5 ms·

In next version of Sid Meier's Civilization there should be Linux Kernel in technology tree.

1_player 5y ago
Wouldn't that make it available to only one civilization? Should be a shared Wonder all civilizations would benefit from.
- Waterluvian 5y ago
  The tech tree is researchable by everyone.
  - pletnes 5y ago
    Exactly - linux was built only once in real life.
- eru 5y ago
  Technologies are usually available for everyone to research.
  - nicklecompte 5y ago
    I think they mean that when a civ researches (or “builds”) Linux every player in the game should have access to it (but the civ who spent the resources building Linux gets something extra). If Linux was on the tech tree, only the civilizations who researched Linux could use it. That’s not very FOSS! Every civilization who had computers should be able to get Linux once it’s out.
    - throw0101a 5y ago
      > I think they mean that when a civ researches (or “builds”) Linux every player in the game should have access to it (but the civ who spent the resources building Linux gets something extra). Actually that would be an interesting mechanic: to move forward in the tech tree you have to research something, but by researching it you give it all the players. Do you stall your own progress, or take the hit to move forward and float all ships higher by raising the technological tide? How do the devs program the AI countries to make choice(s) in single-player, and what would a human player do? Who blinks first?
      - kibwen 5y ago
        One of the games has something like this. After researching the internet technology (or maybe it's a wonder?), any time any tech has been researched by any two civs, you instantly research the tech for free.
        eru 5y ago
        The Great Library used to work like this in Civ I.
      - moreira 5y ago
        This isn't new, so we don't need to speculate about it. Older civs had this. Civ IV has the Manhattan Project, and the Apollo Program, both of which enable new stuff for all civilizations, once built (nukes, and space race).
        throw0101a 5y ago
        I'd be more interested in having something like Irrigation or the Wheel. Perhaps one tech per Era as a 'blocker'. * https://civilization.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_technologies_in_Civ6 https://civilization.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_technologies_in...
      - nicklecompte 5y ago
        In addition to the comments below, I think a way to implement your idea is to have certain technologies automatically shared between trading partners and/or alliances - and also wars. This exists in other 4X games but not really any of the Civ series IIRC. You can trade generic science points but certain technologies and civics could be shared directly by trade and military engagements with foreign powers (wheel, military tactics, currency, printing press, etc).
      - jeffbee 5y ago
        That’s how the fission tech works in some versions of Civ.
- nicklecompte 5y ago
  Shared wonder is a much better idea - every civilization that researches Computers tech will have operating systems, but only one gets to develop Linux (let’s say it grants a science boost to everyone who finished researching Computers, but a huge culture/diplomacy boost to the civ that actually “built” Linux). Similar to every civ gets a library, but there’s only one Library of Alexandria, etc.
  - 1_player 5y ago
    That's the thing. Linux wasn't made by any one culture or country. Linux is a distributed product of the world no one can claim in good conscience. It's not Finnish, nor American, nor by Intel or by Google. It's not even Linus'. It's made by all of its contributors from all over the world. In Civ parlance, whoever gets the Linux Kernel technology gets the same benefit as anybody else. No one is richer or better than the other civilization because of it, everybody is.
    - nicklecompte 5y ago
      It’s a more basic conceptual mistake to say that Linux is a technology on the tech tree alongside Telecommunications / Computers / Wheel / etc. It would be like having “Automobilism” but then later “Lincoln Town Car.” I get what you are saying about Linux being available to all (hence a shared wonder - the boost to the civilization who developed Linux can be interpreted as increased academic prestige, etc). The point is that Linux is a specific product of technology, not a broad area of human tech.
      - skissane 5y ago
        Linux could easily have never existed. At the time Linus got started in 1991, *BSD was tied up in a legal dispute (which was not resolved until 1994), and Minix was only available under a restrictive license (Minix was relicensed BSD in 2000) If either of those legal issues had not existed in 1991, Linus probably would never have started Linux [0], and Linux's place in history would have been assumed by something else – most likely some BSD derivative or a descendant of Minix. (Minix's microkernel architecture, while elegant, has a performance cost. However, Minix could have easily been hacked into a monolithic kernel, which is basically what Apple did to Mach, and Microsoft did with win32k.sys. Or maybe it could have evolved towards a higher performance microkernel architecture, such as is found in L4) In terms of the "technology tree", Linux occupies the place of "leading openly developed FLOSS operating system". If Linux hadn't occupied that place, some other system would have instead. And there is a chance even that one day Linux might be dethroned. (Unlikely to happen any time soon, but maybe some decades or centuries from now.) [0] So says the man himself: "If 386BSD had been available when I started on Linux, Linux would probably never had happened." https://gondwanaland.com/meta/history/interview.html https://gondwanaland.com/meta/history/interview.html
- Redoubts 5y ago
  Well, it could also be like the Manhattan Project. Once you do it, everyone can get nukes.
indy 5y ago
And one of the disasters should be a craze for Bitcoin mining.

Wouldn't that make it available to only one civilization? Should be a shared Wonder all civilizations would benefit from.

Waterluvian 5y ago
The tech tree is researchable by everyone.
- pletnes 5y ago
  Exactly - linux was built only once in real life.
eru 5y ago
Technologies are usually available for everyone to research.
- nicklecompte 5y ago
  I think they mean that when a civ researches (or “builds”) Linux every player in the game should have access to it (but the civ who spent the resources building Linux gets something extra). If Linux was on the tech tree, only the civilizations who researched Linux could use it. That’s not very FOSS! Every civilization who had computers should be able to get Linux once it’s out.
  - throw0101a 5y ago
    > I think they mean that when a civ researches (or “builds”) Linux every player in the game should have access to it (but the civ who spent the resources building Linux gets something extra). Actually that would be an interesting mechanic: to move forward in the tech tree you have to research something, but by researching it you give it all the players. Do you stall your own progress, or take the hit to move forward and float all ships higher by raising the technological tide? How do the devs program the AI countries to make choice(s) in single-player, and what would a human player do? Who blinks first?
    - kibwen 5y ago
      One of the games has something like this. After researching the internet technology (or maybe it's a wonder?), any time any tech has been researched by any two civs, you instantly research the tech for free.
      - eru 5y ago
        The Great Library used to work like this in Civ I.
    - moreira 5y ago
      This isn't new, so we don't need to speculate about it. Older civs had this. Civ IV has the Manhattan Project, and the Apollo Program, both of which enable new stuff for all civilizations, once built (nukes, and space race).
      - throw0101a 5y ago
        I'd be more interested in having something like Irrigation or the Wheel. Perhaps one tech per Era as a 'blocker'. * https://civilization.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_technologies_in_Civ6 https://civilization.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_technologies_in...
    - nicklecompte 5y ago
      In addition to the comments below, I think a way to implement your idea is to have certain technologies automatically shared between trading partners and/or alliances - and also wars. This exists in other 4X games but not really any of the Civ series IIRC. You can trade generic science points but certain technologies and civics could be shared directly by trade and military engagements with foreign powers (wheel, military tactics, currency, printing press, etc).
    - jeffbee 5y ago
      That’s how the fission tech works in some versions of Civ.
nicklecompte 5y ago
Shared wonder is a much better idea - every civilization that researches Computers tech will have operating systems, but only one gets to develop Linux (let’s say it grants a science boost to everyone who finished researching Computers, but a huge culture/diplomacy boost to the civ that actually “built” Linux). Similar to every civ gets a library, but there’s only one Library of Alexandria, etc.
- 1_player 5y ago
  That's the thing. Linux wasn't made by any one culture or country. Linux is a distributed product of the world no one can claim in good conscience. It's not Finnish, nor American, nor by Intel or by Google. It's not even Linus'. It's made by all of its contributors from all over the world. In Civ parlance, whoever gets the Linux Kernel technology gets the same benefit as anybody else. No one is richer or better than the other civilization because of it, everybody is.
  - nicklecompte 5y ago
    It’s a more basic conceptual mistake to say that Linux is a technology on the tech tree alongside Telecommunications / Computers / Wheel / etc. It would be like having “Automobilism” but then later “Lincoln Town Car.” I get what you are saying about Linux being available to all (hence a shared wonder - the boost to the civilization who developed Linux can be interpreted as increased academic prestige, etc). The point is that Linux is a specific product of technology, not a broad area of human tech.
    - skissane 5y ago
      Linux could easily have never existed. At the time Linus got started in 1991, *BSD was tied up in a legal dispute (which was not resolved until 1994), and Minix was only available under a restrictive license (Minix was relicensed BSD in 2000) If either of those legal issues had not existed in 1991, Linus probably would never have started Linux [0], and Linux's place in history would have been assumed by something else – most likely some BSD derivative or a descendant of Minix. (Minix's microkernel architecture, while elegant, has a performance cost. However, Minix could have easily been hacked into a monolithic kernel, which is basically what Apple did to Mach, and Microsoft did with win32k.sys. Or maybe it could have evolved towards a higher performance microkernel architecture, such as is found in L4) In terms of the "technology tree", Linux occupies the place of "leading openly developed FLOSS operating system". If Linux hadn't occupied that place, some other system would have instead. And there is a chance even that one day Linux might be dethroned. (Unlikely to happen any time soon, but maybe some decades or centuries from now.) [0] So says the man himself: "If 386BSD had been available when I started on Linux, Linux would probably never had happened." https://gondwanaland.com/meta/history/interview.html https://gondwanaland.com/meta/history/interview.html
Redoubts 5y ago
Well, it could also be like the Manhattan Project. Once you do it, everyone can get nukes.

indy 5y ago

And one of the disasters should be a craze for Bitcoin mining.