3 ms·

I have been in a more management or consulting focused role for 3 years now and i already fear that i am loosing my effectiveness as a programmer. How did the t

by domano 5y ago

I have been in a more management or consulting focused role for 3 years now and i already fear that i am loosing my effectiveness as a programmer. How did the transition back to programming go for you?

weinzierl 5y ago
I second this question. I find that "potentially loosing [..] effectiveness" is the least of the problems though, but that a few years of experience in management makes one essentially unhirable for positions that even involve some coding. I saw this from both sides of the table: as employee and hiring manager. It's also not a money problem, accepting less for a coding position does not work. A career path back to coding just does not exist within the industry. Of course freelancing and founding your own company may be options but in a regular company hierarchy - no way in my experience. I'd love to be proven wrong of course and I'd love to hear stories to the contrary.
- ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago
  Probably the case. Being older than 35, in this industry, is also a killer. I just gave up looking for work, and am working with some folks on a nonprofit startup. It's great. best decision I ever made.
  - domano 5y ago
    I am 31 so maybe i have a chance to switch back for a few years, fingers crossed. Thanks for your replies.
- domano 5y ago
  Why does management experience make you unhirable? I do program every now and then in my spare time, but not to the extent the original commenter does in his spare time. Interview wise i am doing fine, albeit not for FAANG type roles.
  - ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago
    Managers -especially young ones- can be quite insecure. They don't want folks reporting to them that can call BS. Basic human nature. TBH, they have a point. I was a manager for many years, and know BS when I smell it. I had a management style that involved a lot of self-reflection and intimate feedback loops with my employees, but I also managed very experienced engineers that all knew more than I did, so treating them with respect, and listening to their counsel, became second nature. It wouldn't have bothered me a bit to have employees that used to be managers, as long as they were good engineers. Not sure that most managers, these days, operate that way.
  - weinzierl 5y ago
    That's what I wrote - unhireable for coding positions. Of course management positions don't make you unhireable for management positions. Sure, you can code in your spare time, but how much of that spare time do you have if you take your management position seriously?
ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago
In my case, it went well. I never really took my hand off the programming wheel, while being a manager. I just wasn't being paid for it (bonus was that I have a big open-source portfolio). I just did open-source work in nights and weekends. When I left my last company, I just made it my full-time vocation, and that went quite smoothly. I do this for the love of the craft; not the money.
- tonyedgecombe 5y ago
  >I do this for the love of the craft; not the money. I think this is main point. Somehow introducing money into anything seems to drain all the pleasure out of it.
  - ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago
    I have to agree. It sucks, because I have skills and experience that could make people with established corporations millions. They just can't seem to bring themselves to work with people like me, unless they are doing the whole "alpha dog" thing. The NPO I'm working with can't afford to pay me squat, but I'm not constantly mud-wrestling knuckleheads.

by domano 5y ago

weinzierl 5y ago

I second this question. I find that "potentially loosing [..] effectiveness" is the least of the problems though, but that a few years of experience in management makes one essentially unhirable for positions that even involve some coding. I saw this from both sides of the table: as employee and hiring manager. It's also not a money problem, accepting less for a coding position does not work. A career path back to coding just does not exist within the industry. Of course freelancing and founding your own company may be options but in a regular company hierarchy - no way in my experience. I'd love to be proven wrong of course and I'd love to hear stories to the contrary.

ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago
Probably the case. Being older than 35, in this industry, is also a killer. I just gave up looking for work, and am working with some folks on a nonprofit startup. It's great. best decision I ever made.
- domano 5y ago
  I am 31 so maybe i have a chance to switch back for a few years, fingers crossed. Thanks for your replies.
domano 5y ago
Why does management experience make you unhirable? I do program every now and then in my spare time, but not to the extent the original commenter does in his spare time. Interview wise i am doing fine, albeit not for FAANG type roles.
- ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago
  Managers -especially young ones- can be quite insecure. They don't want folks reporting to them that can call BS. Basic human nature. TBH, they have a point. I was a manager for many years, and know BS when I smell it. I had a management style that involved a lot of self-reflection and intimate feedback loops with my employees, but I also managed very experienced engineers that all knew more than I did, so treating them with respect, and listening to their counsel, became second nature. It wouldn't have bothered me a bit to have employees that used to be managers, as long as they were good engineers. Not sure that most managers, these days, operate that way.
- weinzierl 5y ago
  That's what I wrote - unhireable for coding positions. Of course management positions don't make you unhireable for management positions. Sure, you can code in your spare time, but how much of that spare time do you have if you take your management position seriously?

ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago

In my case, it went well. I never really took my hand off the programming wheel, while being a manager. I just wasn't being paid for it (bonus was that I have a big open-source portfolio). I just did open-source work in nights and weekends. When I left my last company, I just made it my full-time vocation, and that went quite smoothly. I do this for the love of the craft; not the money.

tonyedgecombe 5y ago
>I do this for the love of the craft; not the money. I think this is main point. Somehow introducing money into anything seems to drain all the pleasure out of it.
- ChrisMarshallNY 5y ago
  I have to agree. It sucks, because I have skills and experience that could make people with established corporations millions. They just can't seem to bring themselves to work with people like me, unless they are doing the whole "alpha dog" thing. The NPO I'm working with can't afford to pay me squat, but I'm not constantly mud-wrestling knuckleheads.