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Management took a stance against the employees. Management cancelled their employees, removing their platform to talk about internal politics. Framing this as

Management took a stance against the employees. Management cancelled their employees, removing their platform to talk about internal politics. Framing this as 'these people' vs Basecamp is ludicrous. It's 1/3 or more of Basecamp vs. Basecamp's management. Important people in important roles, entire teams. They are this company. Or were.

dragonwriter 5y ago
“Basecamp”. Bandcamp is…a different thing.
- gifnamething 5y ago
  Thanks
systemvoltage 5y ago
> Management cancelled their employees, removing their platform to talk about internal politics Good. What exactly is the problem here?
- gifnamething 5y ago
  How can you not talk about politics at work? What happens if you want to discuss a disputed nation? I hope TSMC isn't a supplier. Banning politics is impossible because everything in life has some hand in politics. When they say it can't be discussed, in the context of what is being discussed, it's really just a ban on the topics that management don't want to discuss.
  - systemvoltage 5y ago
    Talking about potitics often comes with intolerance of other people's views, belittleling of their opinions, castigation of their stance, and outright disrespect if not silencing their words by bundleling it with a larger political movement or ideology. You might be tolerant but many people aren't.
  - bongobingo 5y ago
    > What happens if you want to discuss a disputed nation? You don’t? > Banning politics is impossible because everything in life has some hand in politics. Hard disagree. You can talk about how houses are too expensive right now without someone getting political about why. It’s simple. Just don’t get political.
    - lcw 5y ago
      If you are an international company you have to discuss these things. You literally have to discuss them for legal risk reasons, but us for cultural reasons. For instance, if you are a US company do you honor Crimea as a Russian territory... A lot of companies avoid working with the region altogether because of their acknowledgement of politics. Another example is if you are a US company do you work with China knowing you will have to share your Chinese users data with the Chinese government. These are political and moral conversations that are decisions that should align with the companies values thus they HAVE to be discussed. It's delusional to think you can avoid personal politics completely in a business. Basecamp is picking and choosing what is appropriate, and that's really the issue. It's an emotional response from their employees based on inconsistent behavior of management.
      - bongobingo 5y ago
        Hey guess what we're doing right now? We're discussing the issues of Crimea, Russia, and China... and we aren't getting political about it. Incredible. Maybe impossible? >If you are an international company you have to discuss these things No, you don't. These are business discussions. You discuss the issue, not the politics behind it. You do it professionally because you are a professional adult making business decisions. You leave the politics of it for Twitter on your own free time. >It's delusional to think you can avoid personal politics completely in a business. It's delusional and absurd to think that you need to bring politics into any discussion at work.
        lcw 5y ago
        I don't understand the nuance of what you are saying. Focusing on the political issues is inherently political. One of the most common phrases you hear from a politician is "let's get back to talking about the issues." Yes they are business decisions but they are also political. If you choose to work with a country or not. It's not based on money alone, but also your leadership's values that are guided by their political compass. These aren't algorithmically driven decisions. These are human beings coming from diverse backgrounds making political decisions for how to increase the power of their company on the world in a way that that they can live with from a morality perspective and at the same time trying not to alienate their employees. I don't understand how this isn't political in nature.
  - kjakm 5y ago
    >> How can you not talk about politics at work? In my experience politics, religion, and money are all generally regarded as off topic among anyone but close friends and family. Unless any of the three specifically effect your business directly (or a member of staff is being illegally discriminated against because of their personal beliefs) I don’t see how you feel like you can’t work without discussing them.
coldtea 5y ago
>Management took a stance against the employees. Management took a stance. "Against the employees" is a reading, not a fact. As I see it, there was nothing against the employees in the stance. >Management cancelled their employees, removing their platform to talk about internal politics. Because other companies have such a thing? Or because it wasn't being abused to talk about BS (genocide accusations, and such).
nailer 5y ago
They took a stance against bad behaviour by some employees. No stance was taken against employees.
wreath 5y ago
> removing their platform to talk about internal politics. And they are not entitled for it. They were encourage to do it elsewhere on their own dime and time, not the company's. Do these employees not know what are they hired for exactly?

dragonwriter 5y ago

“Basecamp”. Bandcamp is…a different thing.

gifnamething 5y ago
Thanks

systemvoltage 5y ago

> Management cancelled their employees, removing their platform to talk about internal politics Good. What exactly is the problem here?

gifnamething 5y ago
How can you not talk about politics at work? What happens if you want to discuss a disputed nation? I hope TSMC isn't a supplier. Banning politics is impossible because everything in life has some hand in politics. When they say it can't be discussed, in the context of what is being discussed, it's really just a ban on the topics that management don't want to discuss.
- systemvoltage 5y ago
  Talking about potitics often comes with intolerance of other people's views, belittleling of their opinions, castigation of their stance, and outright disrespect if not silencing their words by bundleling it with a larger political movement or ideology. You might be tolerant but many people aren't.
- bongobingo 5y ago
  > What happens if you want to discuss a disputed nation? You don’t? > Banning politics is impossible because everything in life has some hand in politics. Hard disagree. You can talk about how houses are too expensive right now without someone getting political about why. It’s simple. Just don’t get political.
  - lcw 5y ago
    If you are an international company you have to discuss these things. You literally have to discuss them for legal risk reasons, but us for cultural reasons. For instance, if you are a US company do you honor Crimea as a Russian territory... A lot of companies avoid working with the region altogether because of their acknowledgement of politics. Another example is if you are a US company do you work with China knowing you will have to share your Chinese users data with the Chinese government. These are political and moral conversations that are decisions that should align with the companies values thus they HAVE to be discussed. It's delusional to think you can avoid personal politics completely in a business. Basecamp is picking and choosing what is appropriate, and that's really the issue. It's an emotional response from their employees based on inconsistent behavior of management.
    - bongobingo 5y ago
      Hey guess what we're doing right now? We're discussing the issues of Crimea, Russia, and China... and we aren't getting political about it. Incredible. Maybe impossible? >If you are an international company you have to discuss these things No, you don't. These are business discussions. You discuss the issue, not the politics behind it. You do it professionally because you are a professional adult making business decisions. You leave the politics of it for Twitter on your own free time. >It's delusional to think you can avoid personal politics completely in a business. It's delusional and absurd to think that you need to bring politics into any discussion at work.
      - lcw 5y ago
        I don't understand the nuance of what you are saying. Focusing on the political issues is inherently political. One of the most common phrases you hear from a politician is "let's get back to talking about the issues." Yes they are business decisions but they are also political. If you choose to work with a country or not. It's not based on money alone, but also your leadership's values that are guided by their political compass. These aren't algorithmically driven decisions. These are human beings coming from diverse backgrounds making political decisions for how to increase the power of their company on the world in a way that that they can live with from a morality perspective and at the same time trying not to alienate their employees. I don't understand how this isn't political in nature.
- kjakm 5y ago
  >> How can you not talk about politics at work? In my experience politics, religion, and money are all generally regarded as off topic among anyone but close friends and family. Unless any of the three specifically effect your business directly (or a member of staff is being illegally discriminated against because of their personal beliefs) I don’t see how you feel like you can’t work without discussing them.

coldtea 5y ago

>Management took a stance against the employees. Management took a stance. "Against the employees" is a reading, not a fact. As I see it, there was nothing against the employees in the stance. >Management cancelled their employees, removing their platform to talk about internal politics. Because other companies have such a thing? Or because it wasn't being abused to talk about BS (genocide accusations, and such).

nailer 5y ago

They took a stance against bad behaviour by some employees. No stance was taken against employees.

wreath 5y ago

> removing their platform to talk about internal politics. And they are not entitled for it. They were encourage to do it elsewhere on their own dime and time, not the company's. Do these employees not know what are they hired for exactly?