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At least oilprice.com wears its bias on it's sleeve. The calmatters article is pretty light on actual analysis too. Here is the actual report from the Califor

At least oilprice.com wears its bias on it's sleeve. The calmatters article is pretty light on actual analysis too. Here is the actual report from the California Public Utilities Commission that both these articles are based on: https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/uploadedFiles/CPUC_Website/Content/Utilities_and_Industries/Energy/Reports_and_White_Papers/Feb%202021%20Utility%20Costs%20and%20Affordability%20of%20the%20Grid%20of%20the%20Future.pdf https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/uploadedFiles/CPUC_Website/Content/U... It projects an increase in electricity rates slightly hither than inflation over then next 10 years.

lazide 5y ago
Pretty sure CPUC is ALSO an extremely biased source? Besides the regulatory capture issues, they are the ones being told to oversee implementation. They have every interest in giving a 'all clear, it will be fine' while they squeeze everyone else. They have a long history of doing so here in California. One thing is for sure - ACTUAL energy pricing (here in PG&E land) that I see on my bill is much higher than what CPUC or PG&E actually advertise is the rate here, mostly because of energy usage penalties. We are not that unusual in our usage, and frankly using way less energy than a typical american household. Apparently, they found one of those 'cooks every meal on a single service rice cooker, actually turns off every light when they're not using it, and wears sweaters all year round inside' as the norm/baseline and then charging everyone else massive penalties if they don't conform, while pretending energy is cheap.
- lazide 5y ago
  Wanted to double check myself and make sure I wasn't just imaging it. I am not. According to the US Energy Information Administration, the average American Household uses 10600 kWh/Yr or 877 kWh/month (I'm just going to use kWh here for simplicity). It varies by state, with Louisiana at 14747 kWh/yr and Hawaii at 6296 kWh/yr. [https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=97&t=3 https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=97&t=3] Despite work from home, despite being a large family, etc. we used 599 kWh last month. That puts us at only 68% of the national average household (and we're probably more people and more stuff going on than an actual average household). We have LED lights, we turn things off when we don't need them, don't run AC much or at all, etc. But we also aren't killing ourselves too much. Our price per kWh came out to $.26/kWH, or twice the national average. The CPUC would rather the utilities talk about their rates and what they're doing to keep them down [https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/electricrates/ https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/electricrates/] (conflict of interest anyone?), so we'll see what PG&E says in their report at the CPUC website [https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/General.aspx?id=6442467709 https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/General.aspx?id=6442467709] Oh, that's interesting. It literally has no data on current rates! Huh? It just talks about cost shifting and trying to cut costs, but with no actual details or contextual data (there are some graphs regarding cost shifting, but without context, per capita/per household it's useless). For context here, this site seems to do decent nationwide price of electricity comparisons [https://www.electricchoice.com/electricity-prices-by-state/ https://www.electricchoice.com/electricity-prices-by-state/]. According to them, average price per kWh is $.13 nationwide, and $.19 in California. So, what is the actual rate for PG&E and how has it changed? So first, you need to know what Baseline means. Baseline is defined per statute as 50-70% of the usage of the average household within a number of different climate zones and varies by zone. It's supposed to be for 'you can survive' usage only, it isn't set at average usage even though it sounds like it should be. After a ton of digging, I find the new rates as of March 1st [https://www.pge.com/pge_global/common/pdfs/rate-plans/how-rates-work/Residential-Rates-Plan-Pricing.pdf https://www.pge.com/pge_global/common/pdfs/rate-plans/how-ra...], where up to baseline usage is going to be charged at $.26/kWh (or double national average), anything above baseline up to 4x baseline (so double average usage) would be charged at $.33/kWh, and and any usage higher than that at $.41/kWh. That comparison site above says average California electricity costs $.19/kWh, but as you can see your average PG&E customer is going to be paying well above that in all cases - somewhere between 1.2-2x that depending on usage. If you actually use more than average (say 4x the average), you might even be paying 3x the national average for it. If you use even more than that? Well, hope you're wealthy. These are progressive charges, so your baseline usage is charged at the lower rate, then increases as you go. So let's see how this has changed over time shall we? As required by law, PG&E keeps a bunch of excel spreadsheets (yes really) with their historic rates. https://www.pge.com/tariffs/electric.shtml#RESELEC_INCLUTOU https://www.pge.com/tariffs/electric.shtml#RESELEC_INCLUTOU If we go back 5 years to May 2016 rates [https://www.pge.com/tariffs/Res_160324-160531.xls https://www.pge.com/tariffs/Res_160324-160531.xls] the E1 (normal residential) baseline was $.18/kWh, next tier up was $.22/kWh with the 'average' customer paying $.21/kWh. Compared to the now effective price of $.26/kWh for baseline and next tier $.33/kWh, that is an increase of 44% over 5 years for baseline and 50% for Tier 1 over the same time.
  - olivermarks 5y ago
    Thank you @lazide, great sleuth work

lazide 5y ago

Pretty sure CPUC is ALSO an extremely biased source? Besides the regulatory capture issues, they are the ones being told to oversee implementation. They have every interest in giving a 'all clear, it will be fine' while they squeeze everyone else. They have a long history of doing so here in California. One thing is for sure - ACTUAL energy pricing (here in PG&E land) that I see on my bill is much higher than what CPUC or PG&E actually advertise is the rate here, mostly because of energy usage penalties. We are not that unusual in our usage, and frankly using way less energy than a typical american household. Apparently, they found one of those 'cooks every meal on a single service rice cooker, actually turns off every light when they're not using it, and wears sweaters all year round inside' as the norm/baseline and then charging everyone else massive penalties if they don't conform, while pretending energy is cheap.

lazide 5y ago
Wanted to double check myself and make sure I wasn't just imaging it. I am not. According to the US Energy Information Administration, the average American Household uses 10600 kWh/Yr or 877 kWh/month (I'm just going to use kWh here for simplicity). It varies by state, with Louisiana at 14747 kWh/yr and Hawaii at 6296 kWh/yr. [https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=97&t=3 https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=97&t=3] Despite work from home, despite being a large family, etc. we used 599 kWh last month. That puts us at only 68% of the national average household (and we're probably more people and more stuff going on than an actual average household). We have LED lights, we turn things off when we don't need them, don't run AC much or at all, etc. But we also aren't killing ourselves too much. Our price per kWh came out to $.26/kWH, or twice the national average. The CPUC would rather the utilities talk about their rates and what they're doing to keep them down [https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/electricrates/ https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/electricrates/] (conflict of interest anyone?), so we'll see what PG&E says in their report at the CPUC website [https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/General.aspx?id=6442467709 https://www.cpuc.ca.gov/General.aspx?id=6442467709] Oh, that's interesting. It literally has no data on current rates! Huh? It just talks about cost shifting and trying to cut costs, but with no actual details or contextual data (there are some graphs regarding cost shifting, but without context, per capita/per household it's useless). For context here, this site seems to do decent nationwide price of electricity comparisons [https://www.electricchoice.com/electricity-prices-by-state/ https://www.electricchoice.com/electricity-prices-by-state/]. According to them, average price per kWh is $.13 nationwide, and $.19 in California. So, what is the actual rate for PG&E and how has it changed? So first, you need to know what Baseline means. Baseline is defined per statute as 50-70% of the usage of the average household within a number of different climate zones and varies by zone. It's supposed to be for 'you can survive' usage only, it isn't set at average usage even though it sounds like it should be. After a ton of digging, I find the new rates as of March 1st [https://www.pge.com/pge_global/common/pdfs/rate-plans/how-rates-work/Residential-Rates-Plan-Pricing.pdf https://www.pge.com/pge_global/common/pdfs/rate-plans/how-ra...], where up to baseline usage is going to be charged at $.26/kWh (or double national average), anything above baseline up to 4x baseline (so double average usage) would be charged at $.33/kWh, and and any usage higher than that at $.41/kWh. That comparison site above says average California electricity costs $.19/kWh, but as you can see your average PG&E customer is going to be paying well above that in all cases - somewhere between 1.2-2x that depending on usage. If you actually use more than average (say 4x the average), you might even be paying 3x the national average for it. If you use even more than that? Well, hope you're wealthy. These are progressive charges, so your baseline usage is charged at the lower rate, then increases as you go. So let's see how this has changed over time shall we? As required by law, PG&E keeps a bunch of excel spreadsheets (yes really) with their historic rates. https://www.pge.com/tariffs/electric.shtml#RESELEC_INCLUTOU https://www.pge.com/tariffs/electric.shtml#RESELEC_INCLUTOU If we go back 5 years to May 2016 rates [https://www.pge.com/tariffs/Res_160324-160531.xls https://www.pge.com/tariffs/Res_160324-160531.xls] the E1 (normal residential) baseline was $.18/kWh, next tier up was $.22/kWh with the 'average' customer paying $.21/kWh. Compared to the now effective price of $.26/kWh for baseline and next tier $.33/kWh, that is an increase of 44% over 5 years for baseline and 50% for Tier 1 over the same time.
- olivermarks 5y ago
  Thank you @lazide, great sleuth work