3 ms·

They’re not though

HarryHirsch 5y ago
In many peoples' minds, Facebook is social media, in the way that Google is websearch. OK, if you won't/can't use Google there's Bing or DDG, but, seriously, what's the alternative to Facebook?
- krapp 5y ago
  >In many peoples' minds, Facebook is social media, in the way that Google is websearch. This is a popular meme, but I'm not certain it's true. Given how many people use Twitter, Reddit, Tiktok, Twitch, Instagram, Discord, etc, it doesn't seem as if they're somehow also unaware that the rest of the web or alternative means of communication exist. I mean, Donald Trump literally just started his own "social media platform," and his followers have been bouncing around right-wing "alternative" platforms for years. Not even the people primarily responsible for pushing the fear narrative around social media and it's "Orwellian" control of free speech really seem to be suffering under its hypothetical jackboot.
  - HarryHirsch 5y ago
    This is a popular meme, but I'm not certain it's true. Given how many people use Twitter, Reddit, Tiktok, Twitch, Instagram, Discord, etc, it doesn't seem as if they're somehow also unaware that the rest of the web or alternative means of communication exist. There's exactly one, maybe two of each for each type of media. Twitter for soundbits, Tiktok for video, Instagram for photo - in the past you had your choice of publishers. If one didn't like you you could go to another and at least get the message out. I'm seeing the concentration in the media market with great concern, it gives excessive power to shape opinion to a few magnates. The Trump ban is just a symptom.
    - krapp 5y ago
      In the past, you had far less choice than you do now. There are literally hundreds of social media platforms on the web, not even counting the decentralized offerings like Mastodon and Diaspora. And Trump is proving that the tried and true model of just setting up your own site still works. Somehow, despite everyone claiming he's been memory-holed and erased like Stalin erased Trotsky, he seems to be doing just fine. We seem to be living in different realities. Where you're seeing media concentrating, I'm seeing it fragmenting and diverge. The big social media silos are popular, but that popularity doesn't translate to control of the medium.
      - nailer 5y ago
        Network effects make Mastodon and Diaspora irrelevant. Facebook is political discussion with your contacts., Twitter is public political discussion.
        krapp 5y ago
        You're overstating the strength of network effects, political discussion happens everywhere.
        nailer 5y ago
        I don’t think you understand what network effects mean. Of course discussion happens elsewhere. It is less valuable because those other networks have fewer nodes.
        krapp 5y ago
        It isn't less valuable at the scale at which most human networks operate. People don't exclusively limit their online communications to one account on one platform, and most people aren't networking with millions of people at a time. If it were really impossible for effective political speech to exist outside of Facebook then Gab and Parler would never have been politically relevant for Trump supporters or the alt-right, when they demonstrably were.

They’re not though

In many peoples' minds, Facebook is social media, in the way that Google is websearch. OK, if you won't/can't use Google there's Bing or DDG, but, seriously, what's the alternative to Facebook?

krapp 5y ago
>In many peoples' minds, Facebook is social media, in the way that Google is websearch. This is a popular meme, but I'm not certain it's true. Given how many people use Twitter, Reddit, Tiktok, Twitch, Instagram, Discord, etc, it doesn't seem as if they're somehow also unaware that the rest of the web or alternative means of communication exist. I mean, Donald Trump literally just started his own "social media platform," and his followers have been bouncing around right-wing "alternative" platforms for years. Not even the people primarily responsible for pushing the fear narrative around social media and it's "Orwellian" control of free speech really seem to be suffering under its hypothetical jackboot.
- HarryHirsch 5y ago
  This is a popular meme, but I'm not certain it's true. Given how many people use Twitter, Reddit, Tiktok, Twitch, Instagram, Discord, etc, it doesn't seem as if they're somehow also unaware that the rest of the web or alternative means of communication exist. There's exactly one, maybe two of each for each type of media. Twitter for soundbits, Tiktok for video, Instagram for photo - in the past you had your choice of publishers. If one didn't like you you could go to another and at least get the message out. I'm seeing the concentration in the media market with great concern, it gives excessive power to shape opinion to a few magnates. The Trump ban is just a symptom.
  - krapp 5y ago
    In the past, you had far less choice than you do now. There are literally hundreds of social media platforms on the web, not even counting the decentralized offerings like Mastodon and Diaspora. And Trump is proving that the tried and true model of just setting up your own site still works. Somehow, despite everyone claiming he's been memory-holed and erased like Stalin erased Trotsky, he seems to be doing just fine. We seem to be living in different realities. Where you're seeing media concentrating, I'm seeing it fragmenting and diverge. The big social media silos are popular, but that popularity doesn't translate to control of the medium.
    - nailer 5y ago
      Network effects make Mastodon and Diaspora irrelevant. Facebook is political discussion with your contacts., Twitter is public political discussion.
      - krapp 5y ago
        You're overstating the strength of network effects, political discussion happens everywhere.
        nailer 5y ago
        I don’t think you understand what network effects mean. Of course discussion happens elsewhere. It is less valuable because those other networks have fewer nodes.
        krapp 5y ago
        It isn't less valuable at the scale at which most human networks operate. People don't exclusively limit their online communications to one account on one platform, and most people aren't networking with millions of people at a time. If it were really impossible for effective political speech to exist outside of Facebook then Gab and Parler would never have been politically relevant for Trump supporters or the alt-right, when they demonstrably were.