4 ms·

> People who consider something from the 1960's or 70's to be "too old" are really missing out on so much amazing literature. I completely agree. Personally I

> People who consider something from the 1960's or 70's to be "too old" are really missing out on so much amazing literature. I completely agree. Personally I read fairly widely in a temporal sense, as long as the story engages me I'll run with it. I think the point I was trying to make is that a lot of folks can be put off by scifi thinking it's a genre brim full of space lasers, FTL space craft and nasty aliens and not much else; when in fact it's much much more than that. This part of the interview stood out as evidence of that: > This was when she got the National Book Foundation Medal for Distinguished Contributions to American Letters in 2014; in her speech she not only thanked the committee for giving her the award, but said it was high time that speculative fiction writers were recognised as participants in the culture of literature, instead of being sort of segregated to a ghetto—she called them “realists of a larger reality.” And she reminded everyone how important science fiction is because the genre is about “writers who can see alternatives to how we live now.” But sadly it's been a long time, if ever (I haven't checked), since we saw any speculative fiction making it onto shortlists or winning prizes on say the Booker Prize[0], because it's not "literary" enough (bloody snobs). Finally I should also say that I also enjoy a good rip-roaring interstellar and galactic scale space opera as much as I enjoy more nuanced writing. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Booker_Prize https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Booker_Prize

pmoriarty 5y ago
"But sadly it's been a long time, if ever (I haven't checked), since we saw any speculative fiction making it onto shortlists or winning prizes on say the Booker Prize[0], because it's not "literary" enough (bloody snobs)." Yeah, snobbishness is a huge problem in literature, visual art, and music... in all culture, probably. Some people want desperately to be the gatekeepers of taste, and unfortunately the rest of society lets them get away with it. On the other extreme, there's a lot of trashy cultural production ("kitsch") which I find problematic myself, because it tends to be so trite and superficial.. but as a cultural relativist I have a hard time mounting any kind of serious argument against it. I guess if someone likes something, that should be enough, and there's really not much anyone can say against it that doesn't amount to anything more than "I don't like it". That conclusion doesn't sit very easy with me, but I can't think of a way around it.
- mrec 5y ago
  Honestly, I don't see this as a problem any more. Litfic is as much a genre as SF, and just as an SF novel isn't going to win the Booker, a litfic novel isn't going to win the Hugo or Nebula. Yes, the Booker judges believe that their preferred genre is intrinsically superior to all the others, but nobody else needs to pay any attention to them if they don't want to. Twenty or thirty years ago it was different, because the channels for discovery and discussion were so impoverished for anything remotely niche, but that hasn't been the case for a while now.
  - pmoriarty 5y ago
    That's true, but the converse is that it's easy for many of the people buying their velvet Jesus' and Thomas Kinkade paintings to ignore the Van Gogh's and Picassos (well, ok, these are hard to miss, but insert your favorite "serious", "great" painters here). And fans of whatever the scifi equivalent is of the trashiest of romance novels might never get to seriously give Ursula Le Guin a chance. I think that's a pity. People are getting balkanized and locked in to their favorite echo chambers. In one sense its good, because you're not getting your tastes and preferences dictated to from the ivory tower by some gatekeeper elites, but on the other hand I think a lot of people are missing out on discovering some amazing art, music, and literature because they're so enclosed in their little bubble from which many never dare to or even think of escaping.
Erwin 5y ago
This year a Danish female writer is nominated: https://thebookerprizes.com/books/employees-by-olga-ravn https://thebookerprizes.com/books/employees-by-olga-ravn

pmoriarty 5y ago

"But sadly it's been a long time, if ever (I haven't checked), since we saw any speculative fiction making it onto shortlists or winning prizes on say the Booker Prize[0], because it's not "literary" enough (bloody snobs)." Yeah, snobbishness is a huge problem in literature, visual art, and music... in all culture, probably. Some people want desperately to be the gatekeepers of taste, and unfortunately the rest of society lets them get away with it. On the other extreme, there's a lot of trashy cultural production ("kitsch") which I find problematic myself, because it tends to be so trite and superficial.. but as a cultural relativist I have a hard time mounting any kind of serious argument against it. I guess if someone likes something, that should be enough, and there's really not much anyone can say against it that doesn't amount to anything more than "I don't like it". That conclusion doesn't sit very easy with me, but I can't think of a way around it.

mrec 5y ago
Honestly, I don't see this as a problem any more. Litfic is as much a genre as SF, and just as an SF novel isn't going to win the Booker, a litfic novel isn't going to win the Hugo or Nebula. Yes, the Booker judges believe that their preferred genre is intrinsically superior to all the others, but nobody else needs to pay any attention to them if they don't want to. Twenty or thirty years ago it was different, because the channels for discovery and discussion were so impoverished for anything remotely niche, but that hasn't been the case for a while now.
- pmoriarty 5y ago
  That's true, but the converse is that it's easy for many of the people buying their velvet Jesus' and Thomas Kinkade paintings to ignore the Van Gogh's and Picassos (well, ok, these are hard to miss, but insert your favorite "serious", "great" painters here). And fans of whatever the scifi equivalent is of the trashiest of romance novels might never get to seriously give Ursula Le Guin a chance. I think that's a pity. People are getting balkanized and locked in to their favorite echo chambers. In one sense its good, because you're not getting your tastes and preferences dictated to from the ivory tower by some gatekeeper elites, but on the other hand I think a lot of people are missing out on discovering some amazing art, music, and literature because they're so enclosed in their little bubble from which many never dare to or even think of escaping.

Erwin 5y ago

This year a Danish female writer is nominated: https://thebookerprizes.com/books/employees-by-olga-ravn https://thebookerprizes.com/books/employees-by-olga-ravn