5 ms·

> our teacher asked all of the women Sounds like a pretty sexist thing to do. The same question can be asked without putting women on the spot. "If you were to

> our teacher asked all of the women Sounds like a pretty sexist thing to do. The same question can be asked without putting women on the spot. "If you were to buy a diamond, what would you rather choose?"

NikolaNovak 5y ago
My initial instinct agreed with you,but I then wondered if there would actually be a relevant gender difference in answers. In western culture, still today I think,majority of men would be buying and majority of women would be receiving diamonds. It would be interesting if this affects answers. Would a buyer go for more practical cheaper option while receiver goes for more expensive traditional options? Or a different split completely , or none? I think it'd be a fascinating exercise.
- vulpesx2 5y ago
  Same reaction. I've anecdotally asked this same question: "man-made or natural diamonds?" to my friends in the past – mostly because I can't get past the ethical concerns, but wanted to understand the other side. I found majority of my men friends argued it's the same diamond without the ethical concerns if you go man-made, while majority of my women friends chose natural (reasons included social pressure, the story, and so on). Anecdotes aren't proof. But perhaps there is something to looking at this from a gendered (proxy for giving vs. receiving?) lens.
  - frockington1 5y ago
    As a male giving a ring, I bought a real one. Logic was that it was cheaper and better quality once you get over ~1-1.25 carats. If lab made wants to compete more meaningfully they'll need to get better at the engagement ring size diamonds which I'm sure they will with time
    - aquadrop 5y ago
      They are both real.
- bildung 5y ago
  > In western culture This phenomenon has to be more localized than Western culture (the worldwide diamond consumption hints at it being US-specific?) - I for example don't know anyone who even contemplated buying one for proposing. Granted, this is purely anectotal, but over extended family and workplace colleagues this includes a bunch of milieus.
  - NikolaNovak 5y ago
    Sure; there's definitely going to be a significant time variable then if we want to start getting specific.
  - mNovak 5y ago
    Yes I do think it's an american thing to buy a separate engagement ring, having a prominent diamond, in addition to wedding rings (which often don't have diamonds). My family in Europe doesn't have the whole engagement ring concept.
- tom_mellior 5y ago
  I would expect there to be a gender difference in the US, due to the social influence of marketing. But I don't think highlighting the difference would help the discussion in any way. If the professor is making an argument that one choice is clearly the rational choice, and then highlights differences in how different groups make that choice, then they are directly implying that some groups are more irrational than others.
Siira 5y ago
Well, there are (lots of) statistical regularities that disfavor specific groups of people. And any one individual could have answered “no,” and thus avoided showing themselves as an idiot who values rocks just because a monopoly prices them exorbitantly.
mensetmanusman 5y ago
This doesn’t help the discussion.
slightwinder 5y ago
Its more the marketing that is sexist. Marketing for Jewelry (and especially diamonds) usually aims at woman, not men. Men more likely would choose the cost-saving option, because for them there is not much awarness around the pricing of such meaningless "decoration". And this would kinda sabotage the purpose of the question.
Sakos 5y ago
He asked that way because it's irrelevant what the man would choose in the case that he's buying it for a woman (which is generally the case). If a majority of women prefer "real" diamonds, there's no way he's going to use his preference over hers for something this important. Women's preferences determine diamond buying behavior on the market. If you want to make a difference, you have to start there.

NikolaNovak 5y ago

My initial instinct agreed with you,but I then wondered if there would actually be a relevant gender difference in answers. In western culture, still today I think,majority of men would be buying and majority of women would be receiving diamonds. It would be interesting if this affects answers. Would a buyer go for more practical cheaper option while receiver goes for more expensive traditional options? Or a different split completely , or none? I think it'd be a fascinating exercise.

vulpesx2 5y ago
Same reaction. I've anecdotally asked this same question: "man-made or natural diamonds?" to my friends in the past – mostly because I can't get past the ethical concerns, but wanted to understand the other side. I found majority of my men friends argued it's the same diamond without the ethical concerns if you go man-made, while majority of my women friends chose natural (reasons included social pressure, the story, and so on). Anecdotes aren't proof. But perhaps there is something to looking at this from a gendered (proxy for giving vs. receiving?) lens.
- frockington1 5y ago
  As a male giving a ring, I bought a real one. Logic was that it was cheaper and better quality once you get over ~1-1.25 carats. If lab made wants to compete more meaningfully they'll need to get better at the engagement ring size diamonds which I'm sure they will with time
  - aquadrop 5y ago
    They are both real.
bildung 5y ago
> In western culture This phenomenon has to be more localized than Western culture (the worldwide diamond consumption hints at it being US-specific?) - I for example don't know anyone who even contemplated buying one for proposing. Granted, this is purely anectotal, but over extended family and workplace colleagues this includes a bunch of milieus.
- NikolaNovak 5y ago
  Sure; there's definitely going to be a significant time variable then if we want to start getting specific.
- mNovak 5y ago
  Yes I do think it's an american thing to buy a separate engagement ring, having a prominent diamond, in addition to wedding rings (which often don't have diamonds). My family in Europe doesn't have the whole engagement ring concept.
tom_mellior 5y ago
I would expect there to be a gender difference in the US, due to the social influence of marketing. But I don't think highlighting the difference would help the discussion in any way. If the professor is making an argument that one choice is clearly the rational choice, and then highlights differences in how different groups make that choice, then they are directly implying that some groups are more irrational than others.

Siira 5y ago

Well, there are (lots of) statistical regularities that disfavor specific groups of people. And any one individual could have answered “no,” and thus avoided showing themselves as an idiot who values rocks just because a monopoly prices them exorbitantly.

mensetmanusman 5y ago

This doesn’t help the discussion.

slightwinder 5y ago

Its more the marketing that is sexist. Marketing for Jewelry (and especially diamonds) usually aims at woman, not men. Men more likely would choose the cost-saving option, because for them there is not much awarness around the pricing of such meaningless "decoration". And this would kinda sabotage the purpose of the question.

Sakos 5y ago

He asked that way because it's irrelevant what the man would choose in the case that he's buying it for a woman (which is generally the case). If a majority of women prefer "real" diamonds, there's no way he's going to use his preference over hers for something this important. Women's preferences determine diamond buying behavior on the market. If you want to make a difference, you have to start there.