4 ms·

docker desktop is a burning pile of crap. I would not touch this with a 10 ft pole.

by malka 5y ago

Phil-bitplex 5y ago
What is a alternative we can use? My team and I often use Docker images as part of our development process on our desktop machines.
- langitbiru 5y ago
  Podman? https://podman.io/ https://podman.io/
  - rad_gruchalski 5y ago
    On Linux, sure.
    - yrro 5y ago
      Or in WSL!
- starbugs 5y ago
  You can use docker-machine instead.
  - rzzzt 5y ago
    The Docker Toolbox repo is still hanging around, although in archived form: https://github.com/docker/toolbox https://github.com/docker/toolbox With 19.03 it should still be possible to access the public hub, I think.
- the8472 5y ago
  just plain docker in a linux vm? wsl2 if the host is windows.
- capableweb 5y ago
  I think GP is specifically complaining about "Docker Desktop" (the GUI), not "Docker" (the service) itself. Here are some alternative GUIs for managing Docker: https://www.cloudbees.com/blog/docker-guis/ https://www.cloudbees.com/blog/docker-guis/ Otherwise, VMs are usually overlooked as an alternative to "docker images", most probably because many people entered the industry after docker images became popular, and they don't know anything else. If you design it properly, stick with establish technology like QEMU, you can have the same environment without having to touch docker at all.
  - paranoidrobot 5y ago
    VMs are great. I've been using them for work stuff since Hardware virtualisation made it practical to run VMs with little or no performance penalty. That said, swapping from Docker to VMs for things is nowhere near as simple or straightforward. The near-frictionless ability to stand up/tear-down a 'known' good image and configuration, with the ability to swap in/out networking, volume or other environmental configuration is what made Docker so popular. We use Docker containers for a wide range of things, and while we could reproduce all of that as VMs - it would take a lot more effort, and it would introduce a lot more delays waiting to build/replace a VM.
    - yrro 5y ago
      Run docker inside a VM on your desktop. That's what Docker Desktop is doing under the hood, isn't it?
      - paranoidrobot 5y ago
        I was responding to this section: > VMs are usually overlooked as an alternative to "docker images",
  - gravypod 5y ago
    > people entered the industry after docker images became popular I don't think this is the only reason people use docker. Docker let's you compile an artifact and deterministically recreate that artifact at any point. When you want to deploy this artifact everything is hermetically included in it. No network access or startup time. Just starts and it's good. If you have VM tooling that lets me do that without spawning a VM repeatedly and doesn't give me an effective way to modify the FS & copy my programs in (packer) then let me know. I haven't found anything VM related that's simple to use In addition: vms still have a performance hit much more significant than processes.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- prussian 5y ago
  For docker desktop you should be able to manage your own Linux VM install and forward the dockerd socket to your host machine and use the docker tooling with the appropriate DOCKER_HOST environment variable. As far as I remember, that's basically how docker desktop works.
- sn_master 5y ago
  Have you considered fat native binaries with C#/Go? Or is the app too complex with many external resources?
atonse 5y ago
Install docker cli or podman but manage containers inside VS code if that’s your editor.
nickjj 5y ago
Docker Desktop is really good, at least on Windows (I don't have any macOS experience to comment on it there). I've been using DD on Windows since it was available and use it for full time development. On Windows Docker Desktop is really fast, rarely crashes (once every couple of months I'll encounter something strange and restarting it always fixes it), it works seamlessly with WSL 2 and it seems to install and run without issues on a huge array of hardware / software combos. The last one is important and I'm making this claim based on the lack of support questions I get on my Dive into Docker course around installing Docker. Prior to Docker Desktop there were so many reports with Docker Toolbox around installation issues / errors, but now I get almost none related to installation and this is with a pretty big sample size too. It's also a quick way to get a 1 node Kubernetes cluster running on your dev box which works perfectly out of the box, even exposing your services over localhost. Minikube and other solutions still require manual steps to get this behavior and personally I've found there to be a number of installation issues that aren't present with Docker Desktop, all of which were fixable but still required manual intervention to fix.

docker desktop is a burning pile of crap. I would not touch this with a 10 ft pole.

by malka 5y ago

docker desktop is a burning pile of crap. I would not touch this with a 10 ft pole.

What is a alternative we can use? My team and I often use Docker images as part of our development process on our desktop machines.

langitbiru 5y ago
Podman? https://podman.io/ https://podman.io/
- rad_gruchalski 5y ago
  On Linux, sure.
  - yrro 5y ago
    Or in WSL!
starbugs 5y ago
You can use docker-machine instead.
- rzzzt 5y ago
  The Docker Toolbox repo is still hanging around, although in archived form: https://github.com/docker/toolbox https://github.com/docker/toolbox With 19.03 it should still be possible to access the public hub, I think.
the8472 5y ago
just plain docker in a linux vm? wsl2 if the host is windows.
capableweb 5y ago
I think GP is specifically complaining about "Docker Desktop" (the GUI), not "Docker" (the service) itself. Here are some alternative GUIs for managing Docker: https://www.cloudbees.com/blog/docker-guis/ https://www.cloudbees.com/blog/docker-guis/ Otherwise, VMs are usually overlooked as an alternative to "docker images", most probably because many people entered the industry after docker images became popular, and they don't know anything else. If you design it properly, stick with establish technology like QEMU, you can have the same environment without having to touch docker at all.
- paranoidrobot 5y ago
  VMs are great. I've been using them for work stuff since Hardware virtualisation made it practical to run VMs with little or no performance penalty. That said, swapping from Docker to VMs for things is nowhere near as simple or straightforward. The near-frictionless ability to stand up/tear-down a 'known' good image and configuration, with the ability to swap in/out networking, volume or other environmental configuration is what made Docker so popular. We use Docker containers for a wide range of things, and while we could reproduce all of that as VMs - it would take a lot more effort, and it would introduce a lot more delays waiting to build/replace a VM.
  - yrro 5y ago
    Run docker inside a VM on your desktop. That's what Docker Desktop is doing under the hood, isn't it?
    - paranoidrobot 5y ago
      I was responding to this section: > VMs are usually overlooked as an alternative to "docker images",
- gravypod 5y ago
  > people entered the industry after docker images became popular I don't think this is the only reason people use docker. Docker let's you compile an artifact and deterministically recreate that artifact at any point. When you want to deploy this artifact everything is hermetically included in it. No network access or startup time. Just starts and it's good. If you have VM tooling that lets me do that without spawning a VM repeatedly and doesn't give me an effective way to modify the FS & copy my programs in (packer) then let me know. I haven't found anything VM related that's simple to use In addition: vms still have a performance hit much more significant than processes.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
prussian 5y ago
For docker desktop you should be able to manage your own Linux VM install and forward the dockerd socket to your host machine and use the docker tooling with the appropriate DOCKER_HOST environment variable. As far as I remember, that's basically how docker desktop works.
sn_master 5y ago
Have you considered fat native binaries with C#/Go? Or is the app too complex with many external resources?

atonse 5y ago

Install docker cli or podman but manage containers inside VS code if that’s your editor.

nickjj 5y ago

Docker Desktop is really good, at least on Windows (I don't have any macOS experience to comment on it there). I've been using DD on Windows since it was available and use it for full time development. On Windows Docker Desktop is really fast, rarely crashes (once every couple of months I'll encounter something strange and restarting it always fixes it), it works seamlessly with WSL 2 and it seems to install and run without issues on a huge array of hardware / software combos. The last one is important and I'm making this claim based on the lack of support questions I get on my Dive into Docker course around installing Docker. Prior to Docker Desktop there were so many reports with Docker Toolbox around installation issues / errors, but now I get almost none related to installation and this is with a pretty big sample size too. It's also a quick way to get a 1 node Kubernetes cluster running on your dev box which works perfectly out of the box, even exposing your services over localhost. Minikube and other solutions still require manual steps to get this behavior and personally I've found there to be a number of installation issues that aren't present with Docker Desktop, all of which were fixable but still required manual intervention to fix.