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> Overall, it is interesting that a nice design came from what amounts to government regulation. I guess the author isn't familiar with what caused dishwashers

> Overall, it is interesting that a nice design came from what amounts to government regulation. I guess the author isn't familiar with what caused dishwashers to become more efficient[0]. In general I don't see how anything except government regulation can force these improvements whenever consumers find themselves in an "any color as long as it's black" kind of position regarding market choices, and this looks like it is one of those situations. EDIT: Also, before anyone thinks I'm blindly pro-government regulation, Philips got rich by exploiting the fact that the Netherlands did not enforce patent laws for a large part of the 19th century. This let them combine innovations that other competitors didn't dare to use due to fear of being sued by Edison, resulting in them having the best light bulbs available at the time (the fact that many competitors that Edison sued out of business happily joined Philips probably helped too). So it's all context-dependent. [0] https://www.reviewed.com/dishwashers/features/why-obamas-dishwasher-efficiency-crusade-makes-sense https://www.reviewed.com/dishwashers/features/why-obamas-dis...

arsome 6y ago
So that's why my new dishwasher is terrible.
- wilsynet 6y ago
  Which dishwasher is it?
minikites 6y ago
>EDIT: Also, before anyone thinks I'm blindly pro-government regulation The fact that you feel the need to add this edit makes me think about how the conservative framing of almost every issue is assumed to be true by both sides. Nobody would make an edit like this about being blindly anti-government regulation, because that's the default position. Government regulation is not bad by default and your overall point is excellent.
- vanderZwan 6y ago
  The edit was simply because I know on what kind of discussion forum I am right now and in which direction it leans. While I agree that I shouldn't have had to make it, I just wanted to be ahead of the likely fallacies that would be thrown against me.
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henvic 6y ago
You sincerely think that government can drive efficiency? Really? Don't you see that such regulations harm other players that might offer better thing in the market in the future? This is lobby, and it's bad for economy and the environment.
- minikites 6y ago
  >might offer That "might" is doing a lot of work. We're stuck with many mediocre options in many markets because they're locally maximal outcomes but not maximal outcomes for society, which is exactly why we need a strong government.
- vanderZwan 6y ago
  What do you mean "think"? We have two real-world data points right here showing cases where government regulation forced manufacturers to improve the quality of their products, and where if left to their own devices their own conflicts of interest would have gotten in the way of doing so. Namely, the inefficiency of dishwashers being a fully externalized cost, and planned obsolescence of light-bulbs ensuring that customers come back. Do you have any concrete arguments for why these two cases of successful government intervention do not hold up? Do you have any argument to suggest that the situations they describe are exceptional instead of common and all over the marketplace?
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arsome 6y ago

So that's why my new dishwasher is terrible.

wilsynet 6y ago
Which dishwasher is it?

minikites 6y ago

>EDIT: Also, before anyone thinks I'm blindly pro-government regulation The fact that you feel the need to add this edit makes me think about how the conservative framing of almost every issue is assumed to be true by both sides. Nobody would make an edit like this about being blindly anti-government regulation, because that's the default position. Government regulation is not bad by default and your overall point is excellent.

vanderZwan 6y ago
The edit was simply because I know on what kind of discussion forum I am right now and in which direction it leans. While I agree that I shouldn't have had to make it, I just wanted to be ahead of the likely fallacies that would be thrown against me.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]

henvic 6y ago

You sincerely think that government can drive efficiency? Really? Don't you see that such regulations harm other players that might offer better thing in the market in the future? This is lobby, and it's bad for economy and the environment.

minikites 6y ago
>might offer That "might" is doing a lot of work. We're stuck with many mediocre options in many markets because they're locally maximal outcomes but not maximal outcomes for society, which is exactly why we need a strong government.
vanderZwan 6y ago
What do you mean "think"? We have two real-world data points right here showing cases where government regulation forced manufacturers to improve the quality of their products, and where if left to their own devices their own conflicts of interest would have gotten in the way of doing so. Namely, the inefficiency of dishwashers being a fully externalized cost, and planned obsolescence of light-bulbs ensuring that customers come back. Do you have any concrete arguments for why these two cases of successful government intervention do not hold up? Do you have any argument to suggest that the situations they describe are exceptional instead of common and all over the marketplace?

deleted 6y ago

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