5 ms·

> It is not like you could allow your kids to have unlimited amount of playing any game they ask for. You can apply this to any kind of recreational activity,

by kuu 5y ago

> It is not like you could allow your kids to have unlimited amount of playing any game they ask for. You can apply this to any kind of recreational activity, it doesn't matter if it's videogames or soccer or reading books at night. If you don't put limits, they don't learn them. And of course, don't pretend to put limits at 10 when they weren't earlier on. The kids need limits for any activity, but parents aren't always there to put them.

watwut 5y ago
And with some activities it is easier then with others. Because general toy makers have hard time to make the plastic cars addictive, it is much easier with video games and A/B testing. I do know multiple families who had issue with their kid (usually boy) being aggressive when told to give away tablet. I do not know family that would deal with similar issue around books. They did solved it eventually, but the process was frustrating and took quite a lot of effort. You are also less likely to deal with someone raging while building legos, while having to deal with loud swearing teenage gamer is quite common. (Yes, in involved families, the issue is typically eventually solved. )
- raspasov 5y ago
  Just as an anecdote, I do remember raging as a kid (5-6) when I was failing to build a Lego properly, and then being extremely quiet (concentrated) while playing Counter-Strike for (too many) hours as a teenager. But I get your point :) I think it takes time and practice for people to acquire emotional stability. It can also be domain-specific. As in, you can have a lot of patience solving technical problems, but not a lot of patience dealing with people (or vice versa). Some of it perhaps is transferable, but I'm not sure to what extent.
- emteycz 5y ago
  Kids will rage just the same about books, but not much people take them away.
  - watwut 5y ago
    Absolutely not, they dont. And if they did, people would take those books away.
    - emteycz 5y ago
      Oh, I see you haven't seen many kids and never really tried taking their books away the same way people take away tablets - in the middle of a game, without much prior notice, without communicated logic and reason. From my experience as assistant teaching kids 7-10 years old and boy scout leader (7-15 y/o kids) they absolutely do rage the same way about books, cards (Magic etc) and so on. The difference is how the parent treats the activity; gamer parents are often stricter than ordinary parents but their children are not seen as 'playing that dumb game on that damn thing again', and thus their communication about it is very different. The result can be seen in the classroom: gamer parent kids are usually totally okay while talking about their use of electronics, the others get extremely defensive to the point of not talking, even though they know I am accepting. The gamer parent kids are splitting their time across activites, while the kids who are usually interrupted are trying to play as much as possible before someone interrupts them again. Also consider that a tablet is not only a personal gaming device, but a method of socialization. You're basically forcing them to go be alone, and let me tell you that kids don't accept that well even without electronic devices in question. People are not taking books away because reading is seen as good, but they should - I have seen far too many kids with ruined backs and very weird ideas about society and their behavior or place in it.
      - watwut 5y ago
        I have seen kids and seen both removed abruptly. No, the activities don't generate the same behavior.
        emteycz 5y ago
        That's why I said "many".
- kuu 5y ago
  > You are also less likely to deal with someone raging while building legos, while having to deal with loud swearing teenage gamer is quite common. (Yes, in involved families, the issue is typically eventually solved. ) And is the issue there the activity or the age?
  - watwut 5y ago
    If you can keep control over your emotions and amount of playing, playing games is not an issue. The older you are, the bigger issue rage and lack of displayed self control is. The primary issue is impact of raging on everyone around - starting from siblings and moving to parents. No matter what actual activity, 5 years old raging is less of issue, both because a.) they are still just supposed to learn self control b.) they are 5 years old out of control still cant do much damage and is not scary except for younger sibling. Teenager not controlling emotions is more uncomfortable to be around. "Loud swearing teenager/adult" is someone you don't want to live with. Playing games is more likely to trigger them into such state. The gaming culture is more likely to validate such behavior and labeling it as cool or expected - while labeling those who object as overly controlling. So the end result is that instead of realizing "I acted like asshole I better control myself or play different game", they have no subjective reason to work on it.
    - kuu 5y ago
      So basically what I said: > And of course, don't pretend to put limits at 10 when they weren't earlier on.
raspasov 5y ago
As parents, we do currently put limits (TV, phone games, etc) but I question the validity of the approach all the time. As a kid I had mostly no limits on anything... Could I have built better discipline with limits? Maybe... Or maybe I would just resent my parents more. It's hard for me to tell from my perspective.
- TchoBeer 5y ago
  I'm the same way. My parents were very hands off in that respect (more because they were busy than anything else) and I wonder if that's had any negative effects on me, or if I should be more restrictive of my kids.
- watwut 5y ago
  We put limits on things, because we have friends who did not had them. We did not liked how the situation developed there, they did not either and then put limits on things. In any case, I did had limits when I was a kid. My parents enforced when I went to sleep. They were proactively sending me outside when I was spending too much time reading. I did homework mostly without issues, but when I started to forget it in one period, there were some limits too. And then there were "natural" limits in term of me having to go to various activities I was signed up to - I could not just skipped. With computer games specifically, there were natural limitations of single computer in family of four where work/studying automatically took precedence from gaming. And plus no kid was allowed to monopolize computer for himself. And parents would kick you out of computer if it was late (it was in their room anyway).
- kuu 5y ago
  When I talked about limits I was not referring to a hard limit with a clock and amount of hours they can spend. Maybe it could be just as simple as teaching importance of things ("you can play videogames once you finish your homework"), this is also a limit.

by kuu 5y ago

watwut 5y ago

And with some activities it is easier then with others. Because general toy makers have hard time to make the plastic cars addictive, it is much easier with video games and A/B testing. I do know multiple families who had issue with their kid (usually boy) being aggressive when told to give away tablet. I do not know family that would deal with similar issue around books. They did solved it eventually, but the process was frustrating and took quite a lot of effort. You are also less likely to deal with someone raging while building legos, while having to deal with loud swearing teenage gamer is quite common. (Yes, in involved families, the issue is typically eventually solved. )

raspasov 5y ago
Just as an anecdote, I do remember raging as a kid (5-6) when I was failing to build a Lego properly, and then being extremely quiet (concentrated) while playing Counter-Strike for (too many) hours as a teenager. But I get your point :) I think it takes time and practice for people to acquire emotional stability. It can also be domain-specific. As in, you can have a lot of patience solving technical problems, but not a lot of patience dealing with people (or vice versa). Some of it perhaps is transferable, but I'm not sure to what extent.
emteycz 5y ago
Kids will rage just the same about books, but not much people take them away.
- watwut 5y ago
  Absolutely not, they dont. And if they did, people would take those books away.
  - emteycz 5y ago
    Oh, I see you haven't seen many kids and never really tried taking their books away the same way people take away tablets - in the middle of a game, without much prior notice, without communicated logic and reason. From my experience as assistant teaching kids 7-10 years old and boy scout leader (7-15 y/o kids) they absolutely do rage the same way about books, cards (Magic etc) and so on. The difference is how the parent treats the activity; gamer parents are often stricter than ordinary parents but their children are not seen as 'playing that dumb game on that damn thing again', and thus their communication about it is very different. The result can be seen in the classroom: gamer parent kids are usually totally okay while talking about their use of electronics, the others get extremely defensive to the point of not talking, even though they know I am accepting. The gamer parent kids are splitting their time across activites, while the kids who are usually interrupted are trying to play as much as possible before someone interrupts them again. Also consider that a tablet is not only a personal gaming device, but a method of socialization. You're basically forcing them to go be alone, and let me tell you that kids don't accept that well even without electronic devices in question. People are not taking books away because reading is seen as good, but they should - I have seen far too many kids with ruined backs and very weird ideas about society and their behavior or place in it.
    - watwut 5y ago
      I have seen kids and seen both removed abruptly. No, the activities don't generate the same behavior.
      - emteycz 5y ago
        That's why I said "many".
kuu 5y ago
> You are also less likely to deal with someone raging while building legos, while having to deal with loud swearing teenage gamer is quite common. (Yes, in involved families, the issue is typically eventually solved. ) And is the issue there the activity or the age?
- watwut 5y ago
  If you can keep control over your emotions and amount of playing, playing games is not an issue. The older you are, the bigger issue rage and lack of displayed self control is. The primary issue is impact of raging on everyone around - starting from siblings and moving to parents. No matter what actual activity, 5 years old raging is less of issue, both because a.) they are still just supposed to learn self control b.) they are 5 years old out of control still cant do much damage and is not scary except for younger sibling. Teenager not controlling emotions is more uncomfortable to be around. "Loud swearing teenager/adult" is someone you don't want to live with. Playing games is more likely to trigger them into such state. The gaming culture is more likely to validate such behavior and labeling it as cool or expected - while labeling those who object as overly controlling. So the end result is that instead of realizing "I acted like asshole I better control myself or play different game", they have no subjective reason to work on it.
  - kuu 5y ago
    So basically what I said: > And of course, don't pretend to put limits at 10 when they weren't earlier on.

raspasov 5y ago

As parents, we do currently put limits (TV, phone games, etc) but I question the validity of the approach all the time. As a kid I had mostly no limits on anything... Could I have built better discipline with limits? Maybe... Or maybe I would just resent my parents more. It's hard for me to tell from my perspective.

TchoBeer 5y ago
I'm the same way. My parents were very hands off in that respect (more because they were busy than anything else) and I wonder if that's had any negative effects on me, or if I should be more restrictive of my kids.
watwut 5y ago
We put limits on things, because we have friends who did not had them. We did not liked how the situation developed there, they did not either and then put limits on things. In any case, I did had limits when I was a kid. My parents enforced when I went to sleep. They were proactively sending me outside when I was spending too much time reading. I did homework mostly without issues, but when I started to forget it in one period, there were some limits too. And then there were "natural" limits in term of me having to go to various activities I was signed up to - I could not just skipped. With computer games specifically, there were natural limitations of single computer in family of four where work/studying automatically took precedence from gaming. And plus no kid was allowed to monopolize computer for himself. And parents would kick you out of computer if it was late (it was in their room anyway).
kuu 5y ago
When I talked about limits I was not referring to a hard limit with a clock and amount of hours they can spend. Maybe it could be just as simple as teaching importance of things ("you can play videogames once you finish your homework"), this is also a limit.