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> What’s the meaning of „the Sabbath prohibition against operating electrical devices“? Not executing a physical action? Any action? Intent? My understanding a
by bradrn 5y ago
> What’s the meaning of „the Sabbath prohibition against operating electrical devices“? Not executing a physical action? Any action? Intent?
My understanding as a Jew (though not Orthodox) is that you are forbidden from manually turning electrical devices on and off, and from altering the behaviour of a running device. So if you, say, accidentally turn on a stove just before the Sabbath starts, you then cannot turn it off until the Sabbath ends (or you get a non-Jew to do it for you).
> An elevator that cycles between floors and one that only moves to a floor to pick up a passenger when they wait in front of the door might be indistinguishable from the perspective of the user. Would the difference matter?
IANA rabbi, but I suspect this does indeed matter. In the former case the elevator is just doing the same thing over and over again, while in the latter case the user is actively controlling the elevator.
> What about showing the intent to exit the elevator at a particular floor by e.g. taking a step towards the door of the cabin and having the elevator detect that?
Again, I suspect this would be forbidden.
- lebuffon 5y agoHmmm... Never thought of this before. Does this mean that in future an electric AI shabos goy (gentile assistant for things like the stove problem) could not be Kashrut (Kosher) since giving it commands could close electric circuits?
- TchoBeer 5y agoYeah obviously an electronic shabbat goy is prohibited.
- rtkwe 5y agoFar from a Rabbinic expert but from what I've read it shouldn't be Kosher because you're still initiating the action with the intent of performing something that's otherwise forbidden to do directly, the method of operation for the assistant doesn't really factor in.
- vxNsr 5y agoThere is a discussion about whether you can use Alexa/Siri/HG on Shabbat.
- benchaney 5y agoIs there? Among who? I'm not aware of anyone who keeps Shabbat who uses voice activated electronics.
- bscphil 5y agoOne of the top comments in the article currently is by jedberg, who says in another comment that he went to Hebrew school. He discusses using Alexa as a Shabbat "hack": https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27012719 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27012719
- vxNsr 5y agoGoing to Hebrew school doesn’t make one orthodox.
- benchaney 5y agoFair enough, although not everyone who went to Hebrew school keeps Shabbat. I will say, for the sake of combating misinformation about Judaism, that people who keep Shabbat traditionally, but also use voice activated technology on Shabbat are extremely rare, if they exist at all. I have never heard of someone who actually adheres to this practice despite living in a community that is on the extreme liberal end of Shabbat observant Jews[0]. [0] Which is where you would expect this to happen if it actually did.
- vxNsr 5y agoI think the consensus is “no” but there is a discussion bec it’s closer to hinting at something than doing it directly.
- benchaney 5y agoI ask again, discussion among who? If someone reading this keeps Shabbat traditionally and uses voice activated technology on Shabbat (or knows someone who does), please speak up. I would like to hear about your practice. Otherwise, I would prefer to avoid giving the impression that this is a position that anyone holds. There is far too much misinformation present in this thread already.