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I honestly think it's weird that more people aren't "sceptics", however stupid that word is in itself. I would gladly take the Pfizer/Moderna vaccine right thi

I honestly think it's weird that more people aren't "sceptics", however stupid that word is in itself. I would gladly take the Pfizer/Moderna vaccine right this minute, but i also know of the terrible track records the pharmaindustry - there is so many shady examples to choose from it's incredible that anyone doubts how vulture-like that industry is, - also there was corruption the last time a pandemic hit: https://healthcare-in-europe.com/en/news/european-parliament-to-investigate-who-pandemic-scandal.html https://healthcare-in-europe.com/en/news/european-parliament... Besides that we are on completely uncharted territory scale wise and trial wise no matter what your perspective is.

passivate 5y ago
I work in biotech (vaccines), so we have some overlap with pharma, and none of what you said resonates with me. Sorry, but you're applying a pretty broad brush to millions of hardworking people in this industry that is completely unwarranted. As an aside, nobody I know is going to refuse life saving medication because 'pharma industry is bad'. The pharma industry is no different than any other industry. The vast majority of people are honest hardworking folks just doing their job, and you have a handful of assholes. As such, you have to look at things on a case by case basis. You can't reject the tech industry because Facebook did something bad. There are millions of criminals in the world, we don't reject humanity based on it. This is simply not a sustainable method of arriving at any sort of conclusion.
- kossTKR 5y ago
  I don't disagree. Most people actually working with the actual science are good people - just as in tech. The problem comes from ruthless profit incentives, lobbying, marketing, investor pressure etc. Nowhere did i say that the everyone in the industry are bad people, my whole point was about history of shadiness. That's not controversial - again just as in the sector big-data / internet business that i work in. Anyone should be highly sceptical of any huge corporations. I find it very weird that there have literally been non stop scandals, and huge ones too, and still people get angry when people are sceptical of anything "big corp". Always be sceptical of anything with billions of dollars invested, armies of lawyers, PR departments that would shadow small governments etc.
  - passivate 5y ago
    >Anyone should be highly sceptical of any huge corporations. That is completely different than saying calling it a vulture-like industry, or implying something about the entire industry. There are many companies - small and large in this industry. Again, you're simply diluting your own argument by making it absurd and easy to refute. I won't argue with you over specific examples of when companies (in any industry) engage in terrible behavior. 'big corp' exists in every industry. When there is a lot (money/power) at stake, there are perverse incentives to protect their 'golden goose' so to speak. Its our primitive reptilian brain taking control. There are such examples in every industry. But again, that doesn't make the entire industry bad - which was my point.
    - kossTKR 5y ago
      I would also describe much of the tech industry i have been part of as "vulture-like" and a pretty dirty game, that's just how it is. Maybe i just have more cynical view of the state of capitalism in our current age, but i don't this view is controversial, or taboo to say out loud. I also know a couple of fantastic film makers, though i think Hollywood, and the movie industry is pretty rotten, and my friends are just like "yeah it's a rotten industry" then they laugh when talking about industry stuff. Why do you have to see it as a personal part of your identity and take it personally? We live in a world of dirty games, the monetary hierarchy is not fair, nepotism and family rule is widespread, lobbyism is out of control, etc. none of this i controversial.
      - passivate 5y ago
        Its just a normal human emotion towards members of your own tribe. I transitioned out from tech into biotech, and I would probably feel the same if people leveled accusations against all tech people. I am not interested in an intellectual monk like existence. Our subjectivity is what makes us human. But to answer your question, I have no way of knowing where you're coming from other than the information you volunteer. Its no different than me calling my own brother ugly, versus a random person on the street calling my brother ugly. Those statements 'hit' differently. Similarly, you having a frank conversation with your buddies is not comparable to other conversations with strangers on the internet.

passivate 5y ago

I work in biotech (vaccines), so we have some overlap with pharma, and none of what you said resonates with me. Sorry, but you're applying a pretty broad brush to millions of hardworking people in this industry that is completely unwarranted. As an aside, nobody I know is going to refuse life saving medication because 'pharma industry is bad'. The pharma industry is no different than any other industry. The vast majority of people are honest hardworking folks just doing their job, and you have a handful of assholes. As such, you have to look at things on a case by case basis. You can't reject the tech industry because Facebook did something bad. There are millions of criminals in the world, we don't reject humanity based on it. This is simply not a sustainable method of arriving at any sort of conclusion.

kossTKR 5y ago
I don't disagree. Most people actually working with the actual science are good people - just as in tech. The problem comes from ruthless profit incentives, lobbying, marketing, investor pressure etc. Nowhere did i say that the everyone in the industry are bad people, my whole point was about history of shadiness. That's not controversial - again just as in the sector big-data / internet business that i work in. Anyone should be highly sceptical of any huge corporations. I find it very weird that there have literally been non stop scandals, and huge ones too, and still people get angry when people are sceptical of anything "big corp". Always be sceptical of anything with billions of dollars invested, armies of lawyers, PR departments that would shadow small governments etc.
- passivate 5y ago
  >Anyone should be highly sceptical of any huge corporations. That is completely different than saying calling it a vulture-like industry, or implying something about the entire industry. There are many companies - small and large in this industry. Again, you're simply diluting your own argument by making it absurd and easy to refute. I won't argue with you over specific examples of when companies (in any industry) engage in terrible behavior. 'big corp' exists in every industry. When there is a lot (money/power) at stake, there are perverse incentives to protect their 'golden goose' so to speak. Its our primitive reptilian brain taking control. There are such examples in every industry. But again, that doesn't make the entire industry bad - which was my point.
  - kossTKR 5y ago
    I would also describe much of the tech industry i have been part of as "vulture-like" and a pretty dirty game, that's just how it is. Maybe i just have more cynical view of the state of capitalism in our current age, but i don't this view is controversial, or taboo to say out loud. I also know a couple of fantastic film makers, though i think Hollywood, and the movie industry is pretty rotten, and my friends are just like "yeah it's a rotten industry" then they laugh when talking about industry stuff. Why do you have to see it as a personal part of your identity and take it personally? We live in a world of dirty games, the monetary hierarchy is not fair, nepotism and family rule is widespread, lobbyism is out of control, etc. none of this i controversial.
    - passivate 5y ago
      Its just a normal human emotion towards members of your own tribe. I transitioned out from tech into biotech, and I would probably feel the same if people leveled accusations against all tech people. I am not interested in an intellectual monk like existence. Our subjectivity is what makes us human. But to answer your question, I have no way of knowing where you're coming from other than the information you volunteer. Its no different than me calling my own brother ugly, versus a random person on the street calling my brother ugly. Those statements 'hit' differently. Similarly, you having a frank conversation with your buddies is not comparable to other conversations with strangers on the internet.