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> It's hilarious to a certain extent that they built the thing smaller than all the competition and bulk it up with a wad of leather anyhow. That's essentially

• caturopath 5y ago
  It's not like the choice is "thick and doesn't need a case or thin and needs a case". Even if the phone was thicker, people would be using cases if they bought it, right?
  • selykg 5y ago
    Probably not everyone. But for me, after spending $1400 I’m putting it in a case. My Xs Max is nearly two and a half years old now and I took it out of the case for it’s scheduled cleaning and after wiping it down and getting the built up pocket crud out of the crevices where the case and phone meet, its like brand new. I’m hoping I can get at least another year out of this thing. Battery is excellent. iOS doesn’t seem slow at all.
    • perryizgr8 5y ago
      The reason for putting it in a case is not the price tag. People buy 100k cars and don't cover the outer surfaces with protective plastic. The problem is Apple builds the phone in a fragile manner, prone to breaking and scratching. It's true of other phones too.
      • dijit 5y ago
        I distinctly remember people at Nokia laughing at how the first iPhone didn’t stand up to any of their robustness tests. Obviously they were wrong and people bought them (due to the fit and finish of the software, not robustness or battery life) and the first iPhone feels like it was much more durable than the latest generations with their protruding cameras, glass on two sides and edge to edge screen.
        • perryizgr8 5y ago
          Yeah the new phones are laughably non-robust. Use an iPhone without a case or protective film for a year and I guarantee you there will be micro scratches on the back glass. They don't design the phone to be used without a case. People use cases because of that, not because of the price tag.
          • dijit 5y ago
            Speaking personally; I bought a iPhone 12 mini near launch, got a nice leather case for it because I dislike the camera bump but still managed to get a scratch (which I can feel) on the screen a mere week in. I’m pretty careful with my phone too, has its own pocket doesn’t mix with anything. I’m actually quite displeased; especially as scratch resistance was a touted feature. EDIT: never mind. It was drop resistance. Not scratch resistance.
          • gumby 5y ago
            Who cares about micro (or even macro) scratches on the back? It’s the front you look at.
      • davidmurdoch 5y ago
        > People buy 100k cars and don't cover the outer surfaces with protective plastic Yes, they do. Look up Paint Protection Film. Ceramic coating is also very commonly used to protect the car's paint, plastics, and glass.
        • perryizgr8 5y ago
          Is it as common as putting a case on your phone? I doubt it. My point is that Apple and others can easily make far more durable phones for the price they ask, and not need literally everyone to use a case.
          • davidmurdoch 5y ago
            I'm not sure how common it is in general, but for people who care about their car's paint it is common, and I imagine people who buy $100k+ cars are probably the type that have their cars detailed regularly by a professional. Doesn't matter though. It's not in phone manufacturers' best interests to make durable phones. They need to make trendy phones, as that's what the majority have voted for (with their wallets). And Apple users have it the worst, as the lock-in leaves them with no alternative phone manufacturers). Even with protective cases many flagship phones won't be very useable after 2 years anyway, as the battery life decreases, the OS and apps do more and more things, and flash storage starts to fail/slow.
            • selykg 5y ago
              > Even with protective cases many flagship phones won't be very useable after 2 years anyway, as the battery life decreases, the OS and apps do more and more things, and flash storage starts to fail/slow. My iPhone disagrees with this. I've used it pretty heavily for over two years now and it's still going strong. I see no reason why I can't get at least 3 out of it. I figure I make it to fall of 2022 and it'll be nearly 4 years old before I replace it.
      • jjeaff 5y ago
        You don't hold a car in your hand and stare at it all day. But also, cars are mostly painted with a clear coat that can be buffed or sanded and buffed to remove imperfections.
      • hombre_fatal 5y ago
        I want the shock absorber of my $1000 device to be changeable, not built into the phone so that when I go to sell it, it looks like a banged up Nokia brick with shredded rubber bumpers with a faded scratched screen I can barely read anymore.
    • gumby 5y ago
      > I’m hoping I can get at least another year out of this thing. A year should be no problem. I just replaced my iPhone 6s and Apple Watch 0 in February. If I hadn’t decided I wanted the NFC functionality I would have simply replaced the battery. I don’t bother with a case because it’s often simply my pocket, which is a case I guess.
    • mnouquet 5y ago
      > after spending $1400 Damn, I feel silly, I have bought 9 phones over the past 3 years and still haven't spent that kind of money...
  • pcl 5y ago
    I put my phone in a case so that when I drop it, the corner of the case takes the brunt of the force instead of the phone itself. Unless the phone had a floating edge around it (essentially, a case), I would still need one. (Yes, it’s still possible to drop my phone face down on a rock or something, but most of the times I’ve broken a phone screen, it’s been a crack in the glass emanating from a corner. Which makes sense, given the physics of the things.)
  • falcolas 5y ago
    Me? No. I get a case because of the fscking camera bump (though with the latest model, it's more tumor than bump). I just want my phone to lay flat.
    • asdff 5y ago
      It's like a wobbly table until you bend the knee and shell out a few bucks for a case. Same thing with removing the ports: can't charge your phone and listen to music at the same time if you are a wired charger user and wired headphone listener. That privilege previously enjoyed by default on every single cell phone ever made is now reserved to customers who purchase wireless charging or wireless headphone accessories. Shell out a few more bucks on junk you didn't need a generation ago, or deal with a sub par experience out of the box, as always with Apple these days.
  • NathanielK 5y ago
    I disagree. With modern materials, the thinness is the root of durability compromises. I've used my Xperia XZ1 compact for several years without a case. I've dropped it on concrete floors, sat on it, and used it in the mud. There're some chips in the paint, but the fiberglass body underneath is fine. Any scratches on the Gorilla Glass 5 are barely visible. My old phones with cheap poly-carbonate backs(cracks easily) and thin GG3(cracks,scratches are apparent) were fragile in comparison. The material science has improved with modern phones, but manufacturers choose to make fragile phones. You don't need thick overmoulding and port covers to make a phome durable without a case. The materials are strong enough on the high end phones. The problem is that when you make the glass thinner and exposed at the corners, it will crack with much less impact. The overall thinness means less flexural rigidity (rigidity is proportional to thickness cubed), you can snap a modern phone with your hands. Cheap new phones get it even worse. They use flimsier materials to cram a better SoC in, and still are rarely waterproof.
  • snotrockets 5y ago
    Some comments below suggests cases are for protection. I'd argue most cases are bought first & foremost a fashion accessory, then a safety device. Think wallets or watches.
  • myself248 5y ago
    Back when phones were built to survive the outside world without a case, I never put cases on my phones. The whole Nextel and Nokia and Blackberry era, not a one. They looked a bit worn from a few years each in my pocket with my keys, but they all worked fine, and they'd all survive a drop to the floor. Today the only phone I'd trust to survive a naked drop would be a Unihertz Titan, but until there's an AOSP ROM for it, I'm not trusting it with my data. So, cases on everything.
    • thatguy0900 5y ago
      There's also a line of phones made by CAT, the construction company, that looks pretty durable. I've been thinking about getting one just to have fun with the thermal camera.
      • WrtCdEvrydy 5y ago
        I like those phones and never had one (either CAT or third party) fail... the issue is that the processor / RAM setup is always a little on the weak side and OS updates are a problem. I'd probably buy my first ever iPhone if Apple came out with a ruggedized version of the current iPhone SE.
        • thatguy0900 5y ago
          Yeah, the os updates is why I've been holding off. Basically just have to accept you won't get any
          • WrtCdEvrydy 5y ago
            I mean, to be honest, I didn't pay a lot of my original one (non-CAT) but it's on Android 8.0.1 forever... which isn't exactly a bad version. I wish Android would decouple the device drivers from the kernel space kinda like a desktop OS so your manufacturer could just supply their drivers and you could upgrade the OS at will... a man can dream.
            • 5y ago
  • adrr 5y ago
    If the back wasn’t slick glass you’ll get more people without cases.
  • yumraj 5y ago
    > Even if the phone was thicker, people would be using cases if they bought it, right? People started using cases for most part after the iPhone came out. Older phones were almost never used with a case, except perhaps for use case requiring a ruggedized enclosure.
    • grishka 5y ago
      I remember some people, especially elderly, putting their (dumb) phones into those protective plastic cases. The kind where you'd push the buttons through the plastic. That was looong before the iPhone came out and when something was considered a smartphone if it ran Symbian.
    • frosted-flakes 5y ago
      BlackBerry phones had those holster cases, and I remember my dad's first cell phone (a Nokia, around year 2000) had this fabric and clear plastic case that the antenna pokes out of (like the sibling comment describes). Even though that phone was indestructible, with big rubber buttons and a plastic screen.
• asdff 5y ago
  It's the thinnest iphone ever that hasn't sat flat on a table for years. Touch the screen and it wobbles like a bar table needing some coasters under a leg. Apple purposely designs their cases to be flush with the camera bump, knowing that for most users, the phone will just live in a case. It's kind of ridiculous to build that baked in expectation for more accessory buying directly into your device, but I guess that's modern design principles. Extract more dollar, and leave you with the equivalent of a wobbly table if you don't buy in.
  • pentae 5y ago
    I have an 11 pro without a case on it and just tried replicating what you're describing and I can't do it. It pivots at most 1-2mm laterally to the left when i'm tapping hard on the left side of the screen which is barely noticeable. When I tap normally (a bit softer) or swipe it doesn't even move. I'm no fanboy but i'm amazed that out of all the things you could critique about Apple it would be this one.
    • noelherrick 5y ago
      I can't believe you're serious. Since the iPhone X, a screen replacement has been such a significant percentage of the cost it's not worth it. And if you damage the back glass, Apple will just replace the phone. Before the X, I was a bare phone user. After that, there is no way I would leave my phone exposed. The only way I could justify that danger would be if I could swallow a $1500 expense every other week. Why? Fully glass phones slide off of everything. I'm sure there are HNers who can do that but I can't.
      • FDSGSG 5y ago
        Why don't you just get applecare plus? Getting a case has never even crossed my mind, I can just go replace my phone for free whenever I want.
        • jjeaff 5y ago
          What are you talking about? It's not free, there is a deductible. And it's not anytime you want. It's a maximum of 2 incidences per year. So you pay $200 a year plus $30 for cracking your screen. Or $150 for loss or theft. I'm guessing you could get a third party screen repair for less than $230.
• powersnail 5y ago
  > That's essentially how I feel when I see the "Our thinnest iPhone ever" slide knowing that 95% of iPhone owners put it in a bulky case I was in the same boat until and I dropped my phone and break the back, which is ridiculously expensive to fix. I use a case now, which only takes 10 bucks to replace if broken. It’s not as pretty as a naked phone, but it’s practical.
  • cube2222 5y ago
    I've had this attitude before, but I must say, the recent iPhones at least (iPhone 11 in my case) are ridiculously resistant to damage. Mine is not in a case and regularly has scary-looking falls, but there's almost no-scratch. Only on the edges of the aluminum body you can see the paint scratched off in some places. I've found that the added bulk of a case makes me drop my phone much more frequently.
• agumonkey 5y ago
  yesterday i was holding my phone with protective glass, rubber case, all wired to an external battery and laughed at larger than a nokia 3310 monstrosity. Modern times.
• dpkonofa 5y ago
  I know it means nothing but I'm in the 5%. I've never had a case on my iPhone and I've owned every other generation since the original (I always skip generations for my devices since they started doing the incremental S versions). I prefer things without cases and the AirTags are going to be no exception. I'm going to throw them into a pocket or put them into an already existing spot so I like that it's thin.
  • kevindong 5y ago
    What are you going to track without using some kind of holder? Personally, I only bought one AirTag (along with an Apple leather keychain, for my keys). I don't generally lose items large enough to have some kind of pocket/holder for an AirTag (e.g. I don't ever lose my backpack which has a zippered compartment to hold random junk).
• wincy 5y ago
  Wow I didn’t believe this stat, but sure enough 87% of people use cases on their iPhones. I didn’t know people were so paranoid, I love my iPhone 12 Pro Max because it feels perfect in my hand despite being so large. I feel like a case would ruin that. I wonder if it’s paranoia or actual clumsiness or maybe just salespeople that get people to buy cases. I’ve owned an iPhone since the 3G and have dropped my naked phone exactly once, my 6 Plus, which was still usable for years after that.
  • deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  • ngoldbaum 5y ago
    Glass is much more slippery than a plastic or leather case. I’ve cracked a caseless phone’s screen after it slipped off a slightly off-level table. I always use leather cases now and no longer have the problem of my phone randomly slipping off of surfaces or even falling out of my greasy hands.
    • qqqwerty 5y ago
      It boggles my mind that phone makers don't use a grippy surface on the phones. The sleek surfaces look great in marketing photos but make for horrible usability. I use Android and once a phone is nearing the 3/4 mark of it's useful life, I pull the cases off because at that point the smaller/sleeker form factor helps offset the annoying performance degradation. With my Nexus 5, which had a grippy back, the screen is still intact to this day. My Nexus 6p, which has a metallic back, slipped out of my hand the very first day I took the case off and the screen shattered. My new strategy is to just buy a mid-low range android at the end of the sales cycle for a steep discount. I got last years Moto G Power model for about 40 bucks. Once I get about half way through it's useful life (~2 years), I am going to take the case off and I am going to scuff it up with sand paper and then spray on some truck liner or other grippy surfacing agent.