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That is sad for the climate, concrete is a large source for CO2 emissions while wood used in building is a carbon sink. I am not so sure that pretty much nobody

That is sad for the climate, concrete is a large source for CO2 emissions while wood used in building is a carbon sink. I am not so sure that pretty much nobody builds wood frame houses in Europe, where I live it is mostly wood that is used and even for larger buildings we are starting to move away from concrete to wood to make buildings more sustainable.

corty 5y ago
Well, in Germany it is common wisdom that stick-frame houses only live for roughly 40 years, have poor insulation, poor fire safety, are prone to infestations and transmit sounds so you can hear all the footsteps everywhere. So nobody builds with wood, basically. There is a growing market, but it is still very small and mostly limited to prefab houses. There are old (>80 years), wood frame plus open clay filling buildings ("Fachwerkhaus"), but those are impossible to construct anymore due to building codes. Upkeep is extremely expensive and quality is not up to current standards, so nobody would want anything like this. Due to the reasons stated above, there is no experienced construction workers available (at least not cheaply), no architects and since that part of the building code is rarely used, statics evaluation and building permit take ages. In short, new construction will still be concrete plus bricks over here.
- goodcanadian 5y ago
  I suspect it is strongly down to culture and experience (i.e. "common wisdom" is wrong on both sides of the Atlantic). In North America, most everything is built in wood. There are plenty of houses approaching 100 years that are just fine. Good insulation exists and is used. Infestations aren't generally a problem in European climates. There are plenty of techniques for dampening sound. The point is, in North America, everyone builds with wood so it is very difficult (expensive) to find someone who can build in brick. There is also the issue of material availability and familiarity of building inspectors. Building anything "non-standard" will be a big pain. I am sure the same applies in Germany, but swap wood for brick or concrete.
  - ghaff 5y ago
    My wood frame house in New England is 200 years old. Of course, it's had maintenance work done over the years and probably has been expanded. There are old brick houses in the city but, as you say, it's far less common.
  - chrisseaton 5y ago
    > plenty of houses approaching 100 years that are just fine This is such an incredibly low bar to be citing as an achievement! I think a lot of Americans can't comprehend that if you build from a permanent material like brick or stone the house will just sit there for a thousand years.
    - goodcanadian 5y ago
      They can, but only if it is well built. Plenty of brick buildings will fall down in 100 years, too. There are wooden buildings that are hundreds of years old, also.
    - rypskar 5y ago
      I wonder if there are more brick or wooden buildings that are around thousand years old. Concrete the Romans had 2000 years ago did last, but that technology was lost. Most buildings I know about that are between 500 and 1000 years are made of wood. Of course the wars we have had in Europe since then might have had something to do with how many old houses we have
      - reportingsjr 5y ago
        The whole "amazing roman concrete" speel is kind of ridiculous: https://ascconline.org/Portals/0/Technical-Article-Aug-2017_WebSC.pdf?ver=2017-08-16-144954-857 https://ascconline.org/Portals/0/Technical-Article-Aug-2017_... I wouldn't be surprised if many of those 500/1000 year old wooden houses are like the ship of Theseus. How much of those buildings has been replaced or repaired over that time period? Same thing with brick houses. When they are repointed every few decades, how many of the bricks are swapped out when they crack or crumble?
    - 5y ago
- rypskar 5y ago
  My house is closing in on 70 years, is upgraded with good insulation and it is nothing indicating it will not last for another 70 years. My family's vacation house has a core that is more than 200 years old. Both houses are made of wood. I thought it was concrete houses that had problems with transmitting sound and had poor insulation. Edit. Maybe the 40 years come from that the sidings might have to be changed after around 40 years depending on the climate. But changing the siding is not a large job, easier that changing a roof that also often have about the same lifespan
  - chrisseaton 5y ago
    140 years is a comically low bar to think of as a long-lasting house.
- nemo44x 5y ago
  40 years - who is building these homes? A wood framed home should last hundreds of years if maintained. I recently opened up part of mine to do a renovation and the 100 year old+ timber was beautiful and strong. Foundations are brick here (cinderblocks) but after that I can’t see any real advantages to using bricks for walls. They’re expensive, hard to modify, and bulky. Wood framing breathes much better too.
- Amezarak 5y ago
  > Well, in Germany it is common wisdom that stick-frame houses only live for roughly 40 years As long as the wood is protected from moisture and termites, it will get stronger over time. I have ~100 year old 2x4s in my house and they are nigh indestructible - in a way it's a bad thing because it makes renovations more difficult. Drilling into the stuff is basically impossible. Why would it last only 40 years?

corty 5y ago

Well, in Germany it is common wisdom that stick-frame houses only live for roughly 40 years, have poor insulation, poor fire safety, are prone to infestations and transmit sounds so you can hear all the footsteps everywhere. So nobody builds with wood, basically. There is a growing market, but it is still very small and mostly limited to prefab houses. There are old (>80 years), wood frame plus open clay filling buildings ("Fachwerkhaus"), but those are impossible to construct anymore due to building codes. Upkeep is extremely expensive and quality is not up to current standards, so nobody would want anything like this. Due to the reasons stated above, there is no experienced construction workers available (at least not cheaply), no architects and since that part of the building code is rarely used, statics evaluation and building permit take ages. In short, new construction will still be concrete plus bricks over here.

goodcanadian 5y ago
I suspect it is strongly down to culture and experience (i.e. "common wisdom" is wrong on both sides of the Atlantic). In North America, most everything is built in wood. There are plenty of houses approaching 100 years that are just fine. Good insulation exists and is used. Infestations aren't generally a problem in European climates. There are plenty of techniques for dampening sound. The point is, in North America, everyone builds with wood so it is very difficult (expensive) to find someone who can build in brick. There is also the issue of material availability and familiarity of building inspectors. Building anything "non-standard" will be a big pain. I am sure the same applies in Germany, but swap wood for brick or concrete.
- ghaff 5y ago
  My wood frame house in New England is 200 years old. Of course, it's had maintenance work done over the years and probably has been expanded. There are old brick houses in the city but, as you say, it's far less common.
- chrisseaton 5y ago
  > plenty of houses approaching 100 years that are just fine This is such an incredibly low bar to be citing as an achievement! I think a lot of Americans can't comprehend that if you build from a permanent material like brick or stone the house will just sit there for a thousand years.
  - goodcanadian 5y ago
    They can, but only if it is well built. Plenty of brick buildings will fall down in 100 years, too. There are wooden buildings that are hundreds of years old, also.
  - rypskar 5y ago
    I wonder if there are more brick or wooden buildings that are around thousand years old. Concrete the Romans had 2000 years ago did last, but that technology was lost. Most buildings I know about that are between 500 and 1000 years are made of wood. Of course the wars we have had in Europe since then might have had something to do with how many old houses we have
    - reportingsjr 5y ago
      The whole "amazing roman concrete" speel is kind of ridiculous: https://ascconline.org/Portals/0/Technical-Article-Aug-2017_WebSC.pdf?ver=2017-08-16-144954-857 https://ascconline.org/Portals/0/Technical-Article-Aug-2017_... I wouldn't be surprised if many of those 500/1000 year old wooden houses are like the ship of Theseus. How much of those buildings has been replaced or repaired over that time period? Same thing with brick houses. When they are repointed every few decades, how many of the bricks are swapped out when they crack or crumble?
  - 5y ago
rypskar 5y ago
My house is closing in on 70 years, is upgraded with good insulation and it is nothing indicating it will not last for another 70 years. My family's vacation house has a core that is more than 200 years old. Both houses are made of wood. I thought it was concrete houses that had problems with transmitting sound and had poor insulation. Edit. Maybe the 40 years come from that the sidings might have to be changed after around 40 years depending on the climate. But changing the siding is not a large job, easier that changing a roof that also often have about the same lifespan
- chrisseaton 5y ago
  140 years is a comically low bar to think of as a long-lasting house.
nemo44x 5y ago
40 years - who is building these homes? A wood framed home should last hundreds of years if maintained. I recently opened up part of mine to do a renovation and the 100 year old+ timber was beautiful and strong. Foundations are brick here (cinderblocks) but after that I can’t see any real advantages to using bricks for walls. They’re expensive, hard to modify, and bulky. Wood framing breathes much better too.
Amezarak 5y ago
> Well, in Germany it is common wisdom that stick-frame houses only live for roughly 40 years As long as the wood is protected from moisture and termites, it will get stronger over time. I have ~100 year old 2x4s in my house and they are nigh indestructible - in a way it's a bad thing because it makes renovations more difficult. Drilling into the stuff is basically impossible. Why would it last only 40 years?