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The government has no duty to go to lengths to seek out prospective owners and deliver property to them. They post a notice at the site of the warrant and anyo

The government has no duty to go to lengths to seek out prospective owners and deliver property to them. They post a notice at the site of the warrant and anyone with an interest goes to them. Since the owners allege that they put their name and contact information on that box, we can presume they would have no qualms about providing same, and a description of the contents, to the custodian of the property to claim it.

nybble41 5y ago
Requiring a description of the contents would be abusing the warrant to gain access to information the warrant didn't cover. All they should need to claim their property is proof of their identity as the owner of the safe deposit box, including the key to the box. At that point they should be granted access to the box in private so that they can remove their property, just as if they were claiming it from the original custodian. The FBI definitely should not be opening the boxes themselves or attempting to inventory their contents.
- curryst 5y ago
  It's actually worse than that. Assuming you do have something illegal in those boxes, they've pulled a legal maneuver whereby you are forced to claim ownership. It's an end-run around the 5th Amendment right against self-incrimination. They seized your property and require you to incriminate yourself to get it back. Lockboxes where the contents are legal will presumably be claimed by their owners, unless the contents are somehow embarrassing. Illegal lockboxes won't be claimed, and the FBI has effectively seized them without needing a warrant for the contents. I'll be surprised if the FBI wins this in court, but it won't make any difference. This will take years to hash out, and by the time it's done, all the legal lockboxes will have already been claimed. The illegal ones are presumably anonymous, and the FBI will just say "oh well, if they won't claim it then we don't know whose it is, so I guess it's ours".
TomSwirly 5y ago
> The government has no duty to go to lengths to seek out prospective owners and deliver property to them. Can you explain why the government has no duty to treat its law-abiding citizens in an honest and open fashion? Six weeks later, apparently they don't have the contents back. Searching you can find many similar cases where people simply never get their stuff back. What sort of procedures are there to safeguard innocent people? Are there two people present at all times to prevent a single person from just taking things? Is there an inventory of each box taken at the start and checked at the end? Government works for the people. They aren't kings or dictators. We are innocent until proven guilty. If they can't investigate _suspects_ without fucking up _perfectly innocent people_ then they shouldn't do it at all.

nybble41 5y ago

Requiring a description of the contents would be abusing the warrant to gain access to information the warrant didn't cover. All they should need to claim their property is proof of their identity as the owner of the safe deposit box, including the key to the box. At that point they should be granted access to the box in private so that they can remove their property, just as if they were claiming it from the original custodian. The FBI definitely should not be opening the boxes themselves or attempting to inventory their contents.

curryst 5y ago
It's actually worse than that. Assuming you do have something illegal in those boxes, they've pulled a legal maneuver whereby you are forced to claim ownership. It's an end-run around the 5th Amendment right against self-incrimination. They seized your property and require you to incriminate yourself to get it back. Lockboxes where the contents are legal will presumably be claimed by their owners, unless the contents are somehow embarrassing. Illegal lockboxes won't be claimed, and the FBI has effectively seized them without needing a warrant for the contents. I'll be surprised if the FBI wins this in court, but it won't make any difference. This will take years to hash out, and by the time it's done, all the legal lockboxes will have already been claimed. The illegal ones are presumably anonymous, and the FBI will just say "oh well, if they won't claim it then we don't know whose it is, so I guess it's ours".

TomSwirly 5y ago

> The government has no duty to go to lengths to seek out prospective owners and deliver property to them. Can you explain why the government has no duty to treat its law-abiding citizens in an honest and open fashion? Six weeks later, apparently they don't have the contents back. Searching you can find many similar cases where people simply never get their stuff back. What sort of procedures are there to safeguard innocent people? Are there two people present at all times to prevent a single person from just taking things? Is there an inventory of each box taken at the start and checked at the end? Government works for the people. They aren't kings or dictators. We are innocent until proven guilty. If they can't investigate _suspects_ without fucking up _perfectly innocent people_ then they shouldn't do it at all.