4 ms·

I disagree. Not everyone needs a livable wage (e.g. teenagers) and by removing entry level positions we eliminate the lowest rung of the ladder. This is not a

by qudat 5y ago

I disagree. Not everyone needs a livable wage (e.g. teenagers) and by removing entry level positions we eliminate the lowest rung of the ladder. This is not a good outcome.

riskable 5y ago
...but imagine the economic benefits of giving teenagers a living wage. People who have loads of extra money to spend on unnecessary items (because presumably they're not paying for the bare necessities like food and housing). <Gasp! Some might even save some of that extra money for use in the future!>
- oh_sigh 5y ago
  But they already get a living wage, since for almost all working teenagers, their biggest expenses are usually taken care of by their parents (rent & health insurance).
pydry 5y ago
Not a good outcome for employers. Good for everyone else.
- gruez 5y ago
  Where do you think the employers get the money from?
  - pydry 5y ago
    Customers?
    - gruez 5y ago
      That's the point. Absent any competition (which there won't be, because everyone is subject to the same minimum wage), the cost is fully passed on to the customers (ie. "everyone else"). Therefore your conclusion is incorrect.
      - pydry 5y ago
        How is that the point? The studies I've seen tend to say that minimum wage hikes tend to come from profits. E.g. https://www.econstor.eu/bitstream/10419/203233/1/1667730924.pdf https://www.econstor.eu/bitstream/10419/203233/1/1667730924....
        gruez 5y ago
        In the short term or long term? I skimmed the study and it looks like they only looked at two years? In the short term I can see it happening due to psychological effects like price stickiness, but I'm skeptical that in the long term the trend would hold. As evidence to the contrary: >Ashenfelter says the evidence from increased food prices suggests that basically all of the "increase of labor costs gets passed right on to the customers." https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2021/02/16/967333964/what-mcdonalds-shows-about-the-minimum-wage https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2021/02/16/967333964/what...
        pydry 5y ago
        >In the short term or long term? Wasnt transfer from profits supposed to be impossible in both cases because of competition?
        gruez 5y ago
        Are you talking about how profits shouldn't exist because of competition?
        pydry 5y ago
        I'm talking about your claim that the cost of raised wages would be inevitably passed on to consumers. I'm sure there's a good reason why employers lobby so hard to keep wages down even when it doesn't affect them in the slightest cos they can just pass the costs on...
        5y ago
kesselvon 5y ago
Why create an incentive to exploit teenagers for profit? Work is work, regardless of if the person being paid is 18 or 81. You're paying for output.
cratermoon 5y ago
Unless they want to save money for college. Remember when you could work an entry level job and make enough money to pay for a substantial portion of college?

by qudat 5y ago

I disagree. Not everyone needs a livable wage (e.g. teenagers) and by removing entry level positions we eliminate the lowest rung of the ladder. This is not a good outcome.

riskable 5y ago

...but imagine the economic benefits of giving teenagers a living wage. People who have loads of extra money to spend on unnecessary items (because presumably they're not paying for the bare necessities like food and housing). <Gasp! Some might even save some of that extra money for use in the future!>

oh_sigh 5y ago
But they already get a living wage, since for almost all working teenagers, their biggest expenses are usually taken care of by their parents (rent & health insurance).

pydry 5y ago

Not a good outcome for employers. Good for everyone else.

gruez 5y ago
Where do you think the employers get the money from?
- pydry 5y ago
  Customers?
  - gruez 5y ago
    That's the point. Absent any competition (which there won't be, because everyone is subject to the same minimum wage), the cost is fully passed on to the customers (ie. "everyone else"). Therefore your conclusion is incorrect.
    - pydry 5y ago
      How is that the point? The studies I've seen tend to say that minimum wage hikes tend to come from profits. E.g. https://www.econstor.eu/bitstream/10419/203233/1/1667730924.pdf https://www.econstor.eu/bitstream/10419/203233/1/1667730924....
      - gruez 5y ago
        In the short term or long term? I skimmed the study and it looks like they only looked at two years? In the short term I can see it happening due to psychological effects like price stickiness, but I'm skeptical that in the long term the trend would hold. As evidence to the contrary: >Ashenfelter says the evidence from increased food prices suggests that basically all of the "increase of labor costs gets passed right on to the customers." https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2021/02/16/967333964/what-mcdonalds-shows-about-the-minimum-wage https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2021/02/16/967333964/what...
        pydry 5y ago
        >In the short term or long term? Wasnt transfer from profits supposed to be impossible in both cases because of competition?
        gruez 5y ago
        Are you talking about how profits shouldn't exist because of competition?
        pydry 5y ago
        I'm talking about your claim that the cost of raised wages would be inevitably passed on to consumers. I'm sure there's a good reason why employers lobby so hard to keep wages down even when it doesn't affect them in the slightest cos they can just pass the costs on...
        5y ago

kesselvon 5y ago

Why create an incentive to exploit teenagers for profit? Work is work, regardless of if the person being paid is 18 or 81. You're paying for output.

cratermoon 5y ago

Unless they want to save money for college. Remember when you could work an entry level job and make enough money to pay for a substantial portion of college?