9 ms·

This is, quite literally, how every It department is supplied. Some exec gets a BJ and a free trip and you get a terrible product you’re supposed to fit into yo

This is, quite literally, how every It department is supplied. Some exec gets a BJ and a free trip and you get a terrible product you’re supposed to fit into your infra.

nix23 5y ago
Maybe in the dotcom market, but when it really maters, NO. And that's why for example Mainframes will exist for a long time if not forever.
- sargun 5y ago
  This is effectively how 100% of medical deals got made.
  - nix23 5y ago
    Well i was talking about "traditional IT" hence the Mainframe thing (Finance etc.).
- easton 5y ago
  Why do you think they chose the mainframe vendor (presumably IBM if it is still around) in the first place?
  - nix23 5y ago
    Reliability, predictability, compatibility...cost is not really important, and bribery is not a good idea in the Banking Industry. >IBM Or Fujitsu
  - ncmncm 5y ago
    IBM has very strict rules about anyone (below a certain but unspecified level!) offering or accepting anything at all. IBM employees you might meet are not allowed to so much as buy or accept lunch at a conference. The general rule for US corruption is that it is concentrated at the top. Grift at lower levels amounts to stealing from your superiors; you should be getting hand-downs, not going freelance. But US corruption has moved toward making it all legal at the top level; thus, "cost overruns" and "waste", all indictment-proof, because they are right there in the contract. So on any random tunnel, nuke, or weapons system, 10-25% is for the result and the rest goes discreetly into pockets. Top pockets. Ultimately, the latter motivates the project's organizational sponsors, and the project itself is just cover. VC firms designate a few winners and lots of loser startups. The losers are then milked, "placing" executives who then spend on designated services. In the '90s these usually included Oracle licenses at $500k and up, a certain "e-commerce platform" (name forgotten), and recruiting agencies. It seems like there are a lot more outfits to siphon money than before. (They fund losers because they are contractually obliged to place a certain amount of money in a fixed timeframe. When not enough winners show up, thd rest has to be placed on losers. Also, graft.)
    - FooBarBizBazz 5y ago
      > VC firms designate a few winner and lots of loser startups. The losers are then milked, "placing" executives who then spend on designated services. This explains so much. The new things must be cloud, auth, and HR platforms.
    - ncmncm 5y ago
      One reason solar and wind projects generally finish on time and budget, and why solar and wind costs keep dropping, may be that there are so many idealists involved. It might take decades to drive prices back up, even after the idealists are disposed of. In the meantime, those industries are not very lucrative for grifters, anyway until you get to SolarCity scale.
    - burntoutfire 5y ago
      > IBM has very strict rules about anyone (below a certain but unspecified level!) offering or accepting anything at all. IBM employees you might meet are not allowed to so much as buy or accept lunch at a conference. ...in the US. In Poland IBM was caught bribing a government official a couple years ago.
      - ncmncm 5y ago
        Ah, but was it by anyone you might meet? Or someone above that certain level?
        burntoutfire 5y ago
        It was a local "sales director" (which in many companies is a title given to pretty much everyone doing enterprise sales).
        ncmncm 5y ago
        Not everybody follows the rules. Not everybody who breaks them gets caught.
LatteLazy 5y ago
In 10 years I've never seen this happen in finance. Quite the opposite in fact: gifts bigger than a cup of coffee must be reported.
- FartyMcFarter 5y ago
  Lots of things "must" happen but don't.
- steve19 5y ago
  Nobody know's what is not declared. The Pentagon had a problem with defense contractors getting around the rules by instead holding elaborate dinner parties. They since cracked down on it. The rules still allow some scope for these kind of gifts. [0] In the private sector it is not unheard of for a salesperson to drop 5 figures on champagne. If salesman from firm A is willing to give an exec or buyer a night to remember once or twice a year, with booze costing one or two weeks salary before tax, and the salesperson from firm B simply sends a "happy holidays" card once a year, it can easily sway that exec even if they believe they are unbiased. [0] https://dodsoco.ogc.osd.mil/Portals/102/gifts.pdf https://dodsoco.ogc.osd.mil/Portals/102/gifts.pdf
  - taurath 5y ago
    "This extremely cheap knockoff of a 17th century highly valuable ceramic pot is only valued at $45, which happens to come in $5 under the allotment for bribery in your company policy"
    - exdsq 5y ago
      Reminds me of this sketch https://youtu.be/bbTfR64PArU https://youtu.be/bbTfR64PArU
      - maxwelldone 5y ago
        Yes, Minister and Yes, Prime Minister are brilliant shows.
protomyth 5y ago
Zed Shaw talked about "steak & strippers" during his ACL talk https://vimeo.com/2723800 https://vimeo.com/2723800 I guess this executive decided to go a bit beyond the normal practices.
Illniyar 5y ago
No it's not. What he did was vastly different. He basically got revenue sharing with the vendor - he opened a company and got a certain percentage of profit the vendor made from netflix sent to his company. In some he personally got shares.
jiscariot 5y ago
I'd laugh, but this is how we ended up with BMC service desk shoved down our throats at a very large insurance company I used to work for. Not sure if there was a trip though.

This is, quite literally, how every It department is supplied. Some exec gets a BJ and a free trip and you get a terrible product you’re supposed to fit into your infra.

nix23 5y ago

Maybe in the dotcom market, but when it really maters, NO. And that's why for example Mainframes will exist for a long time if not forever.

sargun 5y ago
This is effectively how 100% of medical deals got made.
- nix23 5y ago
  Well i was talking about "traditional IT" hence the Mainframe thing (Finance etc.).
easton 5y ago
Why do you think they chose the mainframe vendor (presumably IBM if it is still around) in the first place?
- nix23 5y ago
  Reliability, predictability, compatibility...cost is not really important, and bribery is not a good idea in the Banking Industry. >IBM Or Fujitsu
- ncmncm 5y ago
  IBM has very strict rules about anyone (below a certain but unspecified level!) offering or accepting anything at all. IBM employees you might meet are not allowed to so much as buy or accept lunch at a conference. The general rule for US corruption is that it is concentrated at the top. Grift at lower levels amounts to stealing from your superiors; you should be getting hand-downs, not going freelance. But US corruption has moved toward making it all legal at the top level; thus, "cost overruns" and "waste", all indictment-proof, because they are right there in the contract. So on any random tunnel, nuke, or weapons system, 10-25% is for the result and the rest goes discreetly into pockets. Top pockets. Ultimately, the latter motivates the project's organizational sponsors, and the project itself is just cover. VC firms designate a few winners and lots of loser startups. The losers are then milked, "placing" executives who then spend on designated services. In the '90s these usually included Oracle licenses at $500k and up, a certain "e-commerce platform" (name forgotten), and recruiting agencies. It seems like there are a lot more outfits to siphon money than before. (They fund losers because they are contractually obliged to place a certain amount of money in a fixed timeframe. When not enough winners show up, thd rest has to be placed on losers. Also, graft.)
  - FooBarBizBazz 5y ago
    > VC firms designate a few winner and lots of loser startups. The losers are then milked, "placing" executives who then spend on designated services. This explains so much. The new things must be cloud, auth, and HR platforms.
  - ncmncm 5y ago
    One reason solar and wind projects generally finish on time and budget, and why solar and wind costs keep dropping, may be that there are so many idealists involved. It might take decades to drive prices back up, even after the idealists are disposed of. In the meantime, those industries are not very lucrative for grifters, anyway until you get to SolarCity scale.
  - burntoutfire 5y ago
    > IBM has very strict rules about anyone (below a certain but unspecified level!) offering or accepting anything at all. IBM employees you might meet are not allowed to so much as buy or accept lunch at a conference. ...in the US. In Poland IBM was caught bribing a government official a couple years ago.
    - ncmncm 5y ago
      Ah, but was it by anyone you might meet? Or someone above that certain level?
      - burntoutfire 5y ago
        It was a local "sales director" (which in many companies is a title given to pretty much everyone doing enterprise sales).
        ncmncm 5y ago
        Not everybody follows the rules. Not everybody who breaks them gets caught.

LatteLazy 5y ago

In 10 years I've never seen this happen in finance. Quite the opposite in fact: gifts bigger than a cup of coffee must be reported.

FartyMcFarter 5y ago
Lots of things "must" happen but don't.
steve19 5y ago
Nobody know's what is not declared. The Pentagon had a problem with defense contractors getting around the rules by instead holding elaborate dinner parties. They since cracked down on it. The rules still allow some scope for these kind of gifts. [0] In the private sector it is not unheard of for a salesperson to drop 5 figures on champagne. If salesman from firm A is willing to give an exec or buyer a night to remember once or twice a year, with booze costing one or two weeks salary before tax, and the salesperson from firm B simply sends a "happy holidays" card once a year, it can easily sway that exec even if they believe they are unbiased. [0] https://dodsoco.ogc.osd.mil/Portals/102/gifts.pdf https://dodsoco.ogc.osd.mil/Portals/102/gifts.pdf
- taurath 5y ago
  "This extremely cheap knockoff of a 17th century highly valuable ceramic pot is only valued at $45, which happens to come in $5 under the allotment for bribery in your company policy"
  - exdsq 5y ago
    Reminds me of this sketch https://youtu.be/bbTfR64PArU https://youtu.be/bbTfR64PArU
    - maxwelldone 5y ago
      Yes, Minister and Yes, Prime Minister are brilliant shows.

protomyth 5y ago

Zed Shaw talked about "steak & strippers" during his ACL talk https://vimeo.com/2723800 https://vimeo.com/2723800 I guess this executive decided to go a bit beyond the normal practices.

Illniyar 5y ago

No it's not. What he did was vastly different. He basically got revenue sharing with the vendor - he opened a company and got a certain percentage of profit the vendor made from netflix sent to his company. In some he personally got shares.

jiscariot 5y ago

I'd laugh, but this is how we ended up with BMC service desk shoved down our throats at a very large insurance company I used to work for. Not sure if there was a trip though.