3 ms·

Is it odd to think there should be more? I see people stealing, doing hard drugs like heroin or meth, prostitution, and doing other anti-social behavior daily b

Is it odd to think there should be more? I see people stealing, doing hard drugs like heroin or meth, prostitution, and doing other anti-social behavior daily but we all just accept it now. Cops give tickets for heroin or meth and there’s no consequence if they don’t show up to court... I’m kind of ready for the pendulum to swing the other way again, especially before my kid grows up and has to be exposed to it.

wonderwonder 5y ago
Sending someone to jail does not magically cure them of their meth addiction. It probably compounds it as whatever sense of desperation or alienation drove them to drugs is now catalyzed by the inability to find meaningful work with due to a drug conviction / prison time. The solution should be to help these people get off of drugs but that is a society wide effort that needs to occur. Its much easier just to send a a few armed dudes over to rough them up and throw them in a cell. America does love to remove its undesirables from the view of others.
- AlexTWithBeard 5y ago
  Sending to jail is supposed to be a prevention factor, not a cure. That being said, being an addict is not a crime in most countries. Selling drugs is. Is it different in the US?
  - wonderwonder 5y ago
    Being an addict is not a crime in the US but possession of drugs even for personal use is for the most part, exceptions exist for marijuana in some areas. I think history has proven that if you are at the point you are considering using heroin or meth, the threat of incarceration is generally not a deterrent. I don't know that I have the answers, I just don't think that throwing someone in prison is the solution to the drug pandemic. I do agree that dealers should go to jail.
- diogenescynic 5y ago
  No but the rest of society is no longer victimized or harmed. Why do we just let drug users trash our public spaces and commit so much destruction? Does that not have a toll on society and everyone else’s quality of life? What about all the stuff they steal daily? I don’t see other developed countries bend over so far to accommodate criminals and drug addicts and frankly our strategy isn’t working at all—these populations just get bigger every year....
  - wonderwonder 5y ago
    If they are stealing, committing vandalism or generally victimizing others then yes I absolutely agree they should be punished. My main point was I disagree with arresting people for possession of narcotics. Once it crosses over from a victimless crime to something else then I agree.
    - diogenescynic 5y ago
      Prop 47 and 57 turned most of California cities into slums. Now you can steal up to $950 a day and use drugs openly and camp anywhere you want--a great foundation for any functioning society. Almost every large city in California has a few streets of blocks where they just push all the homeless and trash piles up, you see open bike chop shops pop up, there are super sketchy pimps/prostitutes. I just think we are allowing someone who has a drug addiction to descend to an even deeper downward spiral. I think Neo-liberals tell themselves that they have to not further harm these marginalized folks, but really it's just the the further soft bigotry of low expectations. My dad was a drug addict and the only time I saw him get sober was after he was incarcerated. I don't think the people out there sleeping under bridges and pushing carts full of trash are getting help, society is just letting them rot until they die off and neoliberals like Nancy Pelosi can just ignore them like a meaningless statistic. Republicans straight up don't care either, but I've never seen lower levels of human despair and drug addiction than in San Francisco or other deeply blue democrat run states.
dls2016 5y ago
> I see people stealing, doing hard drugs like heroin or meth, prostitution, and doing other anti-social behavior daily but we all just accept it now. Uhm... opiates and prostitution have been around for quite some time. Large scale prison systems... not so much.
- diogenescynic 5y ago
  Comparing smoking opium to fentanyl is just ignorant. The drugs are just tremendously more addictive and potent. A few small baggies of fentanyl could kill dozens. Not the same with opium poppies....
  - dls2016 5y ago
    Agree... but fentanyl wasn’t mentioned.
ipnon 5y ago
The shoe doesn't fit the foot. A year of someone's precious life in exchange for doing drugs or selling their body is cruel and disproportionate. We have to remember that prisons are expensive and dehumanizing, and ex-prisoners in the US become repeat offenders almost as much as they become reformed. It's not a magical cure for society's ills.

wonderwonder 5y ago

Sending someone to jail does not magically cure them of their meth addiction. It probably compounds it as whatever sense of desperation or alienation drove them to drugs is now catalyzed by the inability to find meaningful work with due to a drug conviction / prison time. The solution should be to help these people get off of drugs but that is a society wide effort that needs to occur. Its much easier just to send a a few armed dudes over to rough them up and throw them in a cell. America does love to remove its undesirables from the view of others.

AlexTWithBeard 5y ago
Sending to jail is supposed to be a prevention factor, not a cure. That being said, being an addict is not a crime in most countries. Selling drugs is. Is it different in the US?
- wonderwonder 5y ago
  Being an addict is not a crime in the US but possession of drugs even for personal use is for the most part, exceptions exist for marijuana in some areas. I think history has proven that if you are at the point you are considering using heroin or meth, the threat of incarceration is generally not a deterrent. I don't know that I have the answers, I just don't think that throwing someone in prison is the solution to the drug pandemic. I do agree that dealers should go to jail.
diogenescynic 5y ago
No but the rest of society is no longer victimized or harmed. Why do we just let drug users trash our public spaces and commit so much destruction? Does that not have a toll on society and everyone else’s quality of life? What about all the stuff they steal daily? I don’t see other developed countries bend over so far to accommodate criminals and drug addicts and frankly our strategy isn’t working at all—these populations just get bigger every year....
- wonderwonder 5y ago
  If they are stealing, committing vandalism or generally victimizing others then yes I absolutely agree they should be punished. My main point was I disagree with arresting people for possession of narcotics. Once it crosses over from a victimless crime to something else then I agree.
  - diogenescynic 5y ago
    Prop 47 and 57 turned most of California cities into slums. Now you can steal up to $950 a day and use drugs openly and camp anywhere you want--a great foundation for any functioning society. Almost every large city in California has a few streets of blocks where they just push all the homeless and trash piles up, you see open bike chop shops pop up, there are super sketchy pimps/prostitutes. I just think we are allowing someone who has a drug addiction to descend to an even deeper downward spiral. I think Neo-liberals tell themselves that they have to not further harm these marginalized folks, but really it's just the the further soft bigotry of low expectations. My dad was a drug addict and the only time I saw him get sober was after he was incarcerated. I don't think the people out there sleeping under bridges and pushing carts full of trash are getting help, society is just letting them rot until they die off and neoliberals like Nancy Pelosi can just ignore them like a meaningless statistic. Republicans straight up don't care either, but I've never seen lower levels of human despair and drug addiction than in San Francisco or other deeply blue democrat run states.

dls2016 5y ago

> I see people stealing, doing hard drugs like heroin or meth, prostitution, and doing other anti-social behavior daily but we all just accept it now. Uhm... opiates and prostitution have been around for quite some time. Large scale prison systems... not so much.

diogenescynic 5y ago
Comparing smoking opium to fentanyl is just ignorant. The drugs are just tremendously more addictive and potent. A few small baggies of fentanyl could kill dozens. Not the same with opium poppies....
- dls2016 5y ago
  Agree... but fentanyl wasn’t mentioned.

ipnon 5y ago

The shoe doesn't fit the foot. A year of someone's precious life in exchange for doing drugs or selling their body is cruel and disproportionate. We have to remember that prisons are expensive and dehumanizing, and ex-prisoners in the US become repeat offenders almost as much as they become reformed. It's not a magical cure for society's ills.