9 ms·

You’re describing the effects of imperialism on the working class of the imperialist countries, a point we communists make all the time. It absolutely is a lef

by lucian1900 5y ago

You’re describing the effects of imperialism on the working class of the imperialist countries, a point we communists make all the time. It absolutely is a left/right thing, it’s just that the imperialist countries have largely managed to exclude politics left of centre.

motohagiography 5y ago
Imperialism is bunk and an artifact of a movement predicated on deception, so, there's that. I think the whole critical theory basically lets itself out on reasonable discourse.
- lucian1900 5y ago
  Lenin’s work more than a century ago is very much still relevant today. If you haven’t read it, give it a try https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1916/imp-hsc/ https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1916/imp-hsc/
parineum 5y ago
Would a communist United States not trade with China?
- lucian1900 5y ago
  Currently, US capitalists exploit workers both in the US and in poorer countries, with the later being super-exploited. Under this arrangement, the vast majority of the value created by both groups of workers is captured by a handful of capitalists. A socialist US would cease exploiting other countries (including China) and instead pursue mutually beneficial trade (much like China does). This would likely include some amount of reparations and re-building of local industry, easily funded with the vast amount of value no longer stolen from all workers.
  - IdiocyInAction 5y ago
    Exploitation that ultimately helped lift a billion people out of poverty in China. A socialist US would probably, like most prior countries that called themselves socialist, be a poor, oppressive hellhole.
    - lucian1900 5y ago
      Poverty has decreased in China in spite of US imperialism, not because of it. Most notably, poor capitalist countries have had poverty increase in the past several decades instead. All countries that have had a successful socialist revolution so far were oppressed impoverished ones. They all then went on to develop very quickly, in spite of constant attack from the imperialist countries. An already-developed former imperialist country would face no such challenges.
      - parineum 5y ago
        China lifted itself out of poverty when it became a capitalist, dictatorial oligarchy.
        lucian1900 5y ago
        No. It was only allowed to develop after making deep concessions to imperialism, including special economic areas where capitalism is allowed. Thankfully the working class is still in control of the state, as we’ve seen the limits on capitalism tightened recently, especially during covid.
        parineum 5y ago
        You think the working class is in control of China? The working class that has nets installed in their job provided dormatories because too many of them are commiting suicide? Those people are nearly slaves.
        5y ago

motohagiography 5y ago

Imperialism is bunk and an artifact of a movement predicated on deception, so, there's that. I think the whole critical theory basically lets itself out on reasonable discourse.

lucian1900 5y ago
Lenin’s work more than a century ago is very much still relevant today. If you haven’t read it, give it a try https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1916/imp-hsc/ https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1916/imp-hsc/

parineum 5y ago

Would a communist United States not trade with China?

lucian1900 5y ago
Currently, US capitalists exploit workers both in the US and in poorer countries, with the later being super-exploited. Under this arrangement, the vast majority of the value created by both groups of workers is captured by a handful of capitalists. A socialist US would cease exploiting other countries (including China) and instead pursue mutually beneficial trade (much like China does). This would likely include some amount of reparations and re-building of local industry, easily funded with the vast amount of value no longer stolen from all workers.
- IdiocyInAction 5y ago
  Exploitation that ultimately helped lift a billion people out of poverty in China. A socialist US would probably, like most prior countries that called themselves socialist, be a poor, oppressive hellhole.
  - lucian1900 5y ago
    Poverty has decreased in China in spite of US imperialism, not because of it. Most notably, poor capitalist countries have had poverty increase in the past several decades instead. All countries that have had a successful socialist revolution so far were oppressed impoverished ones. They all then went on to develop very quickly, in spite of constant attack from the imperialist countries. An already-developed former imperialist country would face no such challenges.
    - parineum 5y ago
      China lifted itself out of poverty when it became a capitalist, dictatorial oligarchy.
      - lucian1900 5y ago
        No. It was only allowed to develop after making deep concessions to imperialism, including special economic areas where capitalism is allowed. Thankfully the working class is still in control of the state, as we’ve seen the limits on capitalism tightened recently, especially during covid.
        parineum 5y ago
        You think the working class is in control of China? The working class that has nets installed in their job provided dormatories because too many of them are commiting suicide? Those people are nearly slaves.
        5y ago