basically how it's said.
patrickmn 5y ago
Hahah this gif https://ufincs.com/assets/images/features-autocomplete-5B7713254C1DA557465C7E6BE5B81004A144B8D7.gif https://ufincs.com/assets/images/features-autocomplete-5B771... Looks very, very nice for a solo project!
- devinsit 5y ago
  Thank you!
skinnymuch 5y ago
Is the writing under pricing for yearly and lifetime of entering one transaction supposed to be humor? I’m assuming so based on the overall vibe. I wonder if it will be confusing for people though. The product isn’t for me at all, personally, because of wanting integrations/automation. But the app and sales pages look beautiful. I feel motivated enough to get off iPad and hacker news and get going on a side React project now.

58 points by devinsit 5y ago

Hey HN! I'm excited to (officially) show off the project I've been working on (for far too long): uFincs, a privacy-first personal finance app! https://ufincs.com https://ufincs.com Yes, it's another personal finance app. Yes, there sure are a lot of them. But when I got tired of using GnuCash a couple years ago, I figured I should try something a little different and throw my hat in the ring. The result? No banks, no budgets, no data collecting. Just a clean UI, a privacy-first attitude, and good old double-entry accounting. The main thing that makes us so 'privacy-first' is the fact that we do client-side encryption: all of the financial data that you enter is encrypted before it leaves your browser and hits our servers. That way, you maintain sole ownership of your data. Want more of the juicy technical details? Check out our security overview: https://ufincs.com/policies/security https://ufincs.com/policies/security If you want to skip past all of the marketing fluff, feel free to drop into using the app right away: https://ufincs.com/noaccount https://ufincs.com/noaccount. Since uFincs is offline-first and a PWA, we can offer the ability to use the app completely without an account, for free! Of course, if you want to easily access your data on all your devices, that's where a paid account comes in handy :) And if you're getting some mad déjà vu from all this, it's because I commented about uFincs a couple weeks ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26970716 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26970716 Finally, since I know some people were hesitant about the pricing, I decided to throw together a special coupon just for you guys: "HN15". It's 15% off, forever, on any of the plans, for the first 100 new sign-ups. If you have any questions, feel free to check out out the FAQ (https://ufincs.com/faq https://ufincs.com/faq), but I'll be here all day to respond to any comments!

agentdrtran 5y ago
Any plans for Plaid/etc integration for transaction syncing?
- devinsit 5y ago
  Absolutely none at all! uFincs is all about manual entry (although CSV import + recurring transactions makes things a bit easier). I made a deliberate choice to not support any bank integrations for privacy reasons (although simplicity is also a big factor).
  - qshaman 5y ago
    privacy in what sense? the bank owns your data already, if you don't store any user data in the cloud, then is private by design, right? I was looking for something like this, but I do need auto import my transaction data, across all banks and brokers, etc. Offline first and only, ala Personal Capital, but secure and safe. Paying 20 bucks a month for the privilege of manual data entry is a bit much. There is a bunch of open source alternatives(GNU Cash, etc...), that let you manually enter your data. That said, this is my particular use case. I do wish you the best, and the app does look pretty.
    - devinsit 5y ago
      Privacy in the sense that, while the bank may own your data already, third-parties like Plaid do not. And at least up in here Canada, we're a bit weaker on the whole 'bank API' system, so it generally turns into a wonderful game of "hand over your bank account credentials". Anyways, I definitely understand where you're coming from. Plenty of other products that do have bank integrations though, so at least of there's lots of options for you! And thanks for the design feedback :)
      - qshaman 5y ago
        Plaid is own by Visa, but I get your point. As I said, wish you the best!
        skinnymuch 5y ago
        The deal did not go through. Plaid just got valued at close to triple what Visa was going to spend on it in a recent fund raise at around $14B post money.
jimkleiber 5y ago
Ah, I really like how clean the UI feels and also the e2ee. I'd love if this also could have a mobile app, as I then could document transactions on the go more easily. Any plans for a mobile app?
- devinsit 5y ago
  Thanks for the feedback on the UI! Definitely put some time into trying to get that right. And yep, we have plans for dedicated mobile/desktop apps for sometime this year. Android will almost certainly come before iOS though.
huhtenberg 5y ago
Privacy-first finance app should really have a self-hosted option front and center. That's not even negotiable. That's because otherwise the privacy property of the app hinges on a trust in vendor and the assumption that they won't serve some funny JS on the next page reload. The one and only way to address this is to provide a self-hosted, completely self-contained version. There's really no way around this. It's not a matter of encrypting things or storing them locally, it's a matter of divorcing yourself as a developer from users' data. Right now, it's a packaged deal. PS. Looks very nice though. Clearly lots of thought went into the design and UX elements. This part is really well done!
- devinsit 5y ago
  Yep, I agree. If you want perfect security and a 100% trust-less solution, then uFincs certainly isn't it. But I like to think that, at least when put in contrast with other products on the market, choosing to do these privacy/security related things is better than not. I elaborate on this further in our security doc (https://ufincs.com/policies/security#the-catch https://ufincs.com/policies/security#the-catch) and the FAQ (https://ufincs.com/faq#is-a-ufincs-a-trustless-system https://ufincs.com/faq#is-a-ufincs-a-trustless-system).
  - huhtenberg 5y ago
    Well, the thing is that if you say "privacy-first", you are pitching to people who care about this sort of thing. For these people the fact that uFincs is not self-hosted is an instant no-go. And for people who don't see it as a problem, the privacy angle doesn't matter much either. See the disconnect? You have a good product, for sure, but the pitch needs a revision.
    - devinsit 5y ago
      Oh I'm well aware of the disconnect. I just disagree that there are only people who care about privacy to the degree that they have to self-host everything. I believe there's room to ride the line between being 'privacy-first' (in that we care about privacy, first and foremost) and offering convenience (i.e. providing a web app). I'm sure my customers who signed up with ProtonMail and Fastmail addresses can attest to that fact. And for those who do fall all the way to the self-hosting side, well, there's plenty of other options on the market! Of course, there's nothing stopping us from being one of those options, it's just not our priority at this very moment.
kemonocode 5y ago
Others have already mentioned how it's a non-starter if there isn't an option to self-host so I won't bring that up: instead, for those who don't mind that I'd suggest easier means to import data from existing formats. Offer an on-ramp for people who too are fed up of GnuCash or have been using Ledger up until now and could use something friendlier. Best of luck in your project!

likecarter 5y ago

Looks nice! What language is this written in?

devinsit 5y ago
Thanks! The app itself is all React + Redux + TypeScript. Backend API is Node + Feathers + TypeScript. So certainly nothing fancy.
- mritchie712 5y ago
  tailwind too, right?
  - devinsit 5y ago
    The marketing site (https://ufincs.com https://ufincs.com) uses React + NextJS + Tailwind. The app itself (https://app.ufincs.com https://app.ufincs.com) uses a design system that I built completely custom (with plain old Sass).

jedimastert 5y ago

I really appreciate the "Get out your credit card" call to action. Just the right kind of humor for a personal finance site. Super tiny nit: I might put the per-month cost next to the annual price (and maybe how many months/years next to the lifetime cost). It was not immediately apparent to me that the annual price is 50% cheaper, which is fairly substantial.

devinsit 5y ago
Yeah, deciding to go straight-shooter with some of copy was definitely a risk, but thanks for letting me know that you appreciate it :) And yeah, the pricing section could definitely be made clearer on that. Thanks for the feedback.

p2detar 5y ago

The problem I've always had with these type of apps is keeping them in sync with what I've spent using my CC or bank transfers. After a while it gets truly annoying to import or god forbid type in all weekly transactions. I see that CSV import is supported. For people like me it will be truly useful to outline, with examples, how and what exactly can be automated using CSV or other methods. In my family we use Wallet [1], which allows for shared family accounts, budgets and bank account sync. The app definitely has some issues, like because of the PSD2 requirements, sync sometimes fails for some banks. It lacks a solid algorithm that recognizes/remembers the type of synced expenses. It also lacks some features like investment type of accounts that support stocks or crypto with real-time updates. That being said, it still provides an immediate look over our current finances and monthly balance with as little need for account management as possible. I hope this feedback helps. [1] https://budgetbakers.com https://budgetbakers.com

devinsit 5y ago
I can definitely see where you're coming from regarding the whole syncing thing. Personally, I've gotten into a habit of recording my transactions right after they happen (or at worst, at the end of the day), but somehow I get the feeling that I'm particularly crazy for doing that. In any case, I agree that we could do better as far as showing examples/features altogether, but I figured (at least for the time being), just letting people use the app without an account (https://ufincs.com/noaccount https://ufincs.com/noaccount) is as good a demo as any. Definitely useful feedback, thanks!

falcolas 5y ago

I know this is probably useless feedback, but here's how I read the product name: You Finks! For what it's worth.

devinsit 5y ago
Yep, that's basically how it's said.

patrickmn 5y ago

Hahah this gif https://ufincs.com/assets/images/features-autocomplete-5B7713254C1DA557465C7E6BE5B81004A144B8D7.gif https://ufincs.com/assets/images/features-autocomplete-5B771... Looks very, very nice for a solo project!

devinsit 5y ago
Thank you!

skinnymuch 5y ago

Is the writing under pricing for yearly and lifetime of entering one transaction supposed to be humor? I’m assuming so based on the overall vibe. I wonder if it will be confusing for people though. The product isn’t for me at all, personally, because of wanting integrations/automation. But the app and sales pages look beautiful. I feel motivated enough to get off iPad and hacker news and get going on a side React project now.