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I have tried hard to understand what makes Peterson such a radioactive personality on the left and I really don't get it. Admittedly I haven't read his books, b

by mdoms 5y ago

I have tried hard to understand what makes Peterson such a radioactive personality on the left and I really don't get it. Admittedly I haven't read his books, but I watched a bunch of his videos and have listened to podcast interviews with him with multiple different hosts and I'm stumped. Nor do I think Peterson is especially insightful or interesting. He's obviously pretty sharp, but most of what he talks about is milquetoast self-help slurm for 22 year old dudes and bored housewives. The only thing I have seen him say that is remotely offensive is his comments about trans people, and even that wasn't really directed at the trans community. It was more of a backlash against the Canadian laws that make it a serious offence to misgender someone.

goldenchrome 5y ago
He preaches taking personal responsibility for your life, which is antithetical to the leftist ideology which claims that the individual’s ills are caused by society. From the perspective of a leftist, Peterson is insensitive and detached from reality.
- trog 5y ago
  Which /he thinks/ is antithetical, etc. I don't know any of "the lefts", a group in which I am usually categorised and associate with, that would make an inane blanket statement like "individual’s ills are caused by society". It's this kind of partisan, divisive talk that makes everything on the Internet so wearying to read and/or engage with.
  - goldenchrome 5y ago
    Hey I’m with you. I’m simply answering the question asked by the parent comment. I’ve found that most people on the left are reasonable and don’t think about JP much at all. However, I’ve observed that the people who are vocally against him are usually far on the left and use the ideological argument that I stated.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
monkeydreams 5y ago
> I have tried hard to understand what makes Peterson such a radioactive personality on the left It's not just the "Left". Peterson has two characteristics that irritate me whenever he arises in conversation. His arguments, which are generally in the form of a flimsy comparison to an actual scenario/event/situation, a breathless demand that we just hear him out and not look into the comparison too deeply, then a demand to consider the implications as if the relationship was completely equivalent. The logic is so tightly circular that the only thing he has managed to almost convince me of is that pi is exactly 3.0 The second thing is his fans. They feel he is persecuted because others (whom they label "The Left") don't agree with Peterson. They will extol the virtues of this or that book, horrified that someone might have found a flaw in the argument that White Privilege doesn't exist or that people with sub-80 IQs have no benefit to society. They will then claim that this supposed flaw is actually a strength, as proven by this argument in book B or at this timestamp in this video. As to why "The Left" can't cancel Peterson... is because "cancellation" is generally a target audience deciding that they will no longer purchase, listen or otherwise interact with a party, brand or product. Peterson's audience aren't people who organise against people like Peterson. The most positive thing one can say about him is that he hasn't betrayed his base - he knows they enjoy his pap-philosophy - and he is happy to make some extra-curricular dollars by selling it.
- mdoms 5y ago
  I can certainly see why people disagree with him on plenty of things. I do. As I said I don't think he's especially insightful. But what I don't get is why so many people outright hate him. Students protest his events, he has been called a Nazi apologist[0] by mainstream media organisations. I just... don't see it. [0] https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/jordan-peterson-nazi-apologism-lindsey-graham-holocaust-migrant-caravan-mexican-border-tear-gas-a8659001.html https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/jordan-peterson-nazi-ap...
  - monkeydreams 5y ago
    > But what I don't get is why so many people outright hate him. I have heard from people who genuinely hate him. He is in the public eye and everyone in the public eye is hated by someone. But they are in the minority and most people just disdain him and the shallowness of his thinking from what I can see. The biggest source of hate talk about Peterson tends to come from him and his supporters. What use is it being outspoken if it does not provoke rage or, at least, if you cannot recast disagreement as anger? He makes his bread-and-butter as someone who the lefties apparently hate - and his supporters splash around this narrative like a puppy sloshing up a bowl of soup. > he has been called a Nazi apologist[0] by mainstream media organisations. I just... don't see it. I kinda do, and I think he purposefully walks close to the line on this. He isn't outright calling for the killing of people based on immutable characteristics... but he's certainly asking if they have any use to society. His comments about people with < 80 IQ is a great example of pretty much everything for which I dislike him (false equivalencies, circular logic, and a complete inability to deal with disagreement). If you are sensitive to the rise of nationalism and inequality, these are the types of arguments that can* actually make you hate a person, particularly one with such awful, rabid fans. edit: "can", not "will"

by mdoms 5y ago

goldenchrome 5y ago

He preaches taking personal responsibility for your life, which is antithetical to the leftist ideology which claims that the individual’s ills are caused by society. From the perspective of a leftist, Peterson is insensitive and detached from reality.

trog 5y ago
Which /he thinks/ is antithetical, etc. I don't know any of "the lefts", a group in which I am usually categorised and associate with, that would make an inane blanket statement like "individual’s ills are caused by society". It's this kind of partisan, divisive talk that makes everything on the Internet so wearying to read and/or engage with.
- goldenchrome 5y ago
  Hey I’m with you. I’m simply answering the question asked by the parent comment. I’ve found that most people on the left are reasonable and don’t think about JP much at all. However, I’ve observed that the people who are vocally against him are usually far on the left and use the ideological argument that I stated.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

monkeydreams 5y ago

> I have tried hard to understand what makes Peterson such a radioactive personality on the left It's not just the "Left". Peterson has two characteristics that irritate me whenever he arises in conversation. His arguments, which are generally in the form of a flimsy comparison to an actual scenario/event/situation, a breathless demand that we just hear him out and not look into the comparison too deeply, then a demand to consider the implications as if the relationship was completely equivalent. The logic is so tightly circular that the only thing he has managed to almost convince me of is that pi is exactly 3.0 The second thing is his fans. They feel he is persecuted because others (whom they label "The Left") don't agree with Peterson. They will extol the virtues of this or that book, horrified that someone might have found a flaw in the argument that White Privilege doesn't exist or that people with sub-80 IQs have no benefit to society. They will then claim that this supposed flaw is actually a strength, as proven by this argument in book B or at this timestamp in this video. As to why "The Left" can't cancel Peterson... is because "cancellation" is generally a target audience deciding that they will no longer purchase, listen or otherwise interact with a party, brand or product. Peterson's audience aren't people who organise against people like Peterson. The most positive thing one can say about him is that he hasn't betrayed his base - he knows they enjoy his pap-philosophy - and he is happy to make some extra-curricular dollars by selling it.

mdoms 5y ago
I can certainly see why people disagree with him on plenty of things. I do. As I said I don't think he's especially insightful. But what I don't get is why so many people outright hate him. Students protest his events, he has been called a Nazi apologist[0] by mainstream media organisations. I just... don't see it. [0] https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/jordan-peterson-nazi-apologism-lindsey-graham-holocaust-migrant-caravan-mexican-border-tear-gas-a8659001.html https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/jordan-peterson-nazi-ap...
- monkeydreams 5y ago
  > But what I don't get is why so many people outright hate him. I have heard from people who genuinely hate him. He is in the public eye and everyone in the public eye is hated by someone. But they are in the minority and most people just disdain him and the shallowness of his thinking from what I can see. The biggest source of hate talk about Peterson tends to come from him and his supporters. What use is it being outspoken if it does not provoke rage or, at least, if you cannot recast disagreement as anger? He makes his bread-and-butter as someone who the lefties apparently hate - and his supporters splash around this narrative like a puppy sloshing up a bowl of soup. > he has been called a Nazi apologist[0] by mainstream media organisations. I just... don't see it. I kinda do, and I think he purposefully walks close to the line on this. He isn't outright calling for the killing of people based on immutable characteristics... but he's certainly asking if they have any use to society. His comments about people with < 80 IQ is a great example of pretty much everything for which I dislike him (false equivalencies, circular logic, and a complete inability to deal with disagreement). If you are sensitive to the rise of nationalism and inequality, these are the types of arguments that can* actually make you hate a person, particularly one with such awful, rabid fans. edit: "can", not "will"